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Re: (Mostly) on Slughorn, Narcissa and Fleur... Seriana Sedai Send a noteboard - 20/10/2010 09:46:08 PM
Slughorn...while he is the kind of person I detest in real life I find Slughorn oddly charming even when he is quite clearly only out for himself. I think he is the one who gives Harry the most information about Lily he's ever had. Well, until book 7, but definitely up to this point. Maybe I like Slughorn because he is clever. He is quick thinking and demonstrates it here in more than one way. Maybe I find it understandable that he would want to lay low, just not noble like most of our heroes in the series are. The musing can continue later I suppose.

He really incarnates the spirit of Slytherin, in a way. Ambitious, manipulative, preferring to pull the strings from the shadows instead of taking risks in the limelight. But unlike nearly everybody else in Slytherin (which is a big mistake on Rowling's part imho, but we'll get to that in due time, end of book seven), he's not on the evil side. He evidently has some remains of prejudice against Muggleborns, but isn't really set against them - kind of like how older people back in the day had this slightly dubious yet not really malevolently racist view of black people.

I was trying to think of a way to say the same thing, the not malevolently racist bit, but couldn't come up with anything. It's like a general attitude he has but he doesn't hold to it when someone is gifted like Lily or Dirk Creswell. I find it odd.

What's remarkable is that he has been on the run for a year, he says. So he must have expected Voldemort would try to recruit him long before Voldemort gave up his secrecy... interesting.

Dumbledore refers to his "considerable talents" and I think Slughorn is aware that he may be useful to Voldemort. Do you think this is arrogance on Slughorn's part or an astute observation and reaction?

Dumbledore...I feel a little conflicted about his dealing with Slughorn. We are clearly witnessing Dumbledore at his most manipulative, but I don't know what else he is to have done. He needs Slughorn close for a variety of reasons and the decision is ultimately left to Slughorn...I don't know. I like him a lot better in his broom closet conversation with Harry.

Manipulative isn't necessarily evil. Dumbledore plays dirty, perhaps, but Slughorn is old and wise enough to know he's being played, and takes the bait anyway. The choice is his. So I don't think Dumbledore is to blame here.

That's kind of how I feel about it ultimately, that Slughorn knows he's being played, but it still doesn't sit nicely with me. He does refer to Harry's presence by saying "Don't think I don't know why he brought you" or something similar. I'm ultimately okay with it, but not 100%

I wind up feeling sorry for Fleur. She's trying really hard. I think I feel sorry for her because I see some of myself in her actions. She tries really hard and then she puts her foot in her mouth. Like when she says there is nothing really to do if you don't like cooking. Totally true, and there is no way Mrs Weasley is sharing that responsibility, but still not the right thing to say here.

I don't know about trying really hard. The female Weasleys (which might as well include Hermione) are too hard on her, yes, but it's not as if she's entirely innocent in the matter. Fleur *is* arrogant, but then she has every reason to be, and she has a good heart. I imagine her attitude towards Bill's family isn't meant to be as rude as it ends up coming across, but she probably could have done more effort if she had bothered.

I'm not sure if we're really meant to infer here that Mrs. Weasley, Ginny and Hermione are really wrong with their initial attitude. There will be that reconciliation at the end of the book, but that isn't really presented as them being proven wrong, more as Fleur showing an unexpected side. Which isn't actually unexpected to the readers which remember her from book four. But yes, Harry is the one who has the best and most justified attitude towards her (no wonder, he's the one who knows her best apart from Bill).

See, now I adore Ginny, but I think she's really unfair. I think Fleur is trying in the beginning and then as she gets the attitude she stops trying as hard (the Christmas radio broadcast comes to mind, hardly her most endearing chapter). I never understood why everyone was so shocked that she still wants to marry Bill by the end, if anything I'd think she'd want to call it off before to get away from a family that doesn't want her.

Narcissa. I take it back, she is awful. Whatever devotion to her son she expresses she is clearly in line with at least some of Voldemort's aims with her reaction to Hermione. I'm thinking Draco never really stood a chance to be a decent human being.

She's a bigot, yes, certainly. But personally I'm not losing all sympathy for her here. Snape's oath seems to have lessened her worries about Draco greatly, but she still must be fearing for him, while he is clearly still quite confident at this point about it, and trying to escape her protectiveness. Someone as proud as Narcissa is always going to show her worst side in a confrontation like that one, she has a reputation to uphold, and of course Harry does hit her rather hard with the Lucius comments, probably harder than he realizes because he doesn't know about her fears Voldemort might kill or otherwise punish Lucius for his failure.

