1) No country that repealed their gay ban had a solider killed afterwards due to being gay, specifically. In other words no hate crime deaths, no lynching. This isn't the case of countries that have gay bans such as the case of Allen R Schindler Jr in 1992 in the US Navy. The culture that rules create, changes what soldiers consider possible and allowable. Part of the experience of Allen R Schindler shows (due to the culture the gay ban enstates) is that the Navy looked the other way, tried to suppress the information about the murder public (even to Schindler's family), and denied there were prior harassment claims Schindler made to the chain of command including soldiers joking "There's a faggot on this ship and he should die"
2) You are worrying about soldiers dying, but having a gay ban and kicking out 600 to 1200 soldiers each year (13,000 in 16 years) kills soldiers that are not kicked out. Having the right doctor, the right translator, even the right infantryman man for the job saves lives. There is reason why we are so hard on training our soldiers, it isn't just about accomplishing the mission, it is also about saving lives.
3) If you are worried about straights leaving the military due to "klingers" then end the ban for you prevent straights from leaving.
4) Besides losing soldiers to being kicked out due to the Gay Ban. Good gay soldiers, who keep there personal life underwraps, leave due to the stress of being kicked out. These are the good soldiers, they one you believe serve honorably.
5) No country that has made the switch from the gay ban to allowing gays to serve honorably, have seen massive decreases in recruitment. Let me quote from a 152 page study that studied the transition Britian, Canada, Australia, South Africa, and Israel had when each country repealed their ban.
QUOTE
In many of those countries, debate before the policy changes was highly pitched
and many people both inside and outside the military predicted major disruptions.
In Britain and Canada, roughly two thirds of military respondents in polls said
they would refuse to serve with open gays, but when inclusive policies were
implemented, no more than three people in each country actually resigned.
END QUOTE
Study link is here
http://www.palmcenter.org/files/GaysinForeignMilitaries2010.pdf
3 people in Britain resigned due to the repeal of the gay ban, 3 people, even though in opinion polls 2/3