You'd think a thread about the death of Kim Jong-Il, by any reasonable definition himself a militant atheist, wouldn't be the wisest time and place for heavy handed rhetoric reminding everyone that militant atheism tends to often involve active efforts to attack other people's personal beliefs. Considering the almost jaw-dropping correlation of publicly atheist leadership to brutal and generally inefficient, irrational, and paranoid rule the last thing a rational person would want to do is go around drawing parallels between themselves and the deranged, brutal pygmy madman. But we still have around half a dozen posters in the thread who seem more interested in discussing the perceived downsides of non-atheism then the joyous death of the homicidal dictator. You'd think common sense would dictate a conversion method that relied on calm, polite, and generally respectful language as opposed to language that implied the only reason they don't do conversions by the sword is they don't have enough of them, particularly in a thread talking about a guy who did do just that. You'd also think they'd be a bit leery of basing so much of their arguments on psychology, not exactly viewed as the hardest and most reliable of sciences, particularly mere months after Stapel's fraud was uncovered.
I actually do happen to agree - in part or principle anyway - with a good portions of the arguments raised in this thread. I'm just a bit shocked that so very few militant atheists seem interested in pursuing their own agenda in what one would consider the most effective and thus rational way. I have difficulty thinking of any group that sucks that bad at maintaining a good public image, and seems so willfully blind to how many potential converts they probably lose just by maintaining a paradox of demanding rational thought on everything while acting in an apparently irrational fashion in their every memorable public interaction. Particularly considering the well-known concept of one bad incident needing a dozen good ones to override it. It's hard to get behind a cause as rational and civilized when most of its torchbearer's seem intent not just on setting other people's houses on fire but soaking themselves in kerosene while their at it. "Why don't you trust and respect me you irrational, delusional idiots!" has just never struck me as rational debate tactic.
I actually do happen to agree - in part or principle anyway - with a good portions of the arguments raised in this thread. I'm just a bit shocked that so very few militant atheists seem interested in pursuing their own agenda in what one would consider the most effective and thus rational way. I have difficulty thinking of any group that sucks that bad at maintaining a good public image, and seems so willfully blind to how many potential converts they probably lose just by maintaining a paradox of demanding rational thought on everything while acting in an apparently irrational fashion in their every memorable public interaction. Particularly considering the well-known concept of one bad incident needing a dozen good ones to override it. It's hard to get behind a cause as rational and civilized when most of its torchbearer's seem intent not just on setting other people's houses on fire but soaking themselves in kerosene while their at it. "Why don't you trust and respect me you irrational, delusional idiots!" has just never struck me as rational debate tactic.
The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift.
- Albert Einstein
King of Cairhien 20-7-2
Chancellor of the Landsraad, Archduke of Is'Mod
- Albert Einstein
King of Cairhien 20-7-2
Chancellor of the Landsraad, Archduke of Is'Mod
Kim Jong-il is dead. Would you become a fervent believer?
- 19/12/2011 03:37:28 AM
1842 Views
If I was a Christian, I'd pray that he would burn forever in hell.
- 19/12/2011 03:47:52 AM
1268 Views
See, I can't be an atheist.
- 19/12/2011 03:53:55 AM
1220 Views
I agree about atheism
- 19/12/2011 04:19:02 AM
1177 Views
It's an approximation.
- 19/12/2011 05:40:05 PM
1133 Views
no, I'm not saying that the sheer number of people alone is sufficient
- 19/12/2011 10:13:09 PM
1009 Views
No, Pascal's Wager is stupid.
- 19/12/2011 03:09:42 PM
1102 Views
You obviously misread my comments or ignored them.
- 19/12/2011 03:39:59 PM
1131 Views
You're answering a different point to the one I was addressing.
- 19/12/2011 04:01:54 PM
1028 Views
For atheism to be a tenable position, one must assume that millions lie about their experiences.
- 20/12/2011 04:11:53 AM
1115 Views
Look, doesn't this go against your most sacred principle?
- 20/12/2011 06:43:27 AM
1069 Views
No, it doesn't.
- 20/12/2011 08:30:55 PM
981 Views
Re: No, it doesn't.
- 20/12/2011 09:21:22 PM
1039 Views
This militant atheism is somewhat amusing.
- 20/12/2011 09:48:57 PM
1039 Views
... somewhat irrational at times too
- 21/12/2011 01:22:54 AM
960 Views
Huh?
