Re: We don't know that about Compulsion - we are talking about 2 different ways to deal
Datakim Send a noteboard - 12/08/2010 08:21:32 PM
What we know, as Nynaeve demonstrated, is that trying to remove the effects of Compulsion using the Power is tricky and can damage the victim.
We don't know if simply nullifying the weave would have the same effect. I would say that the best way to test this would be to send the victim of Compulsion into a stedding to see if the weave was effected. That would imply the effect was from a tied off web (which seems to be the case given the evidence Nynaeve found).
We don't know if simply nullifying the weave would have the same effect. I would say that the best way to test this would be to send the victim of Compulsion into a stedding to see if the weave was effected. That would imply the effect was from a tied off web (which seems to be the case given the evidence Nynaeve found).
Then why did LTT/Rand not do that? Why ask Nynaeve to perform an extremely delicate operation that could fail due to her lack of knowledge and which took nearly an hour, when all that was required was a quick gateway next to a stedding and pushing the boy inside?
Regardless, the question this brings up has more to do with the scene: Why bother removing the Compulsion from Elza at all? The nature of her self justification made her want to do anything necessary to see Rand go to the Last Battle so he could be defeated by the Dark One. It wouldn't have interfered with freeing Semirhage and removing the wards since those actions are direct ways to accomplish the goal.
Did SH know exactly what orders Elza had been given? We readers may know what orders Verin gave, how Elza interpreted them and that it may not have been required. But even if SH could see the weaves, he might not be able to tell what commands were given. From shadows POV, it would have been better to play it safe in such case, rather than risk having some hidden compulsion command kick in at the worst moment and ruin everything.
I think this scene is noteworthy for what it reveals of Shaidar Harans' limitations and less so because of how the weaves' effects were dealt with.
I should add that BS has also said or atleast implied that SH's power cutting trick only works on those who have sworn themselves to the shadow. This would mean that even if SH can disrupt tied off weaves of darkfriends, he would not have been able to do so for Cadsuanes weaves since she has not sworn to the shadow. He needed Elza to go and break the wards. The compulsion on Elza was made by a DF (Verin) yes, but again instantly nullifying it could have killed Elza as was said earlier. Bottom line is that as of yet, we don't know the full extent of SH's abilities.
Who betrayed Cadsuane by stealing the male adam and CK?
12/08/2010 09:49:32 AM
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it's been discussed a lot
12/08/2010 11:00:06 AM
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Really? All the questions it poses?
12/08/2010 11:06:11 AM
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Havent seen this exact discussion before either.. *NM*
12/08/2010 11:06:45 AM
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see my further reply =oP I'm 13% less of a jerkface than it looks *NM*
12/08/2010 12:10:28 PM
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Re: Really? All the questions it poses?
12/08/2010 11:56:26 AM
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not really
12/08/2010 02:08:41 PM
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Yep, pretty much. Otherwise he could have just nullified the Compulsions' lingering effect on Elza
12/08/2010 02:11:24 PM
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As demonstrated in TGS...
12/08/2010 05:27:21 PM
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We don't know that about Compulsion - we are talking about 2 different ways to deal with that weave
12/08/2010 07:16:30 PM
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Re: We don't know that about Compulsion - we are talking about 2 different ways to deal
12/08/2010 08:21:32 PM
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Re: We don't know that about Compulsion - we are talking about 2 different ways to deal
12/08/2010 08:32:41 PM
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Re: We don't know that about Compulsion - we are talking about 2 different ways to deal
13/08/2010 06:51:45 AM
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I replied to the topic before you edited to ask all the extra questions
12/08/2010 12:08:27 PM
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Both Bair and Sorilea knew
12/08/2010 10:33:59 PM
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Re: Who betrayed Cadsuane by stealing the male adam and CK?
12/08/2010 02:43:23 PM
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Re: Who betrayed Cadsuane by stealing the male adam and CK?
12/08/2010 05:42:00 PM
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Re: Who betrayed Cadsuane by stealing the male adam and CK?
12/08/2010 08:06:25 PM
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Re: Who betrayed Cadsuane by stealing the male adam and CK?
12/08/2010 08:20:44 PM
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Re: Who betrayed Cadsuane by stealing the male adam and CK?
12/08/2010 08:32:21 PM
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Who most wanted to get rid of Cadsuane BESIDES Rand?
12/08/2010 09:01:44 PM
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Can't be Sorilea
13/08/2010 11:50:53 AM
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Re: Can't be Sorilea
13/08/2010 08:46:02 PM
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Re: Can't be Sorilea
14/08/2010 12:00:40 AM
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Re: Can't be Sorilea
14/08/2010 12:34:18 AM
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Not necessarily, Sorilea still could have watched Cadsuane untie the weaves
15/08/2010 01:53:27 AM
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Re: Not necessarily, Sorilea still could have watched Cadsuane untie the weaves
15/08/2010 12:53:42 PM
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I think that Couladin was a dark friend.
13/08/2010 03:00:20 AM
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I'd be surprised, actually.
13/08/2010 05:34:13 AM
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Couladin and Asmodean
13/08/2010 08:33:38 AM
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Re: Couladin and Asmodean
13/08/2010 04:45:21 PM
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Couldin isn't intolerant. He's murderously xenophobic.
14/08/2010 05:45:15 PM
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Almost ALL of the Aiel were murderously Xenophobic before Rand united them. *NM*
15/08/2010 01:00:37 PM
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Noone betrayed 'Cadsuane'-That was just a happy side affect (for the DO)
15/08/2010 08:22:59 AM
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*Sigh* it is 2:20 AM so this is a double post. (You can ignore this one) *NM* *NM*
15/08/2010 08:23:49 AM
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