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no, I'm not saying that the sheer number of people alone is sufficient LadyLorraine Send a noteboard - 19/12/2011 10:13:09 PM
Nor that those people are correct by force of majority.

I will clarify what I was trying to say. If billions of people have had some perception of "something", whatever they call it, I think it is worth thinking about. I really doubt any one person/group is correct. But it's like...if 75% of a town see an airplane above their town, then it is worth considering if there was an airplane above the town, isn't it? Maybe they're wrong, or maybe they're right, but it's at least worth investigating. Provided you're in to airplanes, anyway, but that's just nitpicking the analogy and you get my point :P

Also, I think a lot of people pigeonhole "atheism" when they talk about just believing in God (or not) (I don't even see MANY people directly talk about non-Christian gods). My definition of an atheist is someone who doesn't believe in ANYTHING religious or spiritual. If someone does not believe in a deity, but believes that there is some spiritual aspect to life, then I would not label them an atheist. It's definitely a more nitpicky and particular definition and I'm aware some people disagree and label themselves accordingly. That's fine by me.

It does affect how I label myself, though. I am 99.999...% sure there is no God, or gods as we know them. However I am not going to round that specific value up to the statement "100% no deities; I am atheist", because I do believe there is something that many would label "supernatural" or "spiritual" or whatever. I'm not aware enough or knowing enough of it to try to define it. I just believe that it's there, and so I don't want to call myself an atheist.
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Kim Jong-il is dead. Would you become a fervent believer? Tom - 19/12/2011 03:37:28 AM 1720 Views
If I was a Christian, I'd pray that he would burn forever in hell. Great Lord of Chaos - 19/12/2011 03:47:52 AM 1133 Views
See, I can't be an atheist. Tom - 19/12/2011 03:53:55 AM 1097 Views
I agree about atheism LadyLorraine - 19/12/2011 04:19:02 AM 995 Views
It's an approximation. Vivien - 19/12/2011 05:40:05 PM 995 Views
no, I'm not saying that the sheer number of people alone is sufficient LadyLorraine - 19/12/2011 10:13:09 PM 877 Views
Re: See, I can't be an atheist. Great Lord of Chaos - 19/12/2011 04:25:06 AM 969 Views
No, Pascal's Wager is stupid. Tim - 19/12/2011 03:09:42 PM 972 Views
You obviously misread my comments or ignored them. Tom - 19/12/2011 03:39:59 PM 997 Views
You're answering a different point to the one I was addressing. Tim - 19/12/2011 04:01:54 PM 904 Views
For atheism to be a tenable position, one must assume that millions lie about their experiences. Tom - 20/12/2011 04:11:53 AM 996 Views
Look, doesn't this go against your most sacred principle? jh - 20/12/2011 06:43:27 AM 956 Views
I'm pretty sure he's not saying it's undeniable proof. LadyLorraine - 20/12/2011 09:19:44 AM 911 Views
No, it doesn't. Tom - 20/12/2011 08:30:55 PM 861 Views
Re: No, it doesn't. jh - 20/12/2011 09:21:22 PM 911 Views
This militant atheism is somewhat amusing. Tom - 20/12/2011 09:48:57 PM 921 Views
... somewhat irrational at times too Isaac - 21/12/2011 01:22:54 AM 836 Views
Huh? snoopcester - 21/12/2011 10:47:06 AM 895 Views
That's somewhat unrelated to the intended point of the post Isaac - 21/12/2011 12:41:49 PM 898 Views
My "Huh?" was at your claim that any reasonable definition Kim Jong-il was a millitant athiest snoopcester - 21/12/2011 12:58:44 PM 873 Views
You're objecting to me calling the Military Dictator militant? Isaac - 21/12/2011 03:13:35 PM 938 Views
Is that the long way of saying you can't back up what you said? snoopcester - 21/12/2011 04:06:06 PM 853 Views
Okay Isaac - 21/12/2011 05:03:07 PM 981 Views
Your position isn't rational nor logical Helene - 20/12/2011 12:45:03 PM 946 Views
I never stated it was either. That's the problem with spiritual matters. Tom - 20/12/2011 08:43:46 PM 843 Views
How about a faith atheist? Palatine - 19/12/2011 04:28:59 PM 1031 Views
Nevermind. It appears you answered that in your reply to Tim. *NM* Palatine - 19/12/2011 04:32:19 PM 505 Views
Re: See, I can't be an atheist. snoopcester - 19/12/2011 04:57:23 PM 987 Views
It's impossible to tell if worshipping a false god would be worse than worshipping no god at all. Tom - 20/12/2011 04:14:59 AM 807 Views
Sounds like you must be a modern-day prophet beetnemesis - 19/12/2011 05:24:24 PM 837 Views
Well, it's *possible* that he is. Vivien - 19/12/2011 05:49:34 PM 923 Views
Hah, fair enough beetnemesis - 19/12/2011 06:47:07 PM 920 Views
Idiocy. Confirmation bias doesn't explain away external phenomena. Tom - 20/12/2011 04:19:10 AM 941 Views
