Re: Heretics of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read)
DomA Send a noteboard - 29/04/2010 03:26:28 PM
wonder if Heretics of Dune was indeed conceived as the opener of a trilogy, as it had the feel of setting up situations and the chief participants more than it did as something that could be read semi-independently of the other novels.
It was the opener to a trilogy from the get go.
The "original" Dune was a duology, before it was decided to make Dune Messiah a book in itself and not last part of Dune.
Herbert much later decided to return to the Dune world with God-Emperor, which was a stand-alone in his mind (it became a bridge book onkly after the fact).
He decided later to tell the story of the result to Leto's plans, and that he did conceive of as a trilogy from the start, with the two first volumes published and the third one (which remains open ended in the Dune style, but less so than previous ones) outlined.
If you don't have the patience to suffer through the awfully written two-volumes Dune 7 by KJA-BH to dig up in the dross the concepts and ideas Herbert intended to explore through the ending (they are quite apparent still, especially after having read the other books so recently, though they aren't developped with anything near the intelligence of Frank), just ask and I'll tell you about what I remember. You read so fast that I almost recommend you pick the books, though. I found the ideas interesting enough, even if as novels this is real garbage.
Whatever you do, don't read the prequels, and definitely don't read them first. KJA-BH liberally stole from the outline of Dune 7 to "set things up", and setting things up in their mind was spoiling everything by extending every good idea into elaborate and boring storylines set thousands of years before., as they believed Frank's outline for Dune 7 was "too complex" and required much backstory (which was plainly wrong: Frank would have managed to include everyhting and make everything clear within a 300 or 400 pages book, but he just didn't spoon feed his readers as if they were dumb the way KJA does) What they achieved is that every idea in Dune 7 feels quite stale and predictable once you get there (and I don't mean it spoil the plot, I mean the way they bring them up through the prequels in a very b;ah and pedestrian way sort of ruin the ideas themselves...)
This message last edited by DomA on 29/04/2010 at 03:32:20 PM
Frank Herbert, Dune Chronicles (series reviews within)
- 16/04/2010 04:11:40 AM
2095 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune
- 16/04/2010 06:09:49 PM
1189 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune
- 17/04/2010 12:08:06 AM
1402 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune
- 17/04/2010 02:33:38 PM
1313 Views
Not all themes are intended by the author. That doesn't mean they aren't there.
- 17/04/2010 06:54:14 PM
1364 Views
Re: Not all themes are intended by the author. That doesn't mean they aren't there.
- 17/04/2010 10:44:18 PM
1217 Views
I was using a fairly precise term when I said "ecological"
- 18/04/2010 12:13:14 AM
1313 Views
Re: I was using a fairly precise term when I said "ecological"
- 18/04/2010 03:34:33 AM
1369 Views
Please read linked interview...as I call bullshit. Also, why are your walls white?
- 18/04/2010 05:18:07 AM
1175 Views
Re: Please read linked interview...as I call bullshit. Also, why are your walls white?
- 19/04/2010 06:15:26 PM
1231 Views
That was most of my issue.
- 21/04/2010 12:12:56 AM
1094 Views
Just because something plays a dominate role doesn't make it a theme
- 21/04/2010 02:09:42 PM
1183 Views
Thank you for saying concisely the point I have been trying to make. *NM*
- 21/04/2010 06:34:12 PM
499 Views
A theme is merely a dominant strain in a story; there can be more than one theme present
- 21/04/2010 11:21:38 PM
1126 Views
Re: A theme is merely a dominant strain in a story; there can be more than one theme present
- 22/04/2010 04:58:01 AM
1082 Views
Re: A theme is merely a dominant strain in a story; there can be more than one theme present
- 22/04/2010 04:08:28 PM
1017 Views
Texts have different interpretations and Readers emphasize different aspects
- 22/04/2010 09:28:05 PM
1146 Views
Re: Texts have different interpretations and Readers emphasize different aspects
- 23/04/2010 05:22:22 PM
1062 Views
Re: Just because something plays a dominate role doesn't make it a theme
- 29/04/2010 11:36:45 PM
1165 Views
Not really sure how Larry's definition is archaic.
- 19/04/2010 07:52:27 PM
1194 Views
Re: Not really sure how Larry's definition is archaic.
- 20/04/2010 07:04:40 PM
1069 Views
Your patronizing manner aside, that's not "archaic" at all.
- 21/04/2010 01:46:50 AM
963 Views
Re: Your patronizing manner aside, that's not "archaic" at all.
- 21/04/2010 06:23:24 PM
1207 Views
People who see this as an ecological book are missing the point of the book
- 16/04/2010 06:28:40 PM
1579 Views
Books can have more than one theme. Great books almost always do. *NM*
- 16/04/2010 07:15:11 PM
524 Views
I agree with that I just never really the ecological theme to Dune
- 16/04/2010 10:12:26 PM
1268 Views
There are several points to the book/series
- 17/04/2010 12:11:38 AM
1294 Views
Everyone get something different from a book
- 19/04/2010 07:01:51 PM
1468 Views
I believe those themes become more pronounced later in the series
- 20/04/2010 10:09:36 PM
1221 Views
I remember having hated every single character of this book. Some random thoughts
- 17/04/2010 05:08:25 PM
1392 Views
Well, I enjoyed more of the characters this time around, if that helps
- 18/04/2010 12:14:43 AM
1276 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune
- 17/04/2010 08:05:16 PM
1674 Views
I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom
- 17/04/2010 10:22:27 PM
1481 Views
- 17/04/2010 10:22:27 PM
1481 Views
Re: I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom
- 18/04/2010 04:38:10 AM
1479 Views
- 18/04/2010 04:38:10 AM
1479 Views
Re: I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom
- 19/04/2010 04:04:43 AM
1343 Views
- 19/04/2010 04:04:43 AM
1343 Views
Re: I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom
- 22/04/2010 04:31:26 AM
1098 Views
- 22/04/2010 04:31:26 AM
1098 Views
I thought all of Dune had begun as a serial in a SF magazine. *NM*
- 22/04/2010 01:58:22 PM
479 Views
Dune Messiah (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read)
- 19/04/2010 08:42:18 AM
1561 Views
Re: Dune Messiah (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read)
- 21/04/2010 03:33:46 PM
1098 Views
I didn't see that in Alia
- 21/04/2010 11:27:22 PM
1018 Views
There were a few scenes displaying Alia's abilities/mindset. (spoilers)
- 22/04/2010 03:54:32 PM
1008 Views
OK, that makes a bit more sense, as I wasn't for sure what you were arguing at first
- 22/04/2010 09:14:46 PM
1124 Views
One of my favorite series!
- 21/04/2010 03:30:57 PM
1005 Views
I didn't "miss it" as much as I chose to deemphasize it
- 21/04/2010 11:29:50 PM
932 Views
Re: I didn't "miss it" as much as I chose to deemphasize it
- 22/04/2010 04:02:26 PM
1040 Views
Heretics of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read)
- 28/04/2010 06:02:54 AM
985 Views
Re: Heretics of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read)
- 29/04/2010 03:26:28 PM
1077 Views
