Active Users:309 Time:04/12/2023 08:29:57 PM
I'm surprised they've not managed to screw that up too. SilverWarder - 15/04/2004 10:23:04 AM

That was after the fighting occurred. Furthermore, they're diplomacy has consisted so far of ultimatums and focusing on capturing and killing outlaws (the tenuous ceasefire and move to negotiations being the only worthy diplomatic move so far).

Diplomacy? With criminals? Why?

If I get a gang of like minded people together, get a bunch of guns and take over a town in Montana, terrorising the population and killing the police and others should I expect to be negotiated with by diplomats or killed by the police and the army?

I'd rather expect the latter. Diplomacy? The man's a killer and backer of killers. I don't know why they haven't just gone in there and cleaned him out. I would have. With tanks.

Are we talking about the same guy? Because a certain spokesman was taken away for questioning in this fashion more recently (yesterday or the day before). I'm talking about the aide that was arrested (provoking the insurgency), the CPA denied arresting him initially adn hasn't released him yet.

No, we aren't. I'm not familiar at all with the incident you're quoting.

Only the health ministry is run with complete autonomy. Furthermore, the military and police won't fight Sadr partly because in some cases you are right...they can't but also because they don't want to fight their own people especially when there is an increasing belief that the American/coalition presence is what triggered the massive unrest in the first place.

Nah - they can't because they're useless. Some may not want to fight 'their own people' but mostly that's just an excuse not to get involved. Those who give it should be canned. They're cops and soldiers. Cops are always 'against' their own people (the lawbreakers) and soldiers swear to support their government against all enemies foreign and domestic. It's that domestic part that's important there.

They don't have enough power. The Governing Council is also questionable in terms of respect, since they lack a popular mandate. To illustrate this, Sistani, Iraq's leading religious authority will not affiliate himself with them (coincedentally, he also persuaded Sadr to back down from his own ultimatums and negotiate).

Sistani's a cipher. I'd love to know if he's just an opportunist or a real supporter of something better. He could be either.

As to questionable in terms of popular mandate would you care to relate who the last Iraqui leader with a popular mandate was? As far as I know there has never been one - but I'm not an Persian political specialist. Meaning that the Iraqui people aren't used to one and don't really understand what it means. More western bias.

Somalia - that was led by the US (it was UN backed). Rwanda, I agree totally. Kosovo - what's your point there?

Somalia - try again. That was a UN aid operation propped up by US forces. Far from being "led" by the US (although the more famous actions were) the US forces were a smallish group without proper support. Indeed the only armored units were UN controlled (French or Belgian as I recall) and the bloody mess in Mogadishu was only ended when the US finally managed to get them up off their butts and into action. Somalia was led by the UN and US backed, not the other way around.

And by referencing Kosovo, I'm not talking about what the west did but about what the Serbs and Albanians did to each other.

There were complaints by Iraqi firms that they could facilitate reconstruction faster and cheaper than U.S. companies.

Nice but unsupported. Is it true? We've no idea.

You're demonising him. Sadr is a Shia cleric as are his followers. Fallujah is part of the "Sunni Triangle", and enjoyed privileges under Saddam - that is the speculated reason for their dissent.

Do you honestly think that someone cannot be opportunistic enough to work with other groups if it benefits them? The timing is highly suspicious. Extremely so. Coincidence? Do you really believe that these events are unconnected and just 'happened' to occur at the same time?

Silver Warder

Warder to Rebelaessedai

Risk everything - or gain nothing.
Geoffrey de Charney - 1356

Deeds - Not words

Remembering Joe (CrazedWeasel)

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So, I didn't watch the news this past week - 13/04/2004 04:29:08 PM 226 Views
The jaberwocky will eat you. *NM* - 13/04/2004 04:31:22 PM 2 Views
Um, what went wrong exactly? - 13/04/2004 04:31:23 PM 44 Views
hah! beat you by one second *NM* - 13/04/2004 04:31:50 PM 3 Views
Bah I say! - 13/04/2004 04:33:24 PM 21 Views
bah - 13/04/2004 04:34:38 PM 50 Views
Yes, I see - 13/04/2004 04:36:46 PM 38 Views
20 years ago? - 13/04/2004 04:39:29 PM 42 Views
*shrugs* - 13/04/2004 04:44:09 PM 40 Views
True, but the situation has deteriorated further. - 13/04/2004 05:35:32 PM 21 Views
So negative - 13/04/2004 09:06:41 PM 13 Views
What opportunity? *NM* - 14/04/2004 02:27:21 AM 3 Views
It's really obvious - 14/04/2004 03:19:16 AM 11 Views
On the basis that those eggs are all humans - 14/04/2004 03:24:17 AM 11 Views
Terrorists - 14/04/2004 11:23:14 AM 12 Views
Re: Terrorists - 14/04/2004 11:30:33 AM 9 Views
And you would offer precisely what as an alternative? - 14/04/2004 05:42:06 PM 5 Views
My thoughts on alternatives - 14/04/2004 11:32:51 PM 6 Views
Hmm - I rather think you're being over optimistic. - 15/04/2004 03:04:29 AM 4 Views
The Governing Council only runs the health ministry with free reign. - 15/04/2004 04:15:14 AM 4 Views
I'm surprised they've not managed to screw that up too. - 15/04/2004 10:23:04 AM 8 Views
If they did or did not you wouldn't hear about it. - 15/04/2004 05:57:55 PM 6 Views
Believe what you wish - 16/04/2004 01:22:24 AM 3 Views
I disagree with a black and white standardisation and approach - 16/04/2004 02:04:50 AM 6 Views
Facts - 16/04/2004 11:44:01 AM 7 Views
Re: Facts (edited, correct address) - 16/04/2004 03:55:22 PM 8 Views
Re: Facts - 16/04/2004 05:23:36 PM 5 Views
Re: Facts - 16/04/2004 05:52:16 PM 3 Views
Yes - 16/04/2004 07:38:47 PM 4 Views
Well, it is not cerified if it was public knowledge, yet - 16/04/2004 09:15:45 PM 4 Views
I wouldn't say the US military excels at any type of conflict. - 14/04/2004 02:31:13 PM 7 Views
The score from Desert Storm - 14/04/2004 05:40:19 PM 8 Views
That did not take into account the current urban warfare scenario. *NM* - 14/04/2004 11:35:46 PM 3 Views
WEll done - 15/04/2004 06:59:22 PM 6 Views
Re: WEll done - 16/04/2004 01:19:34 AM 4 Views
well it is incompetence on the parts of americans. - 16/04/2004 10:38:26 AM 5 Views
Try studying sometime. - 16/04/2004 11:50:39 AM 7 Views
Wish I hadn't watched it today. *NM* - 13/04/2004 06:29:13 PM 2 Views
god was on holiday - 13/04/2004 08:24:17 PM 14 Views
Depends on how you look at it. - 14/04/2004 12:48:31 AM 12 Views