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I wasn't intending a SAYING, just a statement. Joel Send a noteboard - 11/06/2010 05:24:58 PM
Beward of Greeks bearing gifts.

While sayings are fun, they don't mean much.

Hopefully the quote in question will be along shortly; if not, you should go read The Silver Crown anyway (but not before the first two. )
If you must speak, do so with the understanding uninformed opinions on emotional subjects often provoke annoyance. I would like it noted in passing, however, that there's a difference between saying a POST is stupid and saying a POSTER is. :whistle:

I think bringing child sex trafficking into a post about an oil leak is a sign of stupidity. The first reply was stupid, the follow up showed stupidity by the poster.

I'll leave that between the two of you. I think the comparison no more ill conceived than the suggestion is was a good idea to draw conclusions on little to no data. If nothing else, you'd have thought by now I'd given sufficient object lessons in how dangerous that is to discourage it. ;)
In fact, I've still not seen it explained what was stupid in Foxhead's post, just unrelated, angry ranting and insulting.

As I said, it was, IMHO, ill advised to venture a conclusion while simultaneously admitting general ignorance about the subject. That's tantamount to saying, "smack me upside the head with the facts; I like it. :)"
Was it really being "controlled" by more than one person? I sincerely doubt BP simply gave Transocean a free hand in much of anything. They paid a pretty penny for that lease, after all, and the sheer volume of the spill shows how rich it was. Not to mention that whatever services they may be purchasing from Transocean they almost certainly expect to be performed according to instructions. "Here's a large sum of money; do what you please on our oil lease--while our employees watch mutely.... " <img class=' />2' /> As to the equipment itself, the main thing we know is that had never had this problem before now, and that it had already been cited several times by the Coast Guard for leaks in the weeks leading up to the explosion (one theory as to why the blowout preventer failed is that it lacked hydraulic pressure due to a leak of its own. )

BP were in a joint operation of which they were the majority (I think 65% is quoted).

According to Wikipedia, "BP is the operator and principal developer of the Macondo Prospect with 65% of interest, while 25% is owned by Anadarko Petroleum Corporation, and 10% by MOEX Offshore 2007, a unit of Mitsui. " The Macondo Prospect is just that, an expanse of seabed thought to contain petroleum, the drilling rights to which BP leased from the US government, evidently along with several other companies who've not been otherwise mentioned in connection with Deepwater Horizon. BPs interest in what Deepwater Horizon pumped out of the Gulf was 100%. Wikipedia also notes that "On March 10, 2010, a BP executive e-mailed the Minerals Management Service [the part of the Interior Dept. from which they obtained the lease] that there was a stuck pipe and well control situation at the drilling site, and that BP would have to plugback the well.[32] A draft of a BP memo in April warned that the cementing of the casing was unlikely to be successful.[26] Halliburton has said that it had finished cementing 20 hours before the fire, but had not yet set the final cement plug.[14][33] A special nitrogen-foamed cement was used which is more difficult to handle than standard cement.[31]"

I've seen no indication of further involvement by Halliburton, and their role was nearly complete when the explosion happened.

According to an Atlantic article linked there, Transoceans contributions seem to be in the vein of "Are you fucking happy? Are you fucking happy? The rig's on fire! I told you this was gonna happen."

http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2010/06/the-rigs-on-fire-i-told-you-this-was-gonna-happen/57775/

Tansocean are an offshore drilling contractor - BP were using them for that reason... they have experience and knowledge BP wanted.

Yet appear to have disregarded.
The thing is at the moment this is a mess with a lot of people involved in it - until it has been properly investigated it isn't possible to know

Fair enough. But the liability is with the company that leased the site, leased the rig and performed the operations.
Actually, what went wrong, in terms of assigning damages, is only relevant in so far as it bears on who's responsible. And BP has been rather half hearted in its own attempts to shift blame to contractors and regulators, which speaks volumes, though I do give them credit for at least trying. This is BPs baby and they'll have to rock it, like it or not.