Well. Sareitha Sedai - 21/12/2011 01:49:36 PM 941 Views
I didn't forget about it. I was getting ready to give up on it. Tom - 21/12/2011 02:27:18 PM 842 Views
That doesn't really make sense. Sareitha Sedai - 21/12/2011 03:04:23 PM 774 Views
No, it does make perfect sense. Tom - 21/12/2011 06:17:02 PM 963 Views
Also, learn to use the subjunctive. It's "if I WERE a Christian..." Tom - 19/12/2011 03:54:20 AM 941 Views
The sad thing about that comment... Larry - 19/12/2011 04:52:57 AM 1067 Views
I'm pretty sure there's plenty of middle ground between those two examples LadyLorraine - 19/12/2011 05:31:13 PM 841 Views
Tom is right. Agnosticism is really the only rational posistion. Urza - 20/12/2011 04:17:08 AM 846 Views
Tom, I think this means you should take up ForEx trading. *NM* Urza - 19/12/2011 04:00:20 AM 429 Views
I might. I'm close enough to it as is. I just did some ForEx ISDAs for clients... Tom - 19/12/2011 04:03:11 AM 1026 Views
I really am gonna miss Hitchens...a lot *NM* *NM* Roland00 - 19/12/2011 04:06:50 AM 438 Views
I will miss him, too...a lot. *NM* Tom - 19/12/2011 04:17:05 AM 427 Views
so, hypothetically...if I was to send you a list of people... LadyLorraine - 19/12/2011 04:25:47 AM 899 Views
Let's not try that. Tom - 20/12/2011 04:21:35 AM 892 Views
I'm so ronery 김정일 - 19/12/2011 06:36:38 AM 967 Views
I thought you were asking if I believed in KJ-I, the Eternal Leader Praziquantel - 19/12/2011 06:55:08 AM 845 Views
The article I just read said he died on Saturday. Rebekah - 19/12/2011 08:58:17 AM 923 Views
Yeah, he actually died on a train Saturday morning before Tom made the comment. *NM* TaskmasterJack - 19/12/2011 09:13:44 PM 388 Views
I'm not claiming causality. And, for the record, I first made the comment on Friday afternoon. Tom - 20/12/2011 04:25:07 AM 918 Views
You know what's really weird? Isaac - 19/12/2011 11:32:23 AM 916 Views
It has been there for 6 hours at this stage. Stephen - 19/12/2011 12:34:57 PM 1004 Views
don't forget Mugabe (sp) Yunalesca - 19/12/2011 01:06:24 PM 844 Views
Zimbabwe basically is dust by now. *NM* Tim - 19/12/2011 02:52:51 PM 425 Views
They took it down, apparently. *NM* Tom - 20/12/2011 04:40:24 AM 413 Views
Not surprising, still in the revisions if anyone wants to see of course Isaac - 20/12/2011 11:06:05 AM 1093 Views
Turns out Kim Jong really was il? snoopcester - 19/12/2011 12:10:15 PM 884 Views
all praise Madokami! *NM* Yunalesca - 19/12/2011 01:03:26 PM 483 Views
He's not dead-dead. Neither is his father. Just ask the North Koreans. Palatine - 19/12/2011 04:23:48 PM 893 Views
Re: He's not dead-dead. Neither is his father. Just ask the North Koreans. TaskmasterJack - 19/12/2011 09:15:09 PM 852 Views
That happened to me too. Nate - 19/12/2011 09:45:48 PM 975 Views
Re: That happened to me too. TaskmasterJack - 19/12/2011 09:48:36 PM 859 Views
Re: Legend Palatine - 20/12/2011 04:54:40 PM 863 Views
I wonder if they're going to embalm him? Tom - 20/12/2011 04:39:33 AM 809 Views
The problem with predictions that come true Vivien - 19/12/2011 05:28:24 PM 956 Views
I don't make a lot of predictions. *NM* Tom - 19/12/2011 08:18:53 PM 541 Views
Well you should start at least journaling the ones that you do make. Vivien - 19/12/2011 08:40:18 PM 916 Views
I actually now do tell my friends when I have dreams that have the "feel" to them. Tom - 20/12/2011 04:36:07 AM 980 Views
Just ones about old, sick guys dying? *NM* Sareitha Sedai - 19/12/2011 09:51:12 PM 381 Views
No, sadly. Tom - 20/12/2011 04:31:44 AM 781 Views
I can attest to the fact that this conversation took place on Facebook Saturday. TaskmasterJack - 19/12/2011 09:19:06 PM 847 Views
Yeah, I thought that reply seemed in the wrong place Isaac - 19/12/2011 09:28:17 PM 852 Views
Re: Yeah, I thought that reply seemed in the wrong place TaskmasterJack - 19/12/2011 09:31:00 PM 856 Views
Yes, TMJ, you also contributed in this case. *NM* Tom - 20/12/2011 04:38:42 AM 397 Views
I am not a dog to be petted! TaskmasterJack - 21/12/2011 02:42:55 AM 847 Views
HAHAHAHA!!!! *NM* Tom - 21/12/2011 05:31:06 AM 484 Views
Coincidentally, I found this site today kHz1000 - 19/12/2011 10:57:36 PM 905 Views
Oh, I liked that site. I found it a few years ago. *NM* Tom - 20/12/2011 04:37:04 AM 407 Views
Jeez, I hope I never get on your bad side ironclad - 20/12/2011 12:06:54 AM 812 Views
Things did change for the better with Stalin's death. Vivien - 20/12/2011 02:51:12 AM 884 Views
Not for Stalin *NM* Tom - 20/12/2011 09:49:39 PM 480 Views
eh, you can't have everything Yunalesca - 20/12/2011 11:08:36 PM 786 Views
So I guess you want me to destroy the voodoo doll I have of you? Oh wait...never mind. *NM* Tom - 20/12/2011 04:37:35 AM 392 Views
Not to downplay your awesomely uncanny coincidence... Avendesora - 20/12/2011 01:19:33 PM 861 Views
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