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Since 1948 Napoleon62 Send a noteboard - 06/08/2010 04:01:02 AM
Article 16.
(1) Men and women of full age, without any limitation due to race, nationality or religion, have the right to marry and to found a family. They are entitled to equal rights as to marriage, during marriage and at its dissolution.
(2) Marriage shall be entered into only with the free and full consent of the intending spouses.
(3) The family is the natural and fundamental group unit of society and is entitled to protection by society and the State.

-Universal Declaration of Human Rights, passed unanimously by the United Nations General Assembly December 10 1948
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Judge rules California's ban on same-sex marriage is unconstitutional ironclad - 04/08/2010 10:40:50 PM 1331 Views
Thank God. *NM* Ghavrel - 04/08/2010 10:52:30 PM 371 Views
Amen. *NM* Dannymac - 05/08/2010 02:09:24 AM 425 Views
Good news, but as the article says, it'll go all the way to the SC. Legolas - 04/08/2010 10:55:58 PM 689 Views
So then is that how we do it? Jeordam - 04/08/2010 11:01:19 PM 812 Views
Of course. ironclad - 04/08/2010 11:04:59 PM 723 Views
His point was ßelals Girl - 04/08/2010 11:40:14 PM 868 Views
Yeah but: What Ghavrel said below *NM* ironclad - 05/08/2010 08:01:02 AM 421 Views
And again... ßelals Girl - 05/08/2010 06:08:56 PM 563 Views
To quote my property professor: "Can I make you think like a Californian?" Tom - 05/08/2010 06:39:48 PM 639 Views
well that is sort of the idea of how democracy works snoopcester - 04/08/2010 11:06:57 PM 702 Views
I'm not the one who came up with the referendum system, you do realize. Legolas - 04/08/2010 11:11:13 PM 715 Views
The referendum system, in my opinion, has been a failure, especially in CA. Dreaded Anomaly - 04/08/2010 11:46:21 PM 790 Views
democracy has been a failure in CA. random thoughts - 05/08/2010 02:42:21 PM 584 Views
No. It just shows the problems of a crazy electorate. Tom - 05/08/2010 03:29:21 PM 695 Views
I think you made my point *NM* random thoughts - 05/08/2010 03:35:00 PM 390 Views
About Californians being crazy, yes. *NM* Tom - 05/08/2010 04:53:32 PM 365 Views
we vote fro way to much crap in general random thoughts - 05/08/2010 02:41:19 PM 644 Views
Yeah, I agree. Legolas - 05/08/2010 04:11:34 PM 636 Views
my one recent dealing with our criminal justice random thoughts - 05/08/2010 04:25:30 PM 675 Views
Yes, you still have to abide by the Constitution, even if a lot of people don't like it. *NM* Ghavrel - 05/08/2010 12:07:44 AM 373 Views
Amend the Constitution to alter the Fourteenth Amendment if you don't like it. *NM* Tom - 05/08/2010 01:09:51 AM 435 Views
just a devil's advocate position here, but.... moondog - 05/08/2010 04:23:43 AM 721 Views
Marriage is either an economic status regulated by law or a religious institution. Tom - 05/08/2010 05:13:17 AM 753 Views
There are certain things that should not be decided by a vote... Dannymac - 05/08/2010 02:02:45 AM 709 Views
I do agree with you on that. Hell yes, and on a subject like this in particular. nossy - 05/08/2010 02:17:24 AM 764 Views
Re: I do agree with you on that. Hell yes, and on a subject like this in particular. snoopcester - 05/08/2010 10:46:54 AM 754 Views
I understand it. nossy - 05/08/2010 03:06:40 PM 738 Views
I know you don't support proposition 8 snoopcester - 05/08/2010 03:29:34 PM 725 Views
nossy - 05/08/2010 03:34:01 PM 763 Views
But that is just simplistic and silly to complain about when it is a long standing possibility snoopcester - 05/08/2010 03:46:59 PM 646 Views
Oh, ees it? nossy - 05/08/2010 04:07:39 PM 786 Views
Well they knew the rules before they started the whole thing snoopcester - 05/08/2010 04:12:33 PM 624 Views
Why would you complain if you won? nossy - 05/08/2010 04:15:20 PM 706 Views
You could recognise that you won by the system working in a way you don't like? snoopcester - 05/08/2010 04:23:58 PM 597 Views
I'm sure that happens, in general. nossy - 06/08/2010 02:43:18 PM 585 Views
It seems to happen a lot nowadays snoopcester - 06/08/2010 03:06:33 PM 617 Views
It's so weird that you feel differently - there is only room for one opinion here! nossy - 06/08/2010 03:41:52 PM 539 Views
There is only room for one opinion and mine is the right one snoopcester - 06/08/2010 03:49:16 PM 663 Views
instead it should be decided by judges who answer to no one? *NM* random thoughts - 05/08/2010 07:12:59 AM 379 Views