- 21/12/2011 10:47:06 AM
1005 Views
That's somewhat unrelated to the intended point of the post
- 21/12/2011 12:41:49 PM
1023 Views
My "Huh?" was at your claim that any reasonable definition Kim Jong-il was a millitant athiest
- 21/12/2011 12:58:44 PM
983 Views
You're objecting to me calling the Military Dictator militant?
- 21/12/2011 03:13:35 PM
1072 Views
Your position isn't rational nor logical
- 20/12/2011 12:45:03 PM
1059 Views
I never stated it was either. That's the problem with spiritual matters.
- 20/12/2011 08:43:46 PM
970 Views
How about a faith atheist?
- 19/12/2011 04:28:59 PM
1166 Views
Nevermind. It appears you answered that in your reply to Tim. *NM*
- 19/12/2011 04:32:19 PM
573 Views
Re: See, I can't be an atheist.
- 19/12/2011 04:57:23 PM
1097 Views
It's impossible to tell if worshipping a false god would be worse than worshipping no god at all.
- 20/12/2011 04:14:59 AM
929 Views
Sounds like you must be a modern-day prophet
- 19/12/2011 05:24:24 PM
949 Views
Idiocy. Confirmation bias doesn't explain away external phenomena.
- 20/12/2011 04:19:10 AM
1065 Views
Well.
- 21/12/2011 01:49:36 PM
1072 Views
I didn't forget about it. I was getting ready to give up on it.
- 21/12/2011 02:27:18 PM
963 Views
Also, learn to use the subjunctive. It's "if I WERE a Christian..."
- 19/12/2011 03:54:20 AM
1056 Views
The sad thing about that comment...
- 19/12/2011 04:52:57 AM
1181 Views
I'm pretty sure there's plenty of middle ground between those two examples
- 19/12/2011 05:31:13 PM
973 Views
- 19/12/2011 05:31:13 PM
973 Views
Tom, I think this means you should take up ForEx trading. *NM*
- 19/12/2011 04:00:20 AM
493 Views
I might. I'm close enough to it as is. I just did some ForEx ISDAs for clients...
- 19/12/2011 04:03:11 AM
1159 Views
I thought you were asking if I believed in KJ-I, the Eternal Leader
- 19/12/2011 06:55:08 AM
959 Views
The article I just read said he died on Saturday.
- 19/12/2011 08:58:17 AM
1034 Views
Yeah, he actually died on a train Saturday morning before Tom made the comment. *NM*
- 19/12/2011 09:13:44 PM
453 Views
I'm not claiming causality. And, for the record, I first made the comment on Friday afternoon.
- 20/12/2011 04:25:07 AM
1037 Views
You know what's really weird?
- 19/12/2011 11:32:23 AM
1037 Views
They took it down, apparently. *NM*
- 20/12/2011 04:40:24 AM
481 Views
Not surprising, still in the revisions if anyone wants to see of course
- 20/12/2011 11:06:05 AM
1229 Views
He's not dead-dead. Neither is his father. Just ask the North Koreans.
- 19/12/2011 04:23:48 PM
1012 Views
Re: He's not dead-dead. Neither is his father. Just ask the North Koreans.
- 19/12/2011 09:15:09 PM
962 Views
The problem with predictions that come true
- 19/12/2011 05:28:24 PM
1075 Views
I don't make a lot of predictions. *NM*
- 19/12/2011 08:18:53 PM
613 Views
Well you should start at least journaling the ones that you do make.
- 19/12/2011 08:40:18 PM
1017 Views
I actually now do tell my friends when I have dreams that have the "feel" to them.
- 20/12/2011 04:36:07 AM
1104 Views
I can attest to the fact that this conversation took place on Facebook Saturday.
- 19/12/2011 09:19:06 PM
967 Views
Yes, TMJ, you also contributed in this case. *NM*
- 20/12/2011 04:38:42 AM
462 Views
Jeez, I hope I never get on your bad side
- 20/12/2011 12:06:54 AM
923 Views
- 20/12/2011 12:06:54 AM
923 Views
Things did change for the better with Stalin's death.
- 20/12/2011 02:51:12 AM
1005 Views
So I guess you want me to destroy the voodoo doll I have of you? Oh wait...never mind.
*NM*
- 20/12/2011 04:37:35 AM
452 Views
*NM*
- 20/12/2011 04:37:35 AM
452 Views

*NM*