150K civilians died just taking that small island not to mention over 100K Japanese soldiers and almost 13K US deaths. On the main land things would have been worse. The Japanese military might have been less willing to through their own civilians lives away but that id doubtful. Some estimates actually go as high as 5-6 million civilian deaths with an invasion.
There really is no logic to the argument that we would have killed less people by not using the bomb. We would not have only used planes but we would have brought our ships in close and there would have been massive naval bombardments of their cities. We would have blockaded all their ports and blown up their rail lines so there would have wide spread starvation. The Japanese military typically took upwards of 90% fatalities in defeats and had already lost over 3 million troops. I think the estimates may have been low if anything.
There really is no logic to the argument that we would have killed less people by not using the bomb. We would not have only used planes but we would have brought our ships in close and there would have been massive naval bombardments of their cities. We would have blockaded all their ports and blown up their rail lines so there would have wide spread starvation. The Japanese military typically took upwards of 90% fatalities in defeats and had already lost over 3 million troops. I think the estimates may have been low if anything.
Most people don't look at the facts; it's easier to just say, "America bad111" than look at how much worse the fascist governments were (particularly when it's so hard for many to imagine modern Japan as a belligerent military power. ) There's a reason the bomb was necessary; the Japanese people were thoroughly indoctrinated with the belief defeat was IMPOSSIBLE, and the fact is history was on their side. Any short term sacrifices for the sake of the final inevitable victory were acceptable, noble, and they didn't have the first hand experience with the Great War to argue otherwise. The biggest proof of that is that we WERE conducting naval bombardment of their cities, had been for about a year since we won the carrier war and bottled up an IJN that knew it didn't dare leave port or it would get, well, the Battle of Leyte. Halsey raked the 7th fleet down the coast every night, but it didn't induce surrender. Only two things could've done that: A brutal house to house invasion, or the bomb. Everyone agrees the atomic bomb is an incredibly destructive weapon, but if less would've sufficed, why didn't Japan surrender after the FIRST one...?
Russia was also going to invade so a part of Japan would have fallen under their control so there was that added bonus. If Truman had refused to use the bomb and 400-10000 American soldiers had died as a consequence he would have been impeached and the democratic party would have dissolved.
I think that might be overstating things a touch, if only because the Manhattan Project wasn't exactly common knowledge before the bomb was used.
Honorbound and honored to be Bonded to Mahtaliel Sedai
Last First in wotmania Chat
Slightly better than chocolate.
Love still can't be coerced.
Please Don't Eat the Newbies!
LoL. Be well, RAFOlk.
Last First in wotmania Chat
Slightly better than chocolate.
Love still can't be coerced.
Please Don't Eat the Newbies!

LoL. Be well, RAFOlk.
This will be controversial in the extreme, I expect -
- 04/03/2010 09:01:16 PM
381 Views
Fascinating is the word.
- 04/03/2010 09:09:21 PM
190 Views
Re: Fascinating is the word.
- 04/03/2010 09:53:26 PM
176 Views
An interesting tidbit
- 04/03/2010 10:02:32 PM
176 Views
Makes sense; I've always heard invasion casualty estimates were 3 million dead.
- 04/03/2010 10:40:11 PM
171 Views
That estimate sounds like what they told us. Not 100% on it though. *NM*
- 04/03/2010 10:54:35 PM
55 Views
Look at the casulities just from Okinawa and you can get an idea of what would have happened
- 04/03/2010 11:43:00 PM
175 Views
Agreed.
- 05/03/2010 01:14:13 AM
166 Views
I'm not sure why it should be controversial. It was a great insight and one man's opinion.
- 04/03/2010 09:26:19 PM
196 Views
