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Re: i'm not saying that all inexplained qualities are due to "soul" Burr Send a noteboard - 14/09/2009 08:05:41 PM
It's an empty placeholder for an explanation. Science at least provides a partial explanation of the unknown by describing the boundaries of what we know. If you say the soul is whatever human qualities haven't yet been discovered by science, then the soul theory is falsified every time a scientific discovery about humanity is made.


I'm just saying a soul is an explanation, if an unprovable one (as things stand). Think of it less as a "scientific theory" and more of a "philosophic idea" :P


But what I'm saying is that it's not even an unprovable explanation, because it's not an explanation at all. Positing a spiritual soul is no more an explanation than positing a nonsense wordthing like uqweroiuejr. "The uqweroiuejr lies on a uqweroiuejr-like plane of existence and explains knowns X, Y, and Z, even if we can't prove it." Whether it's provable or not doesn't even matter, because we haven't yet said anything meaningful other than implying that we can't yet explain X, Y, and Z. As a philosophic idea, the soul is useful only as a placeholder, not as an explanation.

Note: I'm not necessarily trying to persuade you to agree with me. As a practical matter, it may be that some brains more efficiently by assuming the existence of spiritual substances. In fact, maybe on some subconscious level my brain does believe in spiritual substances and makes me the better off for it. I'm just trying to clarify why I don't bother believing in them on a conscious, rational level.
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This message last edited by Burr on 14/09/2009 at 08:17:51 PM
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Do you think there's some kind of spiritual substance in the universe? Lordling - 14/09/2009 02:42:22 PM 1059 Views
no, it is mostly hydrogen *NM* random thoughts - 14/09/2009 02:43:47 PM 357 Views
No *NM* Insolitus - 14/09/2009 03:01:32 PM 346 Views
not a chance *NM* clam - 14/09/2009 03:23:02 PM 346 Views
yes (in as much that we could choose to define it that way) LadyLorraine - 14/09/2009 03:31:40 PM 907 Views
On a gut level, I think all substance is teleologically tied to one or more kinds of consciousness. Burr - 14/09/2009 04:03:31 PM 805 Views
aaah but who says we can percieve all there is to percieve in relation to our persons? LadyLorraine - 14/09/2009 04:14:08 PM 847 Views
But merely positing a soul (as a spiritual substance) doesn't actually explain anything. Burr - 14/09/2009 07:46:35 PM 749 Views
i'm not saying that all inexplained qualities are due to "soul" LadyLorraine - 14/09/2009 07:50:27 PM 823 Views
Re: i'm not saying that all inexplained qualities are due to "soul" Burr - 14/09/2009 08:05:41 PM 815 Views
Carts and horses. Joel - 18/09/2009 12:10:22 PM 958 Views
No *NM* Monkey - 14/09/2009 05:14:33 PM 350 Views
Wouldn't spiritual and substance be mutually exclusive? jh - 14/09/2009 05:27:09 PM 822 Views
Re: Wouldn't spiritual and substance be mutually exclusive? Lordling - 14/09/2009 06:20:45 PM 803 Views
I think there is definitely a spiritual force that underlies the unity of all things Matrimony Cauthon - 14/09/2009 06:11:01 PM 842 Views
That sounds very like gnosticism in many ways. Joel - 18/09/2009 12:17:51 PM 883 Views
No. *NM* Entophile - 14/09/2009 07:06:59 PM 336 Views
define "spiritual'. Avendesora - 14/09/2009 07:36:18 PM 796 Views
Rum. Craig - 14/09/2009 08:25:46 PM 809 Views
YES! *NM* Elaine - 16/09/2009 02:10:55 PM 375 Views
How are we not married? *NM* Craig - 19/09/2009 04:10:13 AM 340 Views
Bigamy laws. *NM* TaskmasterJack - 19/09/2009 03:49:59 PM 375 Views
My Achilles heel! *NM* Craig - 19/09/2009 07:30:06 PM 347 Views
Timing *NM* Elaine - 21/09/2009 12:51:37 PM 341 Views
My Achilles ankle! *NM* Craig - 21/09/2009 08:14:42 PM 357 Views
Your Face. *NM* jh - 21/09/2009 08:21:44 PM 349 Views
My Achilles face! Craig - 07/10/2009 09:40:36 PM 717 Views
No *NM* Dragonsworn - 14/09/2009 09:09:16 PM 325 Views
No *NM* Camilla - 14/09/2009 09:31:14 PM 342 Views
Yes, vodka. *NM* Stephen - 14/09/2009 10:02:19 PM 330 Views
Substance? Great Lord of Chaos - 14/09/2009 10:08:04 PM 795 Views
Yeah, boobs. Vodalus - 15/09/2009 01:51:44 AM 777 Views
Not the way I'd put it, as jh notes, but unquestionably. Joel - 15/09/2009 03:17:22 PM 808 Views
Look, don't put words in my mouth. jh - 15/09/2009 04:50:13 PM 851 Views
Sorry. Joel - 15/09/2009 05:14:10 PM 774 Views
Re: Sorry. Burr - 17/09/2009 09:20:58 PM 757 Views
People over-complicate this, it's a sort of animal abuse Isaac - 15/09/2009 09:03:01 PM 815 Views
Nicely put. *NM* everynametaken - 17/09/2009 01:57:44 AM 363 Views
Very nicely put. *NM* Ghavrel - 17/09/2009 06:57:57 PM 317 Views
A sublte nuance most modern materialists miss. Joel - 18/09/2009 12:21:33 PM 1017 Views
I think there may be platonic forms defining purpose Sports_Gambler - 16/09/2009 06:27:36 AM 730 Views
The material universe precludes a purely natural cause. Joel - 18/09/2009 12:04:16 PM 940 Views
One little correction Isaac - 20/09/2009 12:34:13 AM 914 Views
That makes it more complex, but I agree the same basic problem persists. Joel - 07/10/2009 12:11:07 PM 965 Views
Nay. Burr - 20/09/2009 07:04:47 AM 751 Views
Re: Nay. Joel - 07/10/2009 11:55:28 AM 866 Views
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