I felt badly for her briefly after the Lucius remark, until she hits back just as hard about Harry being reunited with Sirius.

I love our introduction to Fred and George's shop. They really are good businessmen and talented wizards even though we've been led to believe in the early books that they were screw ups.

It's interesting that Molly never brings up the matter of Harry having given them the initial loan, which Ron supposedly told her in a letter during book five. And she seems to have come to terms with it. It is an awesome scene ("Mr. Weasley and Mr. Weasley" is great), but I can't agree we've been led to believe that they were screw ups. Every time we've seen them, or very nearly, they were confident, capable and in control of the situation.

I didn't phrase that as well as I would have liked...I'll blame a lack of coffee. ;) I meant how Mrs. Weasley has always wanted them to be more like Percy and being disappointed with their behavior. It provides a nice counterpoint to this to see them be successful and later showing their mother how much they appreciate her. I think they are great sons.

Draco. Every time I read this chapter I'm reminded of how we've been so misled. Harry is right about Draco for the entire book. He gets the specifics wrong sometimes, but he knows this trip is important and doesn't let it go. Harry has been wrong so many times we dismiss it like everyone in the book does but he is so, so very right.

Yeah, Harry is like a broken clock that way. ;)

That's exactly it! He's right in the next book too about something big...so that's the second time a day, right? ;)
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The Great Harry Potter Re-read: Book Six, Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince - 18/10/2010 06:12:40 PM 3261 Views
General comments on the book. - 18/10/2010 06:14:10 PM 1911 Views
I am enjoying this a lot more than I thought I would. - 22/10/2010 07:25:17 PM 2057 Views
Yes, I'm loving that I can read in English again. - 22/10/2010 10:10:32 PM 2135 Views
Me too - 01/11/2010 02:11:28 PM 1893 Views
Suggestions. - 18/10/2010 06:18:46 PM 1964 Views
Re: Suggestions. - 20/10/2010 03:20:18 PM 2101 Views
*cough* - 09/11/2010 09:24:21 AM 1825 Views
Oh yes. I'm being distracted by Towers of Midnight. *NM* - 09/11/2010 02:11:22 PM 1130 Views
Shocking. *NM* - 09/11/2010 02:13:43 PM 1076 Views
Are we having a break right now? - 12/11/2010 06:48:10 PM 1980 Views
Re: Are we having a break right now? - 12/11/2010 10:05:30 PM 2318 Views
Chapters 1-3: The Other Minister, Spinner's End, Will and Won't. - 18/10/2010 06:21:55 PM 2172 Views
Characters: The three Ministers, Snape, Narcissa, Bellatrix, Harry, Dumbledore, the Dursleys. - 18/10/2010 06:25:12 PM 2180 Views
Re: Characters: The three Ministers, Snape, Narcissa, Bellatrix, Harry, Dumbledore, the Dursleys. - 18/10/2010 06:55:06 PM 2193 Views
(minor book seven spoilers) - 19/10/2010 11:27:53 AM 2148 Views
Re: (minor book seven spoilers) - 19/10/2010 05:26:50 PM 1921 Views
*spoilers for book 7* an assortment of characters - 19/10/2010 01:01:35 AM 2145 Views
Re: *spoilers for book 7* an assortment of characters - 19/10/2010 11:39:44 AM 1983 Views
Re: *spoilers for book 7* an assortment of characters - 19/10/2010 11:48:45 AM 2228 Views
