Could someone explain how an administrative matter invalidates any religious status?
Cannoli Send a noteboard - 12/04/2010 12:40:33 PM
Future Pope Stalled on Abuse Case, Letter Suggests
"Suggests" of course, clearly means "guilty beyond reasonable doubt." There is evidence that "suggests" Barack Obama was not born in the USA, so he should he resign too. The difference being, if the latter is true, it DOES invalidate his presidency, while if the Pope WERE guilty of far worse than has been "suggested" it would STILL not invalidate his papacy. As for the article, the bishop whose requests were allegedly denied by Cardinal Ratzinger is supporting him. There is no suggestion in the article that anyone was molested in the period in which this case was under review. The willingness of the Church to settle with the victims is in no way evidence of guilt, since anyone with the slightest understanding of the tort system knows that it is often more costly to defend a false accusation than to settle, and perhaps the foremost charitable organization in the world (and one that is arguably most responsible for that concept as well as the criminalization of pedophilia in the first place - that was by no means a universal practice when the Church got started) did not want to out children on trial to keep its own reputation pristine.
I am so angry at my former church, letting this cancer go on for so long. It has been part of the church history for centuries letting such molestations slide, looking away, pretending it isn't happening.
Ah, yes. The usual tripe from lapsed Catholics attacking the Church to clean their own consciences. With everyone else, it is "love the sinner, hate the sin" but an organization that teaches individual responsibility for crimes is supposed to be acting out of collective guilt? The guy was arrested, tried, and served 3 years in jail (why it was only 3 years and misdeamors is beyond me, he tied the boys up and raped them.) After the 3 year jail sentence the bishop is calling for the vatican to defrock a priest due to the fact the priest is molesting children, you do not do a wait and see for 6 years deciding whether to defrock him. Doing so IS EVIL!!!
Defrocking does not usually (and did not in this case) stop a person from such activity. All it would have done would have been to cut the Church's ties with the man. Would the world have been a better place if he spent the 80s cornholing kids as a layman in his house in a gated community? Can you say that being under the eye AND the discipline of a bishop during the 80s (his decade of respite from his activity, according to the article) did NOT have an inhibiting effect on his behavior? As you point out, the civil authorities, who ARE actually responsible for preventing such things, failed too. Why is everyone singling out the head of a worldwide bureau rather than the California or US justice system? Incarceration is a FAR greater deterrant than defrocking. I don't know about you, but IMO, the "giving child molesters what they ask for" strategy has little indication of positive results. Maybe setting a child molester whom the legal system had failed to adequately restrain free from his duties and responsibilities to the Church as he wanted was not the best plan in the world either. And during this time the priest worked with children while still connected to the church.
I would think THAT sort of assignment would fall under the responsibility of his bishop and pastors. The idea that they needed permission from Rome to keep him away from kids is kind of hard to swallow. I cry for my former church, for while I do not believe, I do recognize the good they do and how some people feel "helped" by the church. At the same time this cancer, this abomination, must be torn out. It is unacceptable.
Why? It is none of your business if you are not a member. It is not as if the Church is the only part of society where this sort of thing take place - rather, it is the only institution that has made the tactical mistake of admitting errors in this area and one of the few with a process and intention to be rid of them. Far more children are molested by public school teachers in the US than by priests, and ministers, rabbis and imams have their own share of scandals buried in small insular commmunities, rather than reporting to a world-wide organization. Remove the beam from your own eye before you go digging at the splinter in the Church's.I AM SO ANGRY about this, wanting to perform violence on these people that let dozens of kids get abused again and again. So angry and so of sadness.