The same judges who upheld our private right to bear arms. Tom - 05/08/2010 02:09:07 PM 739 Views
not when judges stop using the Constitution random thoughts - 05/08/2010 02:30:51 PM 717 Views
Sexual preference is not the right being protected. Tom - 05/08/2010 03:22:04 PM 788 Views
I know that the 14th amendment is routinely used in ways it was never intended. random thoughts - 05/08/2010 05:25:07 PM 694 Views
I realize that, but it is ultimately a good thing. Tom - 05/08/2010 05:31:19 PM 766 Views
I am really on the fence a bit on the whole issue random thoughts - 05/08/2010 06:00:59 PM 707 Views
I generally agree with you. Tom - 05/08/2010 06:33:56 PM 726 Views
let's take away the citizenship of all black people if that's the way you think moondog - 05/08/2010 09:06:23 PM 625 Views
Come now lets not be stupid random thoughts - 06/08/2010 05:31:18 PM 595 Views
sorry but your statement was completely ignorant. moondog - 06/08/2010 07:27:09 PM 711 Views
I will talk as soon as you stop spouting stupid rhetoric and say something relevant random thoughts - 06/08/2010 07:54:09 PM 671 Views
bullshit. you will personally attack me no matter what i say. moondog - 07/08/2010 02:04:04 PM 719 Views
Let's just be clear about which amendment is which. Dreaded Anomaly - 05/08/2010 11:50:57 PM 594 Views
but that still ignores intent and expands the law in ways not intnented when it created random thoughts - 06/08/2010 04:53:43 AM 654 Views
Yes, no, no, and no. Dreaded Anomaly - 06/08/2010 05:29:09 AM 687 Views
there are serious flaws in your thinking here random thoughts - 06/08/2010 06:18:13 PM 759 Views
Your assertions continue to lack support. Dreaded Anomaly - 06/08/2010 07:23:17 PM 794 Views
not all you just refuse to see things you disagree with random thoughts - 06/08/2010 08:36:32 PM 757 Views
...said the pot to the kettle Dreaded Anomaly - 06/08/2010 09:17:28 PM 835 Views
yes but a shiny stainless steel pot random thoughts - 09/08/2010 11:21:33 PM 873 Views
You continue to be wrong about history and the role of courts. Dreaded Anomaly - 10/08/2010 01:05:39 AM 1218 Views
If he's wrong, a lot of law scholars and Supreme Court Justices are wrong. Legolas - 10/08/2010 01:44:05 AM 682 Views
Brown vs. Board of Education, 'nuff said. *NM* Dreaded Anomaly - 10/08/2010 04:32:37 AM 376 Views
Actually, that only proves his point, if I understand correctly. *NM* Legolas - 10/08/2010 11:11:19 AM 401 Views
part oif the problem appears to be you completely missing the point random thoughts - 10/08/2010 01:23:19 PM 893 Views
let my simplify my argument random thoughts - 10/08/2010 01:42:47 PM 595 Views
There's a simple way to determine the degree to which that opinion is objective or subjective... Legolas - 06/08/2010 09:32:21 PM 627 Views
Since when is marriage a right? *NM* Jeordam - 05/08/2010 04:11:16 PM 363 Views
it may not be a "right"... LadyLorraine - 05/08/2010 04:22:44 PM 628 Views
This is where the debate comes into play.... Jeordam - 05/08/2010 05:04:08 PM 643 Views
How much would it change the debate if it was nurture, really? Legolas - 05/08/2010 09:48:22 PM 663 Views
except this is not merely a matter of changing society LadyLorraine - 05/08/2010 11:18:48 PM 705 Views
1948. *NM* jh - 05/08/2010 04:50:30 PM 362 Views
It's a benefit that is being extended selectively to one set of the populace. Tom - 05/08/2010 04:52:52 PM 702 Views
Hey, I'm single.... Jeordam - 05/08/2010 05:05:41 PM 622 Views
That's a specious argument and you know it. Tom - 05/08/2010 05:13:17 PM 693 Views
A homosexual has every opportunity as well..... Jeordam - 05/08/2010 05:23:56 PM 644 Views
Oh quit the bullshit already. Tom - 05/08/2010 05:29:15 PM 844 Views
Slow your role... Jeordam - 05/08/2010 09:08:54 PM 746 Views
Your religious beliefs have 100% to do with your position. Tom - 05/08/2010 09:43:23 PM 791 Views
Sorry, but what a nonsense. ironclad - 05/08/2010 09:27:17 PM 611 Views
hey that's it, jens! you solved the WHOLE PROBLEM!!! LadyLorraine - 05/08/2010 11:24:29 PM 738 Views
ON TO WORLD HUNGER! ironclad - 06/08/2010 07:59:51 AM 617 Views
LET THEM HAVE CAEK. *NM* jh - 06/08/2010 02:29:56 PM 348 Views
Are you sure it's wise to feed people on a lie? *NM* Floffe - 06/08/2010 02:34:26 PM 435 Views
People are fed lies all the time LadyLorraine - 06/08/2010 09:30:37 PM 618 Views
Quite so, but I don't think it's commonly a mainstay of their diet *NM* Floffe - 06/08/2010 09:50:33 PM 376 Views