I rather enjoyed the new characters. - 22/10/2010 07:30:03 PM 1917 Views
Re: I rather enjoyed the new characters. - 22/10/2010 08:33:44 PM 2056 Views
Anything else? *NM* - 18/10/2010 06:28:16 PM 999 Views
Dumbledore-centered. - 19/10/2010 01:03:05 AM 2058 Views
Re: Dumbledore-centered. - 22/10/2010 07:31:56 PM 2014 Views
Re: Dumbledore-centered. - 22/10/2010 07:33:34 PM 1990 Views
Chapters 4-6: Horace Slughorn, An Excess of Phlegm, Draco's Detour. *NM* - 20/10/2010 03:44:39 PM 1134 Views
Characters: Slughorn, Fleur, the Trio, Draco and Narcissa Malfoy,... - 20/10/2010 03:46:47 PM 2096 Views
Re: Characters: Slughorn, Fleur, the Trio, Draco and Narcissa Malfoy,... - 20/10/2010 05:27:26 PM 2101 Views
(Mostly) on Slughorn, Narcissa and Fleur... - 20/10/2010 09:25:20 PM 2175 Views
Re: (Mostly) on Slughorn, Narcissa and Fleur... - 20/10/2010 09:46:08 PM 2055 Views
Re: (Mostly) on Slughorn, Narcissa and Fleur... - 20/10/2010 11:20:28 PM 1931 Views
Re: (Mostly) on Slughorn, Narcissa and Fleur... - 21/10/2010 12:04:23 AM 1692 Views
Re: (Mostly) on Slughorn, Narcissa and Fleur... - 20/10/2010 10:20:28 PM 2067 Views
Re: (Mostly) on Slughorn, Narcissa and Fleur... - 20/10/2010 11:23:38 PM 1935 Views
Re: Characters: Slughorn, Fleur, the Trio, Draco and Narcissa Malfoy,... - 20/10/2010 10:15:58 PM 2075 Views
On Ron's reaction to Fleur... - 20/10/2010 11:30:48 PM 2029 Views
Re: On Ron's reaction to Fleur... - 20/10/2010 11:58:45 PM 2032 Views
Fleur - 23/10/2010 05:11:08 PM 1873 Views
Dumbledore, Slughorn, Tonks, Mr & Mrs Weasley, Hermione, Narcissa and the twins. - 20/10/2010 09:23:04 PM 1958 Views
Characters. - 25/10/2010 03:10:35 AM 1872 Views
Plotting and writing. - 20/10/2010 03:47:55 PM 1981 Views
*minor spoilers for book 7* - 20/10/2010 09:23:44 PM 2039 Views
Anything else? *NM* - 20/10/2010 03:48:07 PM 990 Views
Dumbledore's Stephen Fry moment... or maybe that's just me. - 22/10/2010 07:35:59 PM 1828 Views
It's not just you - 22/10/2010 08:34:25 PM 1826 Views
Chapters 7-9: Slug Club, Snape Victorious, The Half-Blood Prince *NM* - 22/10/2010 07:23:03 PM 1153 Views
Characters *NM* - 22/10/2010 07:23:24 PM 1082 Views
Harry, Romilda, Malfoy (in luuuve), Snape, Lavender Brown, McGonagall, Hermione and Slughorn. - 22/10/2010 07:26:19 PM 2089 Views
Thoughts about your thoughts. - 23/10/2010 05:28:10 PM 1862 Views
Re: Thoughts about your thoughts. - 24/10/2010 09:18:37 AM 1861 Views
More characters. - 25/10/2010 03:21:33 AM 1876 Views
Re: More characters. - 25/10/2010 10:27:33 AM 1900 Views
Love is in the air, evidently. - 22/10/2010 07:54:35 PM 2037 Views
Re: Love is in the air, evidently. - 22/10/2010 09:04:24 PM 1961 Views
Re: Love is in the air, evidently. - 22/10/2010 09:54:46 PM 1908 Views
Slytherin had been in need of new blood for a long time. (And assorted other comments.) - 22/10/2010 10:34:49 PM 2039 Views
Neville. - 23/10/2010 05:30:39 PM 1957 Views
Re: Neville. - 08/11/2010 02:35:57 PM 2036 Views
NEWT Potions - 24/10/2010 03:24:42 AM 2028 Views
Re: Characters - 24/10/2010 03:41:30 AM 2082 Views
Re: Characters - 25/10/2010 10:44:00 AM 1918 Views
Plotting and writing. *NM* - 22/10/2010 07:23:37 PM 1084 Views
Dumbledore, patronuses and the DADA job. - 22/10/2010 07:27:23 PM 1988 Views
