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What Floffe said. Legolas Send a noteboard - 29/09/2009 07:31:51 PM

The opposite of "progressive" would be more like "traditional. " Regardless, I don't think a move in the direction of the failed laissez-faire policies of Dickensian Europe or Carnegies America constitute "progress" and IIRC the "progressive" movements of the time (in particular Americas Progressive Party) stood in strong opposition to them and for labor reform and rights. Seems like revisionist history to me, and it seems there's been a lot of it the past few decades, perhaps in the hopes that now that everyone who lived through those horrors is dead the rest of us will ignorantly allow their reanimation as "innovation. "

The entire point of both "progressive" and "conservative" in their most basic meaning is that they are relative concepts. As I said, "conservative" means resisting change, but depending on the current situation in one's country or society, two conservatives of different times or places can be defending entirely different things. Same with "progressive". Of course the meaning of all political terms changes somewhat over time, but at least words like "socialist" and "liberal" stand for certain fixed ideas, even if the practical realization of those ideas varies a lot. That cannot be said of "conservative" or "progressive" in their basic meanings, even if the US has given "conservative" a more specific meaning.

Other than that, it's fairly hilarious to talk about "a move in the direction of Dickensian Europe or Carnegies America" when discussing the FDP. Sure, it's a liberal party, but by American standards, it might as well be, er, liberal. ;)
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First Germany, next Great Britain - - 27/09/2009 11:24:48 PM 771 Views
Your terminology is confusing... - 27/09/2009 11:40:38 PM 468 Views
He's speaking in American terms. - 28/09/2009 12:42:57 AM 485 Views
As I said. Confusing terminology. - 28/09/2009 11:32:46 AM 537 Views
"Conservative" and "liberal" seem like perfect antonyms to me. - 29/09/2009 05:22:36 PM 542 Views
That'd be because you are american - 29/09/2009 07:13:09 PM 424 Views
What Floffe said. - 29/09/2009 07:31:51 PM 504 Views
I disagree - 29/09/2009 09:25:37 PM 356 Views
Sorry, do you think Labour is a liberal party? *NM* - 27/09/2009 11:42:26 PM 235 Views
Yes I do. Left-wing Liberals, the very worst of both worlds. *NM* - 27/09/2009 11:58:24 PM 258 Views
Ooo, Germany- - 28/09/2009 12:19:40 AM 511 Views
Edumacate yourself! - 28/09/2009 12:39:09 AM 459 Views
Well - 28/09/2009 08:42:29 AM 483 Views
wtf - 28/09/2009 01:26:18 PM 614 Views
I know, I know - 28/09/2009 09:01:17 PM 333 Views
I've got something for your cuteness list - 29/09/2009 08:35:30 AM 496 Views
Awww, let's hug him! - 29/09/2009 06:26:44 PM 353 Views
Him?? - 29/09/2009 08:55:03 PM 409 Views
Well, he's the one with the cute last name! - 29/09/2009 09:24:34 PM 340 Views
I am more thinking we will have to spray you with a riot hose *NM* - 29/09/2009 09:27:10 PM 191 Views
Thats...uh.....crazy talk *NM* - 29/09/2009 09:32:14 PM 230 Views
Is it really? - 29/09/2009 09:33:32 PM 454 Views
Re: Is it really? - 29/09/2009 09:35:48 PM 355 Views
For some reason, I read that as "spay you"... - 29/09/2009 10:24:20 PM 519 Views
Owie *NM* - 29/09/2009 10:32:37 PM 254 Views
For an older gentleman, Guido Westerwelle isn't so bad looking - 29/09/2009 03:20:17 PM 455 Views
He's handsome, if a bit bland-looking - 29/09/2009 06:19:33 PM 355 Views
We still like you, we just don't want to do you - 29/09/2009 06:25:09 PM 353 Views
You only say that because he is gay - 29/09/2009 08:57:13 PM 350 Views
Also what I read about the fdp in summary - 29/09/2009 09:18:11 PM 300 Views
you're such a complete sheep. *NM* - 28/09/2009 02:18:14 AM 305 Views
It doesn't make that much of a difference who is in charge anyway - 28/09/2009 08:41:55 AM 418 Views
According to an analysis that I read in the NYT, it may. - 28/09/2009 01:24:05 PM 333 Views
That same article says radical changes are unlikely, though. - 28/09/2009 01:43:30 PM 540 Views
No one said there would be radical changes. But there will be changes - 28/09/2009 01:56:01 PM 433 Views
Merkel is further to the left than most if not all Democrats in government here in the US. - 28/09/2009 01:25:09 PM 483 Views
In comparison, that's true of course *NM* - 28/09/2009 01:35:35 PM 246 Views
He is quite ignorant. - 28/09/2009 01:41:54 PM 379 Views

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