sorry not interested in arguing rhetoric *NM*
random thoughts Send a noteboard - 22/09/2011 09:01:04 PM
Karpinski, the commander at Abu Ghraib, expressed in correspondence with her superiors her serious concerns that DoD policy and the orders she received as a result of that policy were in violation of the Geneva Convention. Her concerns were dismissed and she confronted the all too familiar dilemma of disobeying her orders at the risk of a court martial or following them at the same risk; the rest, as they say, is history.
If she had been following her orders she would have been OK. As for free fire zones is that from the same hearing where Kerry talked about his Christmas in Cambodia?
That is <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free-fire_zone">from the US Army Field Manual</a>, though it has come up at Congressional hearings, for obvious reasons. Part of supporting the troops means not demanding they violate their own military as well as international law, even when they object on those grounds, then leaving them to twist in the wind and/or scapegoating them when it becomes public knowledge. "Following orders" is never an excuse for war crimes, but the complicity of those who follow orders to commit atrocities does not exonerate commanders who give those orders, nor civilian politicians who establish them as systemic policy. That is like executing a mob hit man for murder while ignoring the capo who hired him and dozens of others to repeatedly and routinely commit murder.
Politicians can no more be trusted with unaccountable military authority than with unaccountable taxing authority; that is probably Vietnams chief lesson.
This message last edited by random thoughts on 22/09/2011 at 09:01:28 PM
USMC first to fight
- 21/09/2011 03:36:17 PM
1217 Views
In my imagination it went down something like this:
- 21/09/2011 04:22:08 PM
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There could be some truth to that
- 21/09/2011 04:34:36 PM
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They need military chaplains, right? *NM*
- 21/09/2011 04:36:06 PM
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not in the marines
- 21/09/2011 04:45:48 PM
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I had a friend who was a Navy chaplain attached to the Marine Corps.
- 21/09/2011 07:23:10 PM
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I thought nothing could make the Swedish "dress blues" look worse than it already does.
- 21/09/2011 04:40:08 PM
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Very interesting, but encouraging.
- 21/09/2011 08:28:38 PM
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The answer on women in combat:
- 21/09/2011 10:07:04 PM
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I still worry about how the men will react.
- 22/09/2011 02:33:15 AM
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Well, you can worry about what might happen.
- 22/09/2011 09:17:02 AM
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and how much actual combat have these units seen?
- 22/09/2011 02:40:50 PM
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Sweden has not been involved in many hot conflicts during those years, no
- 22/09/2011 05:04:26 PM
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The real test will be when a country with a non-discriminatory military fights a major war.
- 22/09/2011 04:00:12 PM
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The other branches could benefit in a lot of ways by trying to emulate the Marines
- 22/09/2011 03:25:16 PM
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- 22/09/2011 03:25:16 PM
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Probably.
- 22/09/2011 04:33:49 PM
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The Lynndie England case makes my point
- 22/09/2011 06:16:32 PM
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The Lynndie England case is debatable.
- 22/09/2011 07:28:53 PM
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sorry not interested in arguing rhetoric *NM*
- 22/09/2011 09:01:04 PM
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The US Army Field Manual is policy, not rhetoric.
- 22/09/2011 09:44:58 PM
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no Joel the rheotoric is all you
- 22/09/2011 10:45:29 PM
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Quoting someone is not rhetoric; I am honestly flabbergasted that we are still debating that fact.
- 22/09/2011 11:12:29 PM
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This kind of reminds me of Full Metal Jacket...
- 21/09/2011 10:49:57 PM
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Re: This kind of reminds me of Full Metal Jacket...
- 21/09/2011 11:14:38 PM
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"I bet you could suck a golfball through a garden hose" was NOT a compliment?
- 22/09/2011 11:25:43 PM
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- 22/09/2011 11:25:43 PM
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The only really great thing about that movies is he sounded so much like a drill instructor
- 22/09/2011 03:01:13 PM
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I doubt the sort of person who is interested in the Marines will particularly care about being PC
*NM*
- 22/09/2011 10:34:11 PM
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*NM*
- 22/09/2011 10:34:11 PM
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no but they care a lot about having PC forced on the them which happens all the time
- 22/09/2011 10:41:13 PM
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