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Yes it does ßelals Girl Send a noteboard - 06/07/2011 07:32:54 PM
No one has to ride with someone who won't buckle up. They choose to take the risk as much as the person who refuses to buckle up themselves.

(I am, of course, refering to adults here, not children or anyone else who is at the adults' mercy)

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You can't make this stuff up: Helmet law protester dies in crash Dark Knight - 05/07/2011 08:47:14 PM 1045 Views
Kinda undermines his protest *NM* snoopcester - 05/07/2011 09:01:50 PM 306 Views
Just a tad bit *NM* Dark Knight - 05/07/2011 09:06:24 PM 292 Views
How so? He wasn't demanding the right to survive crashes when only a helmet makes that possible. Joel - 05/07/2011 11:06:44 PM 677 Views
New York feels that people should have to wear helmets for their own safety snoopcester - 05/07/2011 11:20:36 PM 645 Views
He felt his own safety was his own concern. Joel - 06/07/2011 12:07:05 AM 577 Views
Who do you think would have ended up paying for his care for the rest of his life if the accident Tashmere - 06/07/2011 01:08:49 AM 736 Views
The same people who pay for everyone else whose actions render them vegetables. Joel - 06/07/2011 01:50:20 AM 855 Views
Maybe a more effective argument you could use against me would be pointing out Tashmere - 06/07/2011 02:33:21 AM 647 Views
Yeah, that is a better example. Joel - 06/07/2011 03:03:01 AM 616 Views
Oops, ignore! *NM* eucatastrophe - 06/07/2011 11:44:10 PM 374 Views
Now, who said irony wasn't funny? *NM* Great Lord of Chaos - 05/07/2011 09:22:58 PM 428 Views
what a fricking idiot Yunalesca - 05/07/2011 10:02:17 PM 812 Views
That's your opinion to which you're entitled. Joel - 05/07/2011 11:19:36 PM 1068 Views
Anarchy, baby! *NM* Dark Knight - 06/07/2011 12:58:23 AM 529 Views
Sorry, as an advocate of civil rights (which especially includes minorities) I oppose anarchy. Joel - 06/07/2011 01:18:19 AM 734 Views
The public's nose is on the line here too. Tashmere - 06/07/2011 01:47:08 AM 795 Views
So my increased ease of hearing/seeing vehicles and other hazards isn't worth $1200. Joel - 06/07/2011 02:25:53 AM 807 Views
I understand the pov, I had a BF who felt that same way. It's still much like childish defiance. Avendesora - 06/07/2011 01:26:15 AM 971 Views
In part it's a matter of principle, but if we really want to analyze it there's some deeper validity Joel - 06/07/2011 02:13:05 AM 763 Views
you keep spreading falsehoods, stop it please moondog - 06/07/2011 02:49:01 AM 919 Views
Sounds like your real argument is with the other bikers; I'm just reiterating their arguments. Joel - 06/07/2011 03:38:39 AM 856 Views
It's not "much like" childish defiance. It IS. *NM* eucatastrophe - 06/07/2011 11:45:05 PM 482 Views
Uh Joel... ßelals Girl - 06/07/2011 03:38:24 AM 681 Views
Agreed, having others in the car does make a difference. Joel - 06/07/2011 03:47:53 AM 757 Views
Hence why your "I wouldn't wear a seatbelt in the back seat" comment didn't make a lot of sense ßelals Girl - 06/07/2011 07:38:50 PM 731 Views
Depends on whether the driver, rather than the law, is the one insisting. Joel - 06/07/2011 08:06:24 PM 591 Views
You'd place your own comfort over other people's safety? ßelals Girl - 06/07/2011 11:37:00 PM 620 Views
It's more a comfort issue than anything else; it's not solely one. Joel - 06/07/2011 11:56:28 PM 1104 Views
Sorry, but that doesn't make sense ironclad - 06/07/2011 07:02:33 PM 876 Views
Yes it does ßelals Girl - 06/07/2011 07:32:54 PM 631 Views
how many people are really seriously injured that way? random thoughts - 06/07/2011 07:15:16 PM 850 Views
Did you actually read my post? ßelals Girl - 06/07/2011 07:36:13 PM 759 Views
my ex had 3 cracked ribs from an accident like that moondog - 07/07/2011 02:46:07 AM 784 Views
Re: That's your opinion to which you're entitled. Yunalesca - 06/07/2011 05:18:12 PM 837 Views
Re: That's your opinion to which you're entitled. Joel - 06/07/2011 06:13:44 PM 910 Views
Hold the phone here... Jeordam - 06/07/2011 07:49:10 PM 1070 Views
+1 *NM* Yunalesca - 06/07/2011 08:42:14 PM 369 Views
You agree with him that the abortion debate is about a mothers convenience versus the babys life? Joel - 06/07/2011 10:48:52 PM 755 Views
im not bringing abortion into this, its a separate issue *NM* Yunalesca - 06/07/2011 10:56:17 PM 363 Views
It's really not. Joel - 07/07/2011 12:20:10 AM 779 Views
i'm really not Yunalesca - 07/07/2011 03:34:23 PM 874 Views
Fine as far as it goes, but public/private only matters to the extent others are affected. Joel - 09/07/2011 11:15:33 AM 828 Views
What else could the debate be about? Jeordam - 06/07/2011 10:58:51 PM 705 Views
"The babys life", not just "life". Joel - 07/07/2011 12:18:02 AM 1037 Views
Holding the phone here might be good, yes.... Joel - 06/07/2011 10:33:46 PM 844 Views
See...that's the difference between you and me Jeordam - 06/07/2011 10:56:53 PM 931 Views
Apparently so; "completely anarchy as long as its regulated to one's body" sounds nonsensical to me. Joel - 06/07/2011 11:44:50 PM 917 Views
I think I could make that up. *NM* TaskmasterJack - 05/07/2011 11:41:00 PM 309 Views
Smartass *NM* Dark Knight - 06/07/2011 12:57:22 AM 314 Views
I'm with Joel. I always buckle up/helmet up, but I think such laws are asinine beetnemesis - 06/07/2011 02:30:04 AM 600 Views
why not just ban motorcycles all together, they are much more dangerous than cars random thoughts - 06/07/2011 05:39:51 PM 622 Views
Helmets help save lives. 'Onest. Two Wongs - 07/07/2011 04:40:42 PM 782 Views
So do not smoking, eating right and regular exercise, but we haven't made them mandatory. Joel - 09/07/2011 11:04:58 AM 780 Views
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