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Mostly regarding being tricked Camilla Send a noteboard - 08/06/2010 08:47:56 AM
I think the thing that annoys me most about Fight Club and about this book is that, as a relatively intelligent person with somewhat of an ego about at least that thing, I'm not particularly fond of being made to feel stupid. I'm not really particularly perceptive or anything in terms of interpersonal relationships, so if I fail to grasp the subtle hints in someone's behaviour that make some secret clear as day to some others, it doesn't bother me much. But stuff like this is pretty much that, only put into a book, which bugs me because a book ought to be a level playing field - it's all in the text and we all read the same words.


My reaction to being tricked was the complete opposite, and I always thought everyone loved that. I mean, that is pretty much the foundation for my thesis. Shit.

Dickens actually told Collins, when the latter was writing The Moonstone, I think, that the public doesn't like to be tricked. I always thought Dickens had profoundly misunderstood something. Perhaps he hadn't. I am intrigued.

This is really turning more into an auto-psycho-analysis than a discussion of the merits of the book, isn't it? Okay, moving on now...

As a thrilling adventure ride, the book was lots of fun, only spoiled in the latter half by my stubborn refusal to accept the plot twist - as a result, I dare say I cared less about the actual dénouement than I should have done, because I kept hoping for a different kind of dénouement that never came. Still, a number of enjoyable action scenes, and I liked the lesser plot twists, although the way the protagonist defeats the bad guy at the end struck me as rather exaggerated.

The humour was good, often made me smile, occasionally laugh out loud.

The political-social messages of the book, hm, mixed bag there. As a war satire, it worked, and in a rather convoluted sort of way, perhaps too as a war warning. But the heavy-handed way of attacking the World Bank or similar organizations, and corporations in general... that became too preachy for me. Particularly the part where Addeh Katir gets a loan they never asked for, doesn't spend it and then has to pay back more than they have - I'm not sure why he didn't go for an at least marginally realistic situation, exaggerated for comic/satiric/critical effect, to be sure, but at least not completely nonsensical.