Malfoy and the DADA job. - 22/10/2010 10:51:03 PM 1935 Views
Re: Malfoy and the DADA job. - 25/10/2010 11:31:57 AM 1947 Views
Re: Dumbledore, patronuses and the DADA job. - 23/10/2010 05:32:27 PM 1880 Views
Anything else? *NM* - 22/10/2010 07:23:50 PM 1099 Views
I believe in Wrackspurts, too. And some questions. - 22/10/2010 07:28:04 PM 1845 Views
Re: I believe in Wrackspurts, too. And some questions. - 23/10/2010 05:33:27 PM 1970 Views
Re: I believe in Wrackspurts, too. And some questions. - 25/10/2010 03:06:43 AM 1932 Views
Chapters 10-12: The House of Gaunt, Hermione's Helping Hand, Silver and Opals. *NM* - 25/10/2010 05:00:02 PM 1154 Views
Characters: The Gaunts, the Trio, Hagrid, and many more. *NM* - 25/10/2010 05:02:07 PM 1101 Views
Harry's continued insistence about Malfoy really irritates me (even though he's right). - 25/10/2010 06:15:23 PM 2150 Views
*lol* - 25/10/2010 06:39:19 PM 1968 Views
I don't hide from my faults. - 25/10/2010 08:01:39 PM 1802 Views
Re: I don't hide from my faults. - 28/10/2010 04:59:54 AM 1983 Views
Re: *lol* - 26/10/2010 09:50:09 AM 1954 Views
~geeky moment~ - 26/10/2010 03:14:52 PM 1861 Views
Re: ~geeky moment~ - 26/10/2010 09:49:12 PM 1817 Views
Trelawny, Ogden, Gaunt, Ron, Hermione, Ron and Harry - 25/10/2010 10:23:55 PM 1882 Views
Re: Trelawny, Ogden, Gaunt, Ron, Hermione, Ron and Harry - 26/10/2010 11:56:59 PM 2018 Views
Re: Trelawny, Ogden, Gaunt, Ron, Hermione, Ron and Harry - 27/10/2010 08:14:42 AM 2002 Views
Plotting and writing. - 25/10/2010 05:03:16 PM 1978 Views
Amazing amounts of accurate guesswork here, in hindsight. - 25/10/2010 05:37:28 PM 2022 Views
Re: Amazing amounts of accurate guesswork here, in hindsight. - 26/10/2010 09:46:47 AM 1904 Views
The smuggling and Trelawney's rambling. - 27/10/2010 12:05:48 AM 1962 Views
Re: The smuggling and Trelawney's rambling. - 27/10/2010 08:10:46 AM 1889 Views
Things - 25/10/2010 10:24:19 PM 2029 Views
Re: Things - 27/10/2010 12:01:17 AM 2036 Views
Anything else? *NM* - 25/10/2010 05:03:32 PM 909 Views
Dumbledore still sounds like Stephen Fry. And reflections on the nature of Potions class. - 25/10/2010 05:11:24 PM 1862 Views
It's like baking, I think. - 25/10/2010 05:32:42 PM 1947 Views
Good analogy - 25/10/2010 05:52:38 PM 1819 Views
Yes, exactly like baking - and advanced baking involves experimenting, substituting, improvising. - 25/10/2010 06:42:42 PM 2041 Views
But not at high school. - 25/10/2010 07:57:44 PM 1930 Views
Also - 04/11/2010 09:29:47 AM 1901 Views
Also, Parseltongue - is Harry that thick, or is it a magic thing? - 25/10/2010 05:18:41 PM 1929 Views
I think it's a magic thing. - 25/10/2010 05:34:09 PM 1927 Views
It can be learned actually. Dumbledore implies he knows it and Ron uses it in book 7 - 25/10/2010 05:55:28 PM 1911 Views
Huh. I completely missed that. Good thing we're doing a reread. - 25/10/2010 05:57:38 PM 1925 Views
Speaking of Dumbledore and Parseltongue. - 28/10/2010 05:03:10 AM 2188 Views
parseltongue - 25/10/2010 10:24:46 PM 2043 Views
Interesting how many of our remarks are along similar lines. *NM* - 25/10/2010 10:27:30 PM 966 Views
Indeed - 26/10/2010 09:20:43 AM 1928 Views
Chapters 13-15: The Secret Riddle, Felix Felicis, The Unbreakable Vow *NM* - 27/10/2010 04:16:28 PM 1092 Views
