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I have agreed with the post mortems till now; no idea how anyone can score that a Romney win. Joel Send a noteboard - 23/10/2012 06:01:22 AM
...can we just conclude that this foreign policy debate was as substantive as a Honey Boo Boo episode?

Needless to say, the insta-polls favored Obama, but when Romney spent seemingly half of the debate agreeing ultimately with the administration's policies/actions and the other half talking about public education and arguing about the auto bailout, the only surprise was that some pundits on the news teams tried to argue that it was even close at all. There's got to be some sort of "postmodernist" novelist out there ready, willing, and able to write a metanarrative about where the debate is really about the newcasters' use of metaphors and not about the candidates' parroting of spoon-fed lines, right?

Now to await the inevitable bickering from partisans. All I know is that I'm undecided if I should be basking in the glow of the "love" that Romney professed for my profession. ;)

On substance, Romney declared, "Syria is Iran’s only ally in the Arab world. It’s their route to the sea,” yet the Persian Gulf is Irans entire southern border (perhaps why it is NAMED after Iran. :rolleyes:) Substantively, Obama destroyed Romney if only because the latter chose the "me, too, but better," approach I expected him to forego as 1) too tame for the base and 2) easily countered by asking, "if you agree with me on everything why are you running against me?" (as Obama essentially did.)

It was similar even when they pivoted the "foreign policy" debate to the economy. Romney denied his "Let Detroit Go Bankrupt" op ed urged Detroits bankruptcy, claiming the private sector would have saved them; Obama countered no private firms had the capital or desire for that during the Bush recessions double dip. Several were asked—including Bain Capital— but all refused. Without a US government bailout the Big Three would have gone into Chapter 7 liquidation and no longer exist. Obama could have more succinctly asked how Romney will spend $5 trillion on tax cuts, $2 trillion on the military AND end the deficit, but I think he conveyed the point.

So much for substance; on to what matters: Form. I admit some bias, but Romney struck me as frenetic to near the point of desperation, as if he thought ignoring time limits and sneaking in an extra closing rebuttal on each question would prevent another pummeling. Several times that left him briefly flailing and stuttering. The biggest thing I noticed from the start was that Romney was almost covered with what is technically called "flop sweat" (one Obama staffer reportedly tweeted Romney "looks like Nixon, only sweatier.") Nearly as noticeable were the narrow-eyed stares and smirks Obamas responses earned; if looks could kill Romney would have been in Secret Service custody by the halfway mark. He swung back and forth from patronizing patrician to unctious snake-oil salesman, and neither looked "presidential."

Obamas firm but measured confidence was a stark contrast. He put slightly too fine a point on it a few times (e.g. he should have stopped at "bayonets and horses" without giving Romney a condescending lesson on carriers and nuclear subs,) but for the most part he was assured without being arrogant. He was not nodding along with eyes downcast like a naughty schoolboy being lectured (as in the first debate,) but neither did he present a contemptuous phony smile that never reached his eyes (as Romney did nearly every time Obama spoke.) He met Romneys eyes with neither disdain nor submission, but only due acknowledgement.

This is unlikely to move the needle, as they say. The first debate was Obamas chance to solidify the then-prevalent impression he was a commanding leader and Romney an inept scrooge; he blew it, and can never get a second chance. A month is not long to create and run clips of Romney stating todays positions juxtaposed with clips of him stating just the opposite a couple months ago. The final debate probably will not change much, let alone as much as the first debate did; ending an economic election with a foreign policy debate all but guarantees that. On form, sustance and all else though, it is hard to call it anything but a decisive Obama victory.
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This message last edited by Joel on 23/10/2012 at 06:06:46 AM
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Between the ships, horses, bayonets, and lines about loving teachers... - 23/10/2012 04:44:32 AM 1068 Views
He loves teachers, but only so long as we are seen and not heard. - 23/10/2012 05:07:15 AM 528 Views
Or have the benefits of the golden parachutes - 23/10/2012 05:32:04 AM 536 Views
Which might those be? - 23/10/2012 07:25:24 AM 527 Views
Also "heaven and earth" and bankrupt Detroit. - 23/10/2012 12:23:21 PM 525 Views
Both those charges are fact checked and verified. - 23/10/2012 03:05:01 PM 532 Views
The instapolls declared Obama victor in #1 too, Romney won this one - 23/10/2012 06:00:26 AM 690 Views
*blinks* - 23/10/2012 06:08:00 AM 572 Views
Which instapoll said Obama won the first debate? - 23/10/2012 06:18:45 AM 457 Views
I have agreed with the post mortems till now; no idea how anyone can score that a Romney win. - 23/10/2012 06:01:22 AM 563 Views
My favorite gaffe of the night: - 23/10/2012 06:07:19 AM 545 Views
It was a poorly worded statement, the "sea" being referred to is the Med, but essentially correct. - 23/10/2012 07:16:37 PM 531 Views
What is this, the 19th century? Why is the Med so important? - 23/10/2012 10:20:11 PM 540 Views
They want holidays in the sun, too - 24/10/2012 05:32:44 AM 487 Views
Commercial, Iran doesn't have a navy worth mentioning. - 24/10/2012 03:41:46 PM 529 Views
Okay, commercial, that narrows it down. How, exactly? - 24/10/2012 06:02:01 PM 503 Views
Right family (Hussein of Jordan), wrong generation by a few hundered years. - 25/10/2012 06:16:51 PM 542 Views
Hm. Curious who you mean, then. - 25/10/2012 11:52:06 PM 534 Views
You are too hung up on a "port" - 26/10/2012 03:13:59 PM 455 Views
That's what Romney and you said, isn't it? Access to the Mediterranean. - 26/10/2012 11:30:55 PM 630 Views
Re: That's what Romney and you said, isn't it? Access to the Mediterranean. - 29/10/2012 02:23:33 PM 552 Views
Well, you get points for stubbornness, that's for sure. - 29/10/2012 03:26:50 PM 867 Views
and one he seems to keep making - how many times do you give someone the benefit of the doubt? - 23/10/2012 11:46:55 PM 584 Views
it is simply a standard descriptive line. - 24/10/2012 03:54:49 PM 568 Views
What is? - 25/10/2012 11:15:28 AM 458 Views
that was my favorite as well. *NM* - 23/10/2012 08:10:36 PM 218 Views
These debates need a stat boy, PTI style. - 23/10/2012 06:43:02 AM 516 Views
I favor tasering them - 23/10/2012 06:46:43 AM 484 Views
Few people use zingers to decide who they will vote for - 26/10/2012 06:11:50 PM 473 Views

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