I don't know, I suspect that would have made the book too dark. It needed a thoroughly absurd place for Zaher Bey and their group to be able to exist at all. Horror needs contrast (certainly in this type of book, if it has a type), and fully fledged tragedy would have made the whole middle part unbearable, I think. And I am not just saying that in order to defend the book at any price.
*MySmiley*
structured procrastinator
This message last edited by Camilla on 08/06/2010 at 08:51:30 AM
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June Book Club: The Gone-Away World by Nick Harkaway Rebekah - 07/06/2010 06:09:34 PM 1362 Views
What did you think? Love, hate, etc? *NM* Rebekah - 07/06/2010 06:10:02 PM 460 Views
For the most part, and closer to the end I really liked it. Beqi - 07/06/2010 07:05:38 PM 908 Views
Re: For the most part, and closer to the end I really liked it. Camilla - 07/06/2010 07:07:49 PM 872 Views
No surprises here, I suppose. Camilla - 07/06/2010 07:05:47 PM 930 Views
I enjoyed his flow. everynametaken - 08/06/2010 04:55:49 AM 716 Views
Re: I enjoyed his flow. Camilla - 15/06/2010 02:30:07 PM 867 Views
I haven't bothered re-reading it yet Larry - 07/06/2010 09:12:58 PM 898 Views
Neither. Good, but not that deep, and with some annoying things. Legolas - 07/06/2010 10:29:18 PM 826 Views
Mostly regarding being tricked Camilla - 08/06/2010 08:47:56 AM 1028 Views
*lol* Don't give up on your thesis just yet. Legolas - 08/06/2010 09:20:16 AM 938 Views
Re: *lol* Don't give up on your thesis just yet. Camilla - 08/06/2010 12:54:53 PM 861 Views
Why am I not surprised. *NM* Legolas - 08/06/2010 01:07:47 PM 447 Views
Re: Mostly regarding being tricked Rebekah - 08/06/2010 01:42:31 PM 825 Views
Re: Mostly regarding being tricked Camilla - 08/06/2010 01:43:22 PM 930 Views
Love? More like enjoyed it a lot. everynametaken - 08/06/2010 04:45:24 AM 935 Views
I'm mostly ambivalent. Rebekah - 08/06/2010 01:52:31 PM 982 Views
Re: I'm mostly ambivalent. Camilla - 15/06/2010 03:07:55 PM 850 Views
Re: I am linking to my review, because I am self-centred like that. But I am not a fan. Danae al'Thor - 09/06/2010 11:47:16 AM 960 Views
Is it successful as a satire? Rebekah - 07/06/2010 06:11:11 PM 751 Views
Yes, as long as we are clear on one thing: that is not all it does. Camilla - 07/06/2010 08:29:59 PM 877 Views
I'd say so, yes. Legolas - 07/06/2010 11:05:35 PM 771 Views
Partially. Rebekah - 08/06/2010 01:58:19 PM 897 Views
Re: Actually, the IMF loan thing worked better for me. Danae al'Thor - 09/06/2010 11:50:36 AM 984 Views
But right up to the point where they're given one they don't want, and the interest thing, etc? Rebekah - 12/06/2010 01:21:11 PM 846 Views
Characters: Rebekah - 07/06/2010 06:12:29 PM 948 Views
Ninjas! Beqi - 07/06/2010 07:11:02 PM 799 Views
After the introduction in chapter one... ironclad - 07/06/2010 07:31:48 PM 931 Views
One of my favourite things about this book. *spoilers* (do we need to mark spoilers here?) Camilla - 07/06/2010 07:58:36 PM 1076 Views
No. You don't need to mark spoilers. *NM* Rebekah - 07/06/2010 08:55:03 PM 463 Views
I disliked everyone except Master Wu. Rebekah - 08/06/2010 01:59:27 PM 846 Views
Re: Characters: everynametaken - 09/06/2010 03:03:40 AM 1127 Views
Re: Characters: Camilla - 15/06/2010 02:56:01 PM 785 Views
Re: I really disliked how many GROUPS there were. Danae al'Thor - 09/06/2010 11:59:33 AM 844 Views
Quite. They were all pretty much ciphers. *NM* Rebekah - 12/06/2010 01:26:13 PM 364 Views
The BIG twist: Rebekah - 07/06/2010 06:13:38 PM 913 Views
Not such a surprise Beqi - 07/06/2010 07:01:24 PM 885 Views
Re: Not such a surprise everynametaken - 08/06/2010 05:13:02 AM 874 Views
The parents thing confused me too. Legolas - 08/06/2010 08:16:29 AM 932 Views
My first reaction was to be a little pissed off ironclad - 07/06/2010 07:23:09 PM 787 Views
Apparently I was the only person who did not see it coming *spoilers* Camilla - 07/06/2010 08:51:01 PM 936 Views
Don't worry, Tim didn't either. *NM* Rebekah - 07/06/2010 08:52:43 PM 446 Views
It annoyed me in Fight Club, and it annoyed me here. Legolas - 07/06/2010 10:06:17 PM 1005 Views
Yeah, annoyed me too. Rebekah - 08/06/2010 02:02:43 PM 964 Views
Well... everynametaken - 08/06/2010 05:10:56 AM 875 Views
Re: Well... Camilla - 08/06/2010 08:58:26 AM 946 Views
Re: I guessed it in the second chapter. Danae al'Thor - 09/06/2010 12:00:49 PM 869 Views