Characters: The Trio, Ginny, Tom Riddle, Draco,... *NM* - 27/10/2010 04:17:12 PM 1079 Views
Dumbledore, Voldemort, Ron & Hermione, Harry, Ginny, Luna - 27/10/2010 10:31:39 PM 1961 Views
My take on Ginny is rather different, I must say... at least this time around. - 29/10/2010 01:47:20 PM 1891 Views
Girls. - 29/10/2010 05:54:25 PM 1940 Views
Draco: Not as confident as he appears, surely. - 29/10/2010 02:02:01 PM 2073 Views
Re: Draco: Not as confident as he appears, surely. - 29/10/2010 09:01:56 PM 2057 Views
Plotting and writing. *NM* - 27/10/2010 04:17:26 PM 877 Views
plot and writing. - 27/10/2010 10:30:14 PM 1956 Views
Re: plot and writing. - 28/10/2010 05:07:03 AM 2098 Views
Draco can dissemble rather well, just like his parents. - 29/10/2010 02:08:35 PM 1966 Views
Re: Draco can dissemble rather well, just like his parents. - 29/10/2010 09:00:36 PM 1975 Views
Anything else? *NM* - 27/10/2010 04:17:42 PM 935 Views
Re: Anything else? - 27/10/2010 10:30:55 PM 2085 Views
Re: Anything else? - 28/10/2010 04:56:10 AM 2010 Views
Harry comments on that when in Snape's memories in book five. - 28/10/2010 10:42:08 AM 1892 Views
I wonder if that's actually true, though. - 28/10/2010 10:39:20 AM 2117 Views
Re: I wonder if that's actually true, though. - 28/10/2010 10:44:22 AM 1938 Views
It's more than that, though. - 28/10/2010 10:55:49 AM 2025 Views
Re: It's more than that, though. - 28/10/2010 11:48:19 AM 1824 Views
Chapters 16-18: A Very Frosty Christmas, A Sluggish Memory, Birthday Surprises *NM* - 29/10/2010 05:40:39 PM 1087 Views
Characters: The Trio, Fleur, Scrimgeour, Percy, Remus, Slughorn,... *NM* - 29/10/2010 05:43:02 PM 1153 Views
Mr Weasley, Lupin, Fleur, Harry and Scrimgeour - 29/10/2010 08:51:58 PM 2079 Views
Re: Mr Weasley, Lupin, Fleur, Harry and Scrimgeour - 29/10/2010 11:24:02 PM 1902 Views
Re: Mr Weasley, Lupin, Fleur, Harry and Scrimgeour - 29/10/2010 11:51:06 PM 1918 Views
Re: Mr Weasley, Lupin, Fleur, Harry and Scrimgeour - 31/10/2010 09:14:46 PM 2131 Views
Re: Mr Weasley, Lupin, Fleur, Harry and Scrimgeour - 31/10/2010 09:07:19 PM 2035 Views
Re: Mr Weasley, Lupin, Fleur, Harry and Scrimgeour - 02/11/2010 06:23:04 PM 1971 Views
Re: Mr Weasley, Lupin, Fleur, Harry and Scrimgeour - 02/11/2010 07:20:26 PM 1638 Views
Re: Mr Weasley, Lupin, Fleur, Harry and Scrimgeour - 04/11/2010 04:03:02 AM 1905 Views
And - 04/11/2010 10:46:37 AM 1935 Views
Plotting and writing. - 29/10/2010 05:43:49 PM 1881 Views
Re: Plotting and writing. - 29/10/2010 08:52:34 PM 1997 Views
Anything else? *NM* - 29/10/2010 05:44:04 PM 971 Views
My comments on Potions class were heeded! Excellent. - 29/10/2010 11:28:43 PM 1924 Views
Re: My comments on Potions class were heeded! Excellent. - 29/10/2010 11:52:12 PM 1990 Views
Chapters 19-21: Elf Tails, Lord Voldemort's Requests, The Unknowable Room *NM* - 01/11/2010 02:00:22 PM 853 Views
Characters: The Trio, the elves, Draco, Dumbledore,... *NM* - 01/11/2010 02:00:56 PM 1206 Views
the twins, Hermione, Ron, Luna, Voldemort, Draco and Tonks - 01/11/2010 02:08:32 PM 1807 Views
Re: the twins, Hermione, Ron, Luna, Voldemort, Draco and Tonks - 01/11/2010 05:10:11 PM 2052 Views
Re: the twins, Hermione, Ron, Luna, Voldemort, Draco and Tonks - 01/11/2010 05:16:30 PM 2127 Views
