I won't get into your debate with Tom. It looks like it is about to degenerate.
Camilla Send a noteboard - 10/02/2011 04:37:34 PM
In England, several folklore traditions and rhyming poems were gathered together under the Mother Goose umbrella by the late 17th century. In late 17th century France, Charles Perrault borrowed heavily from existing regional folk tales and created memorable tales that passed into several languages.
Mother Goose dates back to the 16th, doesn't she? Hmm. Possibly not under that name, though.
I do wonder why France and England were so early. In other countries (Germany, Norway, Russia, certianly -- I don't know about Spain and Italy, for example) it happens in the 19th (coupled with National Romanticism.
This is not isolated to this one particular tale. Consider the darker implications behind a tale such as "Little Red Riding Hood." While several other cultural historians have argued that this tale serves as a metaphor for the (de)flowering of a maiden, I believe the key lies in element of the cakes and wine. In the older, French-derived versions of the tale, the wolf kills the grandmother and serves Little Red Riding Hood her blood as wine and her flesh as cakes, a sacrilegious reference to the Eucharistic Host. It is telling that by the time that the Grimm brothers have recorded this story, the Eucharistic element has been diminished into nothing; the Wolf has eaten whole both grandmother and granddaughter before each is rescued by the huntsman. Yet the imagery still persists nearly two centuries after the Grimm Brothers' version: vulnerable girls are still stalked each and every day and the guileless may be powerless against the guileful.
While, unlike Tom, I think you are perfectly entitled to read whatever you like into the wine and cakes, presenting it as inherently there, to be reduced by the protestant Germans is perhaps overdoing it a little. Do we know of any earlier versions of this tale? Something a la the Chinese version of Cinderella?
This "deep reading" approach does little, if anything, to diminish the joy of reading paupers becoming princes, of the famished receiving unexpected bounty, or the haughty experiencing a sudden downfall. Who doesn't rejoice when in a tale the good triumph over the wicked, even if it might not occur as often as desired in real life? An attentive reader, reading these tales not just as childish musings but rather as stories that reflect the desires and fears of centuries of folk tale-relating villagers, might find herself becoming entranced with these wondrous stories all over again. Highly recommended.
I admit I have a tendency to read fairytales out of the context of their collections, and as a result, I haven't always got a clear idea of which versions belong where. I should probably address that. Soonish. I am enjoying Angela Carter's collection, though (although I haven't opened it in a while) -- it is interesting to see how the tales travel.
*MySmiley*
structured procrastinator
structured procrastinator
Jakob and Wilhelm Grimm, Grimm's Fairy Tales
- 09/02/2011 01:15:09 AM
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Of course, the Grimms wanted to listen to how the people told the tales, too.
- 09/02/2011 05:39:39 AM
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That and they were after specific German examples
- 09/02/2011 10:33:27 PM
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I think you need to modify your review.
- 10/02/2011 06:03:26 AM
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Not really
- 10/02/2011 07:02:15 AM
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Well, in that case your review sucks.
- 10/02/2011 04:08:21 PM
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I won't get into your debate with Tom. It looks like it is about to degenerate.
- 10/02/2011 04:37:34 PM
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Re: I won't get into your debate with Tom. It looks like it is about to degenerate.
- 10/02/2011 04:51:36 PM
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Re: I won't get into your debate with Tom. It looks like it is about to degenerate.
- 10/02/2011 04:58:30 PM
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I had to see the approximate numbes when I was taking some social history courses
- 10/02/2011 05:25:06 PM
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