I clearly need to reread Thief of Time. Rebekah - 13/06/2010 06:07:28 PM 713 Views
Re: Spoiler for Thief of Time : Danae al'Thor - 14/06/2010 08:27:33 AM 880 Views
Hm. I vaguely remember that stuff. Rebekah - 14/06/2010 05:52:16 PM 764 Views
Re: Hm. I vaguely remember that stuff. Camilla - 15/06/2010 02:47:05 PM 848 Views
Ideas Rebekah - 07/06/2010 06:15:25 PM 911 Views
Re: Ideas ironclad - 07/06/2010 07:29:51 PM 753 Views
Re: Ideas Camilla - 08/06/2010 12:41:31 PM 785 Views
Re: Ideas Rebekah - 08/06/2010 02:09:08 PM 836 Views
Re: I agree with you, and I think it is one of the drawbacks of the novel. Danae al'Thor - 09/06/2010 12:07:51 PM 801 Views
Re: I agree with you, and I think it is one of the drawbacks of the novel. Camilla - 09/06/2010 06:26:20 PM 850 Views
Re: I think you tend to read something and then decide that it is not fit for the genre it is trying Danae al'Thor - 10/06/2010 09:23:29 AM 677 Views
I think you have misunderstood. Camilla - 15/06/2010 02:31:42 PM 862 Views
The New People Rebekah - 07/06/2010 07:32:46 PM 912 Views
I know how I would have reacted in real life Camilla - 08/06/2010 01:20:04 PM 834 Views
Agreed. *NM* Rebekah - 08/06/2010 02:09:39 PM 359 Views
Re: I would have been one of those awkward hypocrites who tried to be cool with it. Danae al'Thor - 09/06/2010 12:11:51 PM 808 Views
I kind of wish I would. Camilla - 15/06/2010 02:33:25 PM 771 Views
The first chapter Camilla - 07/06/2010 09:01:13 PM 964 Views
Liked it. ironclad - 07/06/2010 09:21:50 PM 970 Views
I was warned beforehand about the endless flashback. Legolas - 07/06/2010 11:16:03 PM 953 Views
Re: I was warned beforehand about the endless flashback. Camilla - 08/06/2010 08:37:30 AM 703 Views
My Take. everynametaken - 08/06/2010 05:27:32 AM 882 Views
Re: My take. Camilla - 08/06/2010 08:51:13 AM 771 Views
That's a good point. I think you might be right. Rebekah - 13/06/2010 06:11:27 PM 640 Views
Favourite scenes Camilla - 08/06/2010 01:31:57 PM 858 Views
re: mimes and the Voiceless Dragon (and other scenes) everynametaken - 09/06/2010 02:39:48 AM 827 Views
Re: re: mimes and the Voiceless Dragon (and other scenes) Camilla - 09/06/2010 09:27:06 AM 853 Views
What I liked. Rebekah - 13/06/2010 06:14:40 PM 792 Views
There were a few of those, yeah. Legolas - 13/06/2010 10:46:27 PM 857 Views
Re: There were a few of those, yeah. Camilla - 15/06/2010 02:35:50 PM 745 Views
Re: Ninjas vs. Pirates: Your inner geek votes for? Danae al'Thor - 09/06/2010 12:05:22 PM 903 Views
Pirates. Everytime. Rebekah - 12/06/2010 01:29:01 PM 822 Views
Re: Pirates. Everytime. Camilla - 15/06/2010 02:40:45 PM 791 Views
I don't consider the pirates thing to be a "pattern" Rebekah - 15/06/2010 02:52:46 PM 790 Views
Oh, but that is just the thing: it is. Camilla - 15/06/2010 03:16:26 PM 762 Views
I suspect our differing opinions on what is and isn't a pattern might make this discussion fail. Rebekah - 17/06/2010 06:19:11 PM 834 Views
My inner geek normally goes with ninjas, but not in this book. Camilla - 15/06/2010 02:38:26 PM 782 Views
A question I had while reading the book - was this meant to be set in Britain, the US, or some mix? Legolas - 13/06/2010 10:53:03 PM 746 Views
Yeah it drove me nuts that I had no clue where it's set *NM* ironclad - 14/06/2010 03:34:13 PM 339 Views
It mostly feels like Britain, but with US overtones. Rebekah - 14/06/2010 05:51:35 PM 780 Views
I had the same confusion Camilla - 15/06/2010 02:45:40 PM 953 Views
You've not got it quite right. We are able to distinguish between a truck and a lorry. Tim - 20/06/2010 11:09:51 PM 1030 Views
The other people in the airfield pond Camilla - 15/06/2010 03:04:01 PM 1061 Views
Re: The gasmasked person Mark - 17/06/2010 03:47:55 PM 873 Views
See, that was my first thought as well Camilla - 17/06/2010 04:11:45 PM 920 Views
They were scary. Rebekah - 17/06/2010 06:25:59 PM 820 Views
Re: They were scary. Camilla - 17/06/2010 09:12:54 PM 874 Views
Ah, well found. Rebekah - 17/06/2010 09:17:24 PM 754 Views
The use of tense Mark - 17/06/2010 03:55:01 PM 842 Views
This is a tendency I have noticed in a lot of contemporary literature Camilla - 17/06/2010 08:54:55 PM 1157 Views
I've noticed it once or twice Mark - 18/06/2010 10:13:18 AM 909 Views
Re: I've noticed it once or twice Camilla - 18/06/2010 10:16:58 AM 1196 Views
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