It is the only thing which is abundant enough for everyone to have some... *NM* jh - 06/08/2010 10:01:44 PM 616 Views
I agree with you Sareitha Sedai - 05/08/2010 05:06:40 PM 678 Views
That's not valid. Tom - 05/08/2010 05:26:50 PM 691 Views
I invite you to read the judge's conclusions, linked again inside. Dreaded Anomaly - 05/08/2010 11:43:44 PM 730 Views
Since 1948 Napoleon62 - 06/08/2010 04:01:02 AM 814 Views
gah. can. only. see. typo. *NM* nossy - 06/08/2010 03:43:21 PM 334 Views
I don't see any typo... *NM* Legolas - 06/08/2010 04:07:18 PM 391 Views
Open the link. *NM* nossy - 06/08/2010 04:47:04 PM 483 Views
Oh, right. Yeah, that does kinda detract from things. *NM* Legolas - 06/08/2010 04:48:47 PM 371 Views
I agree random thoughts - 05/08/2010 07:22:17 AM 704 Views
And Civil Rights lost the Democrats the South. Dannymac - 05/08/2010 03:44:56 PM 711 Views
but it was done by congress passing laws and the president signing those laws random thoughts - 05/08/2010 04:20:19 PM 662 Views
uhm, what? LadyLorraine - 05/08/2010 04:24:43 PM 653 Views
those were mostly rulings up holding laws not stiking them down random thoughts - 05/08/2010 05:05:15 PM 718 Views
I was under the impression that the supreme court had a role in it snoopcester - 05/08/2010 04:31:51 PM 618 Views
but the court was not over turning the laws passed by congress random thoughts - 05/08/2010 05:11:06 PM 681 Views
No, like in this case, isn't it? snoopcester - 05/08/2010 05:24:19 PM 630 Views
I would say that is another case of judicial activism and shows the danger of the practice random thoughts - 05/08/2010 05:43:02 PM 596 Views
Which one is? I imagine from different view points both are. snoopcester - 06/08/2010 10:34:11 AM 603 Views
The law wasn't constitutional. Dannymac - 07/08/2010 06:17:04 AM 638 Views
well it will take a higher court to decide that random thoughts - 09/08/2010 10:46:15 PM 667 Views
Hard to believe it's the same governor who said "Gay marriage should be between a man and a woman." *NM* TaskmasterJack - 04/08/2010 11:05:45 PM 450 Views
Or "Iff it bleeds we can kill itt!" *NM* ironclad - 04/08/2010 11:14:45 PM 423 Views
Another step in the right direction. *NM* snoopcester - 04/08/2010 11:08:15 PM 443 Views
Link to the full court order inside: Dreaded Anomaly - 04/08/2010 11:43:29 PM 816 Views
The judge quoting Scalia in favour of gay marriage is fairly amusing. Legolas - 04/08/2010 11:50:47 PM 700 Views
What page was that on? Tim - 05/08/2010 11:25:49 AM 618 Views
Nah, it was way above page 109, in the findings of fact somewhere. Legolas - 05/08/2010 12:37:48 PM 718 Views
Oh, that is brilliant. Tim - 05/08/2010 01:12:21 PM 624 Views
Pretty much. Legolas - 05/08/2010 01:44:22 PM 752 Views
I've always wondered what basis there is for banning necrophilia if "it's disgusting" is invalid. Tim - 05/08/2010 01:51:19 PM 695 Views
because you cannot give consent when you are dead? Camilla - 05/08/2010 03:04:46 PM 687 Views
what if you give consent while you are still alive? random thoughts - 05/08/2010 03:21:59 PM 785 Views
Is it then illegal? Camilla - 05/08/2010 03:23:46 PM 709 Views
given I imagine the pro-necrophilia lobby isn't strong in numbers or influence snoopcester - 05/08/2010 03:33:11 PM 762 Views
Re: given I imagine the pro-necrophilia lobby isn't strong in numbers or influence Camilla - 05/08/2010 03:34:57 PM 794 Views
I would think it would be illegal even then random thoughts - 05/08/2010 03:34:31 PM 719 Views
Wikipedia to the rescue! Legolas - 05/08/2010 04:20:15 PM 847 Views
you would hope the other states would cover it under improper treatmentof human remains random thoughts - 05/08/2010 07:38:59 PM 664 Views
A dead body is just an object, not a person with rights. Tom - 05/08/2010 03:27:08 PM 709 Views
Yes, but Camilla - 06/08/2010 08:42:05 AM 665 Views
Absolutely not. Tom - 06/08/2010 03:21:14 PM 715 Views
not to mention necrophilia has a large potential to be hazardous to health. LadyLorraine - 06/08/2010 09:42:43 PM 759 Views
That was a very well written judgement. Tim - 05/08/2010 11:24:38 AM 714 Views
Tom - 05/08/2010 12:10:02 AM 711 Views
Totally agree. Rebekah - 05/08/2010 01:01:42 PM 756 Views
+1 *NM* LadyLorraine - 05/08/2010 03:42:08 PM 391 Views
Irrelevant decision.....this was heading to SCOTUS from day 1 *NM* trzaska2000 - 05/08/2010 12:53:26 AM 403 Views
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