Plotting and writing. *NM* - 01/11/2010 02:01:13 PM 960 Views
Dumbledore, little girls and the house-elf issue again. - 01/11/2010 02:09:35 PM 2159 Views
Anything else? *NM* - 01/11/2010 02:01:27 PM 968 Views
Chapters 22-24: After the Burial, Horcruxes, Sectumsempra - 03/11/2010 09:50:17 PM 2197 Views
Characters. *NM* - 03/11/2010 09:50:33 PM 1111 Views
Malfoy, Ron & Hermione, Slughorn, Voldemort, Snape and Ginny. - 04/11/2010 12:12:57 AM 2006 Views
Draco, Slughorn, Snape, the romance. - 04/11/2010 02:02:04 PM 2016 Views
Re: Draco, Slughorn, Snape, the romance. - 04/11/2010 02:16:17 PM 2035 Views
Plotting and writing. *NM* - 03/11/2010 09:50:50 PM 982 Views
Harry wrong again, house elves, horcruxes, free will, well hidden clues and some irony *DH spoiler* - 03/11/2010 10:35:20 PM 1950 Views
Re: Stuff. - 04/11/2010 04:28:04 AM 1983 Views
Re: Stuff. *spoilers for book 7* - 04/11/2010 09:10:19 AM 2037 Views
This "we'll see in book seven" thing is getting old, but still that's what I have to say here... - 04/11/2010 01:23:01 PM 1816 Views
Yes, I think you are right - 04/11/2010 01:24:41 PM 1988 Views
Well, I'm back. Some comments inside. *DH Spoilers* - 08/11/2010 02:28:11 PM 2014 Views
Anything else? *NM* - 03/11/2010 09:51:04 PM 979 Views
Chapters 25-27: The Seer Overheard, The Cave, The Lightning-Struck Tower - 05/11/2010 05:37:42 PM 1829 Views
Plotting and writing. - 05/11/2010 05:39:27 PM 1660 Views
*spoilers for book 7* - 05/11/2010 07:55:07 PM 1863 Views
Anything else? *NM* - 05/11/2010 05:39:43 PM 991 Views
I like how good magic is not flashy. Also, a Tolkien thing - 05/11/2010 07:55:27 PM 1917 Views
I didn't take the comparison as far, but the gate thing did remind me of Moria, yes. (DH spoilers) - 05/11/2010 10:03:16 PM 2166 Views
yes - 05/11/2010 10:06:43 PM 1890 Views
Chapters 28-30: Flight of the Prince, The Phoenix Lament, The White Tomb. *NM* - 09/11/2010 02:13:12 PM 1112 Views
Characters. *NM* - 09/11/2010 02:13:25 PM 933 Views
Plotting and writing. *NM* - 09/11/2010 02:13:40 PM 1057 Views
Spoilers. - 09/11/2010 02:26:38 PM 1858 Views
Re: Spoilers. - 09/11/2010 04:49:06 PM 1903 Views
I'm assuming not even the Ministry knows 100% what she did. - 13/11/2010 12:26:14 AM 2000 Views
Very true. - 15/11/2010 01:48:36 PM 1997 Views
Not much, no, but there's one fairly crucial mention. - 15/11/2010 04:37:23 PM 1963 Views
Re: Spoilers. - 13/11/2010 12:22:22 AM 2118 Views
Re: Spoilers. - 13/11/2010 09:38:09 AM 2253 Views
Anything else? *NM* - 09/11/2010 02:13:53 PM 965 Views
We did the Harry Potter marathon thing on Sunday - 09/11/2010 02:28:08 PM 1981 Views
I vaguely remember something of the sort, yes. - 09/11/2010 02:57:56 PM 2201 Views
Re: I vaguely remember something of the sort, yes. - 09/11/2010 02:58:56 PM 1868 Views
This is definitely the most painfully altered of the movies. - 09/11/2010 04:34:33 PM 2014 Views
Re: This is definitely the most painfully altered of the movies. - 09/11/2010 04:36:29 PM 1962 Views
Very true. - 09/11/2010 04:40:24 PM 2199 Views
Re: Very true. - 09/11/2010 04:43:45 PM 2454 Views
Agreed. - 09/11/2010 04:53:46 PM 1992 Views
Re: Agreed. - 09/11/2010 04:58:59 PM 2079 Views

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