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Re: Well, I have to clarify... Legolas Send a noteboard - 23/08/2012 11:34:51 PM
Sorry but I just can't put it more bluntly than this - sticking a penis in a vagina without permission is rape. No ifs, no buts, no maybes - just rape.

Also sorry, but it just isn't that simple, because "permission" is not a binary concept as you apparently seem to think. You say this as if somehow it's helpful for you to be as blunt (or simplistic) as possible - I strongly have to disagree with that premise. Nuances are important.
And frankly the idea that because a woman consented to have sex with someone once means he can get a free repeat seems totally crazy to me - it is grounds to assume she might be willing to have sex with him again... no way is it grounds to assume he can have sex with her when ever he feels like it.

Nuances are still important. Which means that not only shouldn't you be as simplistic as possible about your own views, but you also shouldn't oversimplify the views of the people you're debating with. At least not if you want to engage in an actual debate and make comments that might actually convince them. If you're just playing it to the crowd and your primary consideration is claiming the moral high ground, well, go right on then, but I'll bow out.
I've just looked and can't see an actual report of where she changed it? Even so, half asleep is a pretty vague term.

Yes, it's vague; but it seemed to me that the main reason why Joel and I were disagreeing with you so strongly was that you were apparently thinking of a woman who remains asleep as the man engages in sex with her, which is a quite different assumption from the one we were making. There's a big difference between initiating sex with a woman who's still asleep (or half asleep) with the idea that it'll wake her up and you'll have sex together, or starting to have sex with her and just going on even if she doesn't wake up because you don't care if she's awake or not. The latter is indeed rather like sex with a blow up doll; the former, not so much.
See the thing is I flat out disagree here - this is where my blow up doll comment comes in. It is utter nonsense to assume that because she agreed to sex once he could have sex with her whenever he wanted - that is still rape, just the kind that no one cared about 30 years ago.