In point of fact, that article rather suggests that Ratzinger may have prevented abuse. There was no suggestion that anyone tried to remove the priest in question before his conviction, or that he carried on his abuses while his case was under review, but he WAS convicted of his crimes as a layman! It is the Church who should be upset here that their ties were not cut sooner. And I love how when it comes to violent thugs who murder children in the California justice system, everyone is quick to call up terms and phrases like "rehabilitation" and "benefit of the doubt" and "innocent until proven guilty" but when it is a priest, the CHURCH is supposed to do what the courts cannot (despite the fact that their last effort at doing so resulted in the Black Legend and being tarred with vicious and untrue propaganda throughout the English-speaking world), and heaven help anyone who suggests helping the priest get better, or that he ever be eligible for "parole." Tookie Williams was a far worse predator who did far greater harm to the youth of California, but he had celebrities lining to praise him and beg for his forgiveness. The willingness of hypocrites to scream the worst about the Church to cover their own shame at their personal failures to live up to her teachings never surprises me.
Cannoli
“Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” GK Chesteron
Inde muagdhe Aes Sedai misain ye!
Deus Vult!
*MySmiley*
“Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” GK Chesteron
Inde muagdhe Aes Sedai misain ye!
Deus Vult!
*MySmiley*
Future Pope stalled on removing child molesting priest, even though the Bishop wanted him defrocked
11/04/2010 04:45:25 AM
- 459 Views
The Pope should resign and the Church needs to reform itself.
11/04/2010 04:58:57 AM
- 116 Views
Yeah...
11/04/2010 07:57:39 AM
- 135 Views
^ This idiot hasn't electrocuted himself yet? *NM*
11/04/2010 01:20:22 PM
- 46 Views
Ad hominem attacks...
11/04/2010 04:28:38 PM
- 97 Views
They're only ad hominem when the target is a human being, so that wasn't. *NM*
11/04/2010 04:34:21 PM
- 45 Views
I really don't think you understand the concept of "ad hominem"
11/04/2010 04:43:33 PM
- 95 Views
My gift to you.
11/04/2010 04:48:22 PM
- 101 Views
Thanks.
11/04/2010 06:49:18 PM
- 83 Views
They do?
11/04/2010 05:59:59 PM
- 92 Views
They sure do.
11/04/2010 06:54:24 PM
- 78 Views
Oh yes. And no married man or minister has EVER molested children.
12/04/2010 12:00:40 PM
- 87 Views
And so the problem of having a theoretical ultimate power in anthing shows itself.
11/04/2010 05:09:46 AM
- 76 Views
There is a power greater than Benedict/Ratzinger, a power greater than the pope on earth
11/04/2010 05:22:04 AM
- 84 Views
I really don't think there are ever going to be Ecumenical councils again.
11/04/2010 05:44:07 PM
- 70 Views
I find their continual insistence that nothing inappropriate on Ratzinger's part occured sickening.
11/04/2010 05:20:15 AM
- 87 Views
He can resign, and the pope is not infallible
11/04/2010 05:30:45 AM
- 75 Views
Re: He can resign, and the pope is not infallible
11/04/2010 05:52:10 AM
- 78 Views
I can't excuse stupidity or people who don't understand their faith
11/04/2010 06:03:27 AM
- 86 Views
knowledge? Understanding?
11/04/2010 04:49:14 PM
- 96 Views
The only people I've ever seen say that are atheists, actually. It's a fun little strawman. *NM*
11/04/2010 10:44:56 PM
- 45 Views
I fail to see the problem.
11/04/2010 07:55:42 AM
- 103 Views
They've resigned before. *NM*
12/04/2010 08:43:21 AM
- 42 Views
Not in the last 595 years.
12/04/2010 05:53:10 PM
- 68 Views
I guess Roman Catholicism doesn't have quite the orthodoxy it claims to, then. *NM*
12/04/2010 06:06:54 PM
- 46 Views
By the way, "Future Pope" makes me think of a cyborg in a big gold and white hat. *NM*
12/04/2010 07:00:31 AM
- 44 Views
Could someone explain how an administrative matter invalidates any religious status?
12/04/2010 12:40:33 PM
- 93 Views