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Really? I just heard someone say, "Ryan came off like Doogie Howser." Joel Send a noteboard - 12/10/2012 04:56:49 AM
Wow, I have never seen something so sad and childish. Biden is getting slamming by everyone. I was starting to feel sorry for him.

I earlier heard the comment Republicans are harping on Biden laughing at Ryan and interrupting him because they do not want to talk about substantive issues or policies, where Ryan got destroyed. Personally, I think it a push.

Biden was substantively better, pointing out Ryan twice asked for stimulus money he calls fiscally irresponsible, and voted for Bushs budget-busting wars and prescription drug plan but now calls himself fiscally conservative. Particularly glaring was that, after Romney and Ryan have both been pressed for weeks to show how they can slash taxes 20% for everyone without cutting entitlements, Ryan refused just as defiantly as he always has. You cannot say, "the math checks but you are not allowed to see it." In their closing remarks the candidates were asked to address a US soldiers complaint the campaign is about them tearing down each other rather than building up America; Ryan thanked him for his service then went through a laundry list of attacks on Obama.

That is not to say Biden won handily; he had a few stumbles, and Ryan did not collapse, but mounted some defense and landed a few blows of his own.

Ryan had better form, because Bidens eager aggression led him to rudely interrupt far too often. They should turn off the mics during opposing statements; drowning out responses should never be allowed. The candidates and moderator sitting at a single table illustrates there was more give and take tonight, but that is still not acceptable. Biden repeatedly referred to Ryan as his "friend," but directed nearly all responses to Raddatz; even when referencing comments Ryan just made he seldom looked rather than gestured at him. He generally spoke directly to Raddatz throughout, only briefly facing the camera for occasional points of emphasis. Ryan looked directly into the camera for his final remarks to "ask for your vote," though one commentator said it looked like he was running for student council.

Again, it was not completely one-sided; Biden was amiable enough despite being a bit overbearing, and Ryan looked a little stiff a few times (and vague often.)

Like I say, I would call it a push; those judging on style will give Ryan the edge to varying degress and those judging on substance will do the same with Biden. Sadly, we have not chosen our president or vice presidents on substance rather than form in a very long time. That is why Ryan has a reputation for being knowledgeable: He no longer talks specifics because he came off like Scrooge when he did, but he SOUNDS convincing.
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This message last edited by Joel on 12/10/2012 at 01:09:04 PM
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Biden getting destroyed by media - laughing/giggling throughout debate - 12/10/2012 04:08:38 AM 716 Views
And yet he won the CBS insta-poll *shrug* *NM* - 12/10/2012 04:15:34 AM 172 Views
CNN Poll - Ryan 48% - Biden 44% - Another win for the good guys! *NM* - 12/10/2012 01:18:15 PM 154 Views
Sorry, given their small sample size, that's a statistical tie, not a win. - 12/10/2012 02:57:04 PM 341 Views
Re: Sorry, given their small sample size, that's a statistical tie, not a win. - 13/10/2012 04:35:03 AM 495 Views
you do realize there are more than just the 2 candidates? - 13/10/2012 08:26:58 PM 351 Views
I disagree - 14/10/2012 02:20:44 AM 406 Views
if voters would only EDUCATE THEMSELVES - 14/10/2012 08:17:11 PM 459 Views
It has little to do with educating yourself. - 15/10/2012 04:03:17 AM 421 Views
Do you know any of these names? - 17/10/2012 02:38:32 AM 372 Views
I apologize for the "idiot." That was a crude generalization. - 15/10/2012 08:25:14 PM 466 Views
so because you don't want either Dem or GOP candidate for President - 16/10/2012 06:13:34 PM 352 Views
There is nothing sacred about voting. - 16/10/2012 08:22:33 PM 461 Views
Did you really just refer to Paul Ryan and by extension, Romney as "the good guys"? *NM* - 13/10/2012 04:31:14 AM 178 Views
He admitted to being a partisan R, if that gives you a clue. *NM* - 13/10/2012 05:40:27 AM 162 Views
Admitted to it and actually being one are two different things. *NM* - 15/10/2012 04:11:20 AM 190 Views
did you just express shock that there are opinions that differ from yours? - 13/10/2012 03:26:25 PM 371 Views
I expressed mock shock. Was I shocked? No. Did I wish to convey that I was? Yeah. - 15/10/2012 04:10:02 AM 491 Views
sorry if I assumed you had a decent side *NM* - 15/10/2012 05:55:53 PM 155 Views
Apology accepted! *NM* - 17/10/2012 02:43:04 PM 196 Views
Really? I just heard someone say, "Ryan came off like Doogie Howser." - 12/10/2012 04:56:49 AM 509 Views
The conservative media maybe - 12/10/2012 10:21:30 AM 393 Views
You mean, all liberal sources are calling it a tie? *NM* - 12/10/2012 01:20:05 PM 158 Views
Biden wiped the floor with Ryan, and you know it. *NM* - 12/10/2012 01:46:15 PM 169 Views
Not as per most pundits and the CNN poll - so sorry, your team lost AGAIN! *NM* - 12/10/2012 02:55:03 PM 156 Views
Oh, I guess pundits decide the election. *NM* - 12/10/2012 03:18:31 PM 177 Views
There is no middle ground for you, hm? - 12/10/2012 05:45:19 PM 363 Views
to conservatives, there are two types of media outlets - 13/10/2012 08:42:30 PM 473 Views
Great new ad - Biden laughing at the important issues of the day - 12/10/2012 01:23:24 PM 411 Views
Laughing at the blatant lies and mischaracterization. How else to respond to that? *NM* - 12/10/2012 01:42:23 PM 192 Views
Oh, and hypocrisy. *NM* - 12/10/2012 01:42:49 PM 174 Views
I think Ryan helped Romney more than Bidden helped Obama - 12/10/2012 05:59:32 PM 459 Views
if by "help romney" you mean "still hasn't specified what they would've done differently" then yes - 12/10/2012 06:09:27 PM 462 Views
There is a sound political reason for vagueness. - 12/10/2012 06:18:19 PM 434 Views
there's vague and then there's just plain making things up to score points - 12/10/2012 07:36:08 PM 437 Views
you mean like when Biden said he didn't vote for the wars? *NM* - 13/10/2012 03:36:27 PM 177 Views
there is a lot you dont see - 13/10/2012 03:28:55 PM 396 Views
They both accomplished what they had to do. Biden didn't need a longterm success. - 12/10/2012 06:25:12 PM 316 Views
no but it does need to last all the way to the election - 13/10/2012 03:35:40 PM 354 Views
I liked Kurt Cobains bit - 12/10/2012 09:26:59 PM 385 Views

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