See above.
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Rape - British left wing politician takes on American right wing politician in stupidest comment off - 22/08/2012 11:03:50 PM 960 Views
Galloway - I'll always remember him for being a Cat to be honest. - 22/08/2012 11:14:58 PM 533 Views
Erm... what on earth is that? - 22/08/2012 11:19:13 PM 367 Views
Celebrity Big Brother in the UK - 22/08/2012 11:22:17 PM 417 Views
People who support abortion only for rape are the most retarded in the whole debate - 23/08/2012 01:05:17 AM 519 Views
Bullshit - 23/08/2012 05:01:24 AM 424 Views
That's an interesting variation with some legitimacy, though not compelling, to me anyway - 23/08/2012 07:25:50 AM 441 Views
That is a dangerous line of logic. - 23/08/2012 09:26:25 PM 656 Views
Okay, that really wasn't connected to my comments - 24/08/2012 02:39:21 AM 373 Views
Sure it was, but we can do it your way. - 24/08/2012 04:10:37 AM 441 Views
Yet you don't, you jump the gun here too - 24/08/2012 04:37:02 AM 448 Views
I was trying to cut to the chase; like I say, I followed your logic: I just disliked where it led. - 24/08/2012 06:10:40 AM 542 Views
Disliking the conclusion doesn't invalidate the logic, and stop veering out of the debate boundary - 24/08/2012 06:43:43 AM 478 Views
No, the logics invalidity does that, though you do not seem to like its conclusion either. - 24/08/2012 07:48:21 AM 648 Views
I'm not even sure what that means - 25/08/2012 12:38:56 AM 381 Views
The logic is invalid because invalid, however either of us feels about where it leads. - 25/08/2012 10:37:34 PM 441 Views
Okay, we're done here - 26/08/2012 05:36:28 AM 411 Views
Quotes are not my opinion. - 26/08/2012 06:37:19 AM 394 Views
You'd really benefit from post-secondary education. - 26/08/2012 12:14:02 PM 480 Views
Haven't you and Joel had about the same amount of post-secondary education, actually? - 27/08/2012 01:31:43 AM 497 Views
T^T - 27/08/2012 04:39:33 AM 399 Views
Is that the emoticon for perky titties? *NM* - 27/08/2012 11:07:06 PM 214 Views
He is an absolute berk. *NM* - 23/08/2012 01:08:58 AM 418 Views
To be honest, I think people MIGHT be overreacting to both comments. - 23/08/2012 01:33:54 AM 506 Views
Really? *NM* - 23/08/2012 06:33:46 AM 289 Views
Yeah. - 23/08/2012 06:40:05 AM 446 Views
I expect it is more of a "stating the obvious" response. - 23/08/2012 02:01:18 PM 434 Views
Heh, I didn't think so. - 23/08/2012 05:44:55 PM 465 Views
I said Akins comments needed MORE context. - 23/08/2012 08:50:09 PM 566 Views
Yes, I saw that. - 23/08/2012 10:28:50 PM 398 Views
Re: Yes, I saw that. - 23/08/2012 11:04:40 PM 425 Views
Re: Yes, I saw that. - 23/08/2012 11:08:46 PM 404 Views
Science sometimes produces shocking discoveries. - 23/08/2012 11:28:47 PM 427 Views
And sometimes one doctor with an agenda pulls "facts" out of the air - 23/08/2012 11:37:37 PM 469 Views
No argument there. - 23/08/2012 11:46:01 PM 451 Views
This - 23/08/2012 08:50:43 PM 467 Views
Okay. I misunderstood. Sorry. *NM* - 23/08/2012 09:58:20 PM 259 Views
Eh - 23/08/2012 10:37:15 PM 415 Views
Well, I didn't take it that way. - 23/08/2012 10:42:01 PM 477 Views
Good - 24/08/2012 02:20:27 AM 483 Views
Ah, I can understand if that is the case. - 23/08/2012 07:46:38 PM 453 Views
I read it the same way Jen did - 23/08/2012 08:49:16 PM 381 Views
Why? - 23/08/2012 08:51:59 PM 457 Views
See your reply here - the bit before the comma then the bit after it. - 23/08/2012 09:06:20 PM 451 Views
You can see where there's room for doubt in that though, surely. - 23/08/2012 09:20:19 PM 426 Views
I accept there are exceptions under some circumstances - but they are exceptions, not the rule. - 23/08/2012 09:44:36 PM 441 Views
Well, I have to clarify... - 23/08/2012 10:28:13 PM 410 Views
Re: Well, I have to clarify... - 23/08/2012 10:50:59 PM 376 Views
Re: Well, I have to clarify... - 23/08/2012 11:15:50 PM 365 Views
Re: Well, I have to clarify... - 23/08/2012 11:28:56 PM 487 Views
couple things - 24/08/2012 01:57:04 AM 385 Views
Re: couple things - 24/08/2012 02:26:23 PM 428 Views
Re: couple things - 24/08/2012 02:45:38 PM 371 Views
Re: couple things - 25/08/2012 12:11:03 AM 419 Views
You may be talking about Galloway and not Assange, but Galloway was talking about Assange. - 24/08/2012 06:28:00 PM 398 Views
Ew. - 24/08/2012 06:56:27 PM 421 Views
Yes, that about covers it. - 24/08/2012 07:42:13 PM 404 Views
Yes, I was talking about Galoway and what he said - 25/08/2012 12:15:15 AM 542 Views
Re: Well, I have to clarify... - 23/08/2012 11:34:51 PM 466 Views
I can - 23/08/2012 11:05:05 PM 354 Views
I gotta say I am with Paul - 24/08/2012 12:27:44 AM 453 Views
Hm. - 24/08/2012 02:08:33 AM 367 Views
OK - 23/08/2012 09:35:35 PM 402 Views
Bullshit. - 23/08/2012 10:00:54 PM 370 Views
Re: Bullshit. - 23/08/2012 10:52:02 PM 561 Views
To start again then Joel - 23/08/2012 11:14:07 PM 384 Views
My mistake then, sorry. - 23/08/2012 11:32:34 PM 413 Views
Agreeing without agreeing. - 23/08/2012 12:24:10 PM 481 Views
I have gotten used to you being right for the wrong reasons. - 23/08/2012 07:42:32 PM 398 Views
Yes - 23/08/2012 06:34:38 AM 548 Views
Indeed - 23/08/2012 08:47:40 PM 384 Views
I don't know about Galloway but Akin is being made to pay for his commnets - 23/08/2012 04:37:12 PM 476 Views
Um, I'm not sure about that last bit - 23/08/2012 10:43:15 PM 390 Views
this issue has been discussed none stop for two days and this almost never mentioned - 24/08/2012 12:28:25 PM 399 Views
well, that is where I'm confused. - 24/08/2012 07:03:16 PM 393 Views
Maybe I watch to much CNN - 24/08/2012 07:30:23 PM 371 Views
Yeah, I'm curious about that last point as well. - 24/08/2012 02:53:43 AM 452 Views
McCaskills campaign ran ads during the GOP primary calling Akin the "most conservative" candidate. - 24/08/2012 03:33:18 AM 591 Views
Interesting. - 24/08/2012 04:49:51 AM 392 Views
no it isn't kinda true - 24/08/2012 12:50:53 PM 368 Views

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