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For once, your main criticism is the same one that I see in many reviews in the media. Legolas Send a noteboard - 12/11/2021 11:45:16 AM

As in, the problem of introducing way too many new characters all at once and expect viewers to immediately be invested in what happens to them. For me personally the movie worked reasonably well, but certainly it's a valid point - and it doesn't help that the credits scenes are introducing even more new characters, when so many of the existing ones have had so little character development yet.

Also, the character's names are spelled Ikaris and Sersi, respectively - in fact, until reading your review, I hadn't even thought of the Sersi-Circe link (in my native language, we pronounce Circe in a way much closer to the original Greek, so not like 'Sersi' at all). And while I did obviously notice the Icarus/Ikaris thing, I'd actually managed to miss the whole flying into the sun thing... that one, I have no excuse for.


View original post- There is the strong suggestion that the legends and stories about gods and heroes with similar names to the Eternals were inspired by the actual feats of the Eternals themselves. So the legend of Icarus, whose father invented wings but cautioned him against flying too high, which he ignored, resulting in his wings being destroyed by the sun causing him to plummet to his death, is inspired by a guy with no wings, who flies under his own power and shoots energy beams from his eyes and has zero connection to the sun. So how or why did that legend come about? How does it fit in with the conceits of the movie? There is no Watsonian reason to call him "Icarus" just the Doylist one with regard to his ultimate fate.

The similarities don't go all that far beyond the flying part, true - but then, the same goes for the others. Thena's character doesn't bear much resemblance to that of the Greek goddess Athena, either, other than both being female warriors. They aren't supposed to be very close parallels.
View original post- Speaking of his ultimate fate, it's all basically in reverse. Icarus commits no acts of hubris or disobedience that results in his death. It's just the opposite. He remains a good soldier, obeying his orders and carrying out his mission almost to the end and flies into the sun on his own power, in an act of deliberate self-destruction, which lacks a clear motive. Is it guilt over what he almost did? He pulled out at the last minute and is no more or less guilty than any of the rest of the crew. Or is it because he's lost his girlfriend?

I interpreted it as a combination of guilt for his betrayal of his orders, and simply not seeing any path forward as he can neither go back to Arishem, nor openly fight against him. But it's certainly left unusually vague, considering how radical a move it is. As you said, he's had probably the most character development out of the ten Eternals, and then he just goes and kills himself? Though I do wonder if that's actually the end of him - I wouldn't be surprised to see Ikaris again in an Eternals sequel, whether he actually survived that or is reborn somehow.
View original postOther problems are the rules under which the Eternals operate. Sometimes they are allowed to help humans advance, other times they are not. The inventor guy comes up with a steam engine in Babylon, and is told they are not ready for it, so he invents the plow instead. I kind of feel like they had plows before Babylon and also, I'm unclear how people could not be "ready" for steam power. The explanation for the rules under which the Eternals are constrained, which includes their being forbidden from engaging in conflicts with other than their designated foes, is that their true mission is to protect the growth of the human race as an energy source for the Celestial gestating inside the planet. So why did they not intervene to prevent Thanos from killing half the people they were protecting as a vital resource? Why not prevent the Chitauri from invading, or the convergence from doing whatever no-good-very-bad thing it was going to do to put the dark elves in charge? How did Dormamu's imminent threat to Earth fit in to the Celestials' plans? Did they not think that corralling 50% of the singularity stones which happened to end up on Earth might not be important to their project? And if all they needed was a critical mass of humans, why not introduce the appropriate technology right away, instead of waiting until the various revolutions relatively late in their tenure finally allowing the population to boom? Are we really supposed to believe the only thing threatening the Celestials' plan was their renegade guard dogs?

The plow thing was silly, yes - at best, it might have been a more efficient design for plows, not the invention of the whole concept. On the other points, it seems like generally Arishem has a pretty hands-off, big picture approach, thinking in a timescale of billions of years, so humanity needing some thousands of years to evolve isn't any particular concern. Of course, Thanos' snap that killed 50 percent of all beings in the universe, not just on earth, would have been a different matter, which indeed you'd think should have concerned Arishem more...
View original postSpeaking of the Deviants, that's another pointlessly introduced and massively underserved plot thread. Did the one suddenly becoming sapient have any real effect on the story?

Yeah, that was a wasted opportunity, alright.
View original postThe morals of the story are likewise retarded. Circe is allowed to run around transmuting primitive human objects into far superior ones or using her powers to help with the crops, and they are allowed to have families and relationships with humans, and this is all somehow not interfering? From any but a humanocentric perspective, there is a legitimate argument to be made about the necessity of the sacrifices to bring forth new Celestials, but no attempt is made to explore that. Icarus has a kind of a point, or at least legitimate reasons for his point of view given who and what he is. He especially has reason to feel betrayed by Ajak, but the movie never touches on the issues at play. Also one of the Eternals exists with no power other than controlling minds, which they others generally frown on him doing but take no steps to prevent him from repeatedly violating others with this power.

I wouldn't exactly say no attempt is made to explore that, or that Ikaris' position isn't given any credit at all - they do have some debate about it, but it's very brief, yes. As for the other thing, the idea is that after the last Deviants are - supposedly - destroyed at the fall of Tenochtitlan in the early 16th century, the Eternals go their separate ways and are generally allowed to do as they please, even interfering with humans, presumably within some boundaries but very wide ones - like, if Druig had started mind-controlling half the planet, they'd have interfered, but his village in the Amazon, they let slide. I don't really see anything especially illogical or immoral in that, given what their mission is (or at least, what most of them think their mission is).



View original postAll in all, it honestly feels like a bunch of random stuff thrown together that no one thought twice about, because they were so absorbed with shooting impressive landscapes.

I liked it well enough, in some ways more than e.g. most of the Iron Man movies, but definitely it has issues and probably should have been handled better. Perhaps by having a few Eternals show up in a different Marvel movie to help reduce the amount of exposition needed in this one, or maybe an Eternals TV series first before the movie. Or just a different approach to writing this movie.
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How many ways is the story of Icarus in "The Eternals" stupid? - 12/11/2021 05:04:26 AM 177 Views
For once, your main criticism is the same one that I see in many reviews in the media. - 12/11/2021 11:45:16 AM 82 Views
comics lore, only a single issue - 12/11/2021 02:15:12 PM 73 Views

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