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Re: Bitching about Daigian rAndy aL Send a noteboard - 18/04/2010 08:11:52 AM
I was thoroughly satisfied with the death of Daigian. In the first place, no big loss. Just about the weakest of the Aes Sedai, she had little use as a channeler. The one thing that supposedly recommended her was her allegedly sharp mind, but we see little evidence of that, and some hindsight from Cadsuane suggesting that mind works much better in a sterile environment than trying to cope with the real world, especially with urgent issues in a crisis.


Well, if you're going to judge her solely on her ability to further the cause, then you are right. She can't do much. Of course, the reason we see little evidence of her sharp mind is that nobody would ever listen to her.

Further, her personality, the little we saw of it, was unpleasant. Universally described by non-sisters who could be bothered as arrogant, she is entirely different around other Aes Sedai, standing as she does well at the bottom of their absurd hierarchy. In other words, she's one of those smarmy, cowardly, on her knees or in your face types, who bullies those she can get away with, but sucks up to those whom she cannot. It cannot simply be written off as adjusting to the necessities that the Aes Sedai system imposes, since we see other women who are strong not be obnoxious to non-channelers or their inferiors as overcompensation, we see lower-standing women clash with their betters as best as they can, or act deferential while still managing to assert themselves as they can. If Daigian was so smart than her apparent habit of silence and servility meant she refrained from properly identifying a correct course of action unless she was asked, adding passive-aggression to her faults.


Funny. That paragraph would probably describe most Aes Sedai, excepting those that stand so high that they are never deferential, and those that are pretending to not be Aes Sedai at the time. It's a rare Aes Sedai who doesn't act arrogant to non-channelers unless she wants something, so I'm not sure who you were thinking of. Some AS are devious enough to clash with their "betters", but many are not. Like the AS who started obeying an 18 year old because she stands higher. You also seem to blame Daigian for not knowing a way out of her predictament. Classy.

All in all, however, what made her death so satisfying and appropriate was the circumstances. Back in WH, he see in a brief glimpse of her at the Cleansing, that she made all sorts of errors for no good reason. In the first place, she went along with Cadsuane's absurd decision that she should lead her circle, which Cadsuane's reflection afterwards is as close as she comes at that point to admitting a mistake by noting that Whites are not as used to the realities of combat as Greens. It is worth noting that the Green sister in her circle was immediately suspicious of Aran'gar. Is Beldeine a paranoid bitch who got lucky? Not unless well-dressed women commonly get lost riding alone near Shadar Logoth! The very appearance of an unknown human being should have had ANYONE with an ounce of common sense wary and getting ready to fight. And Daigian was charged with guarding the most important feat of channeling in 3,000 years from an anticipated attack by the Forsaken! What the hell did she THINK she was doing? Going on a Sunday stroll? Where did she think she was? In a park in Tar Valon or a forest near one of the most dangerous locations south of the Blight? Yet, from the PoV of her Warder, we get no such indications of wariness or alertness to danger, just a revelation that she is holding as little of the Power from the strongest channeler in her circle as she can manage! Quite aside from the fact that with a link being said to act as a buffer, we can assume she will not suffer the consequences of the taint herself, quite aside the usual gamble that drawing on saidin at the time is, it is also probably the last time anyone will have to take that risk, so she can't be bothered to take one for the team? Taking one for the team is exactly what Eben did when he leaped at Aran'gar. Why did he do that? Because he had no control over his channeling ability, and despite channeling being an act of will and thus automatically faster than human reflexes, she still was not prepared to fight! How many competant channelers have we seen in the series, feeling suspicion through a link and Warder bond, would have been beaten to the draw by a man jumping? Eban moved his body faster than she could move flows to attack! The ONLY way that could have happened is if she is so colossally unprepared that she is the next thing to useless in a fight. Whatever valid reasons oe might bring up for minimizing your draw of saidin in most circumstances, THESE WERE NOT MOST CIRCUMSTANCES. Daigian's lack of saidin in that situation is like a group of people traveling in enemy territory, the only soldier among them with any experience fighting that particular enemy is disarmed, and an ivory tower academic is carrying all the weapons. Despite the bitching of a more military oriented colleague, she insists on keeping the weapons herself, and refuses to draw her rifle. She insists on keeping it slung over her shoulder because it is too unpleasant to carry in her hand, as the sunlight makes the metal too hot, and the grip feels unpleasantly tacky, and she doesn't like the kick from the recoil, so she's just going to carry it on her back, with the safety on, despite the expected presence of enemy attackers. And then when they meet someone who cannot possibly have an innocent reason for being there, she still does not draw, despite the certain suspicion of her companions, because the person COULD turn out to be an non-enemy (even though only an enemy would have the means to physically be present in her state).


Well, we already know Daigian was a bad choice to lead a circle. I still think you made a couple of strange assertions in that though.

You think that a circle would protect Aes Sedai from the taint. Why? They were clearly able to feel it, because they were able to later confirm that saidin was cleansed.

You also think that channeling somehow bypasses human reaction times. It might be quicker than drawing a sword, but Daigian would still have to percieve the threat and react to it. Just because it doesn't require any phisical actions doesn't make it instant.

Lets face it, Warders typically have faster reactions than their Aes Sedai with their actual combat training. How many Aes Sedai would beat their warders to the punch? Not many; I can't think of a single example.

Daigian's absolutely atrocious preparation at the Cleansing resulted in her Warder being killed. He died doing the only thing he could, and it was the only thing he could because she was the one with the primary (if not sole) responsibility for acting and failed to do so in time. While we cannot assert that Eben would have survived had he prepared better, it is common sense and NOT hindsight that says Daigian SHOULD have done a great deal more than she did. She could not have been any less prepared short of putting on a blindfold, or refusing to move from the hilltop where they started out.


Ok, so you put the person with absolutely no combat experience and very little real world experiecne in charge, give her the only weapon, and then act surprised when something goes wrong and blame her?

And the appropriateness of her death? Daigian was killed in Semirhage's escape solely because she did not have a warder. Those sisters with Warder bonds were rendered unconscious so their deaths would not alert their Warders. Had Daigian still been bonded to Eben, she would have survived the escape as the other sisters did! Her fecklessness at the Cleansing cost Eben his life, and for possibly the very first time in the serious an Aes Sedai's idiocy in endangering others through her arrogance has direct and lethal consequences for her!


Lack of knowledge and experience, not arrogance.

I like.


I'm not surprised.
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The most appropriate death in the book... - 17/04/2010 08:58:29 PM 1102 Views
I don't really agree at all - 18/04/2010 07:56:59 AM 595 Views
Re: Bitching about Daigian - 18/04/2010 08:11:52 AM 597 Views
Re: Bitching about Daigian - 20/04/2010 09:50:30 PM 419 Views
Re: Bitching about Daigian - 20/04/2010 10:46:28 PM 396 Views
I thought Semirhage was the most appropriate death. - 20/04/2010 09:48:30 PM 298 Views
Mmm, I disagree, slightly. - 20/04/2010 11:17:40 PM 288 Views
I think the issue is that she spends more time getting her pleasure. - 21/04/2010 03:13:24 PM 285 Views

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