Well of course, that is rather the point in finding out what went wrong in terms of blame - was it something BP controlled or was it controlled by something else? (most obviously Transocean or Haliburton messing up with something they were responsible for).

Every "on the scene" account I've seen so far paints the picture of BP executives overruling the safety concerns of either their own employees or Transoceans.
Given the amount of abuse coming at BP from the Obama downwards, it doesn't matter right now who is actually responsible - they just need to keep their head down and ride it out because if it is another company who messed up then pointing it out just means BP get beaten more for trying to finger point. Much better to wait it out and let a proper investigation sort it out than get caught up anymore in the blood hungry mob than they have to.
Dear heaven, was this REALLY only the second post made on the CMB since mine? How incredibly depressing.... :(

'tis slow;)

So it would seem.
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LoL. Be well, RAFOlk.
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Bailout for BP? - 10/06/2010 08:28:17 AM 764 Views
this government won't bail out BP - 10/06/2010 08:43:01 AM 357 Views
A bail out is highly unlikely - 10/06/2010 12:52:53 PM 289 Views
In response to: "pipes leak, it happens" - 10/06/2010 02:41:17 PM 486 Views
Would it be totally wrong to have such an award? - 10/06/2010 03:11:06 PM 468 Views
17% of funds weren't in BP - 10/06/2010 04:19:19 PM 292 Views
Ah, gotcha, that makes more sense, sorry. - 10/06/2010 05:11:58 PM 420 Views
A minor point I realise - 10/06/2010 04:34:13 PM 419 Views
Ironic - 10/06/2010 03:27:12 PM 443 Views
The end of that still sounds like "it's the bank fault I robbed them,'cos their security's so bad. " - 11/06/2010 01:33:44 PM 482 Views
Except it isn't really like that, is it? - 11/06/2010 02:27:56 PM 376 Views
Honestly? Foxhead was in trouble soon as he said (basically) "I know naught of this, but think... " - 11/06/2010 02:54:37 PM 360 Views
Seems so, given lyringlas is an idiot. As his replies have shown. - 11/06/2010 03:04:28 PM 383 Views
*shrugs* If you don't know, don't speak. - 11/06/2010 03:57:25 PM 438 Views
Never look a gift horse in the mouth - 11/06/2010 04:29:16 PM 470 Views
I wasn't intending a SAYING, just a statement. - 11/06/2010 05:24:58 PM 435 Views
if you don't know, ask - 12/06/2010 02:23:47 PM 277 Views
You really are an idiot. - 13/06/2010 06:55:21 AM 287 Views
and you are beyond communicating with - 13/06/2010 10:21:09 AM 350 Views
"pipes leak, it happens" - 14/06/2010 04:38:09 AM 277 Views
Fair enough. - 14/06/2010 02:03:21 AM 398 Views
you know i went back to my post just to see exactly how it was i pissed you off - 10/06/2010 04:40:50 PM 425 Views
Gosh, I wonder how you might have pissed him off. - 10/06/2010 11:26:18 PM 397 Views
Re: this government won't bail out BP - 10/06/2010 05:00:36 PM 419 Views
Also, I'm pretty shocked by this quote - 10/06/2010 01:09:09 PM 323 Views
Anthony Weiner is anything but a sensible democrat congressman. *NM* - 10/06/2010 04:18:21 PM 222 Views
Yeah, I was wondering about that - never heard of him before. *NM* - 10/06/2010 04:24:10 PM 123 Views
bailouts are meant to stop a failure from spreading - 10/06/2010 04:49:30 PM 272 Views
Things you might want to consider. Especially Americans - 10/06/2010 06:00:06 PM 424 Views
I was thinking some very similar things earlier today. - 10/06/2010 06:08:44 PM 411 Views
Transocean is Swiss, actually. w/ EDIT - 10/06/2010 07:09:22 PM 303 Views
In name, not in reality - 10/06/2010 07:14:26 PM 282 Views
True, Switzerland isn't known for its deepwater oil drilling. *NM* - 10/06/2010 07:38:09 PM 203 Views
Only to the extent relevant. - 11/06/2010 01:58:10 PM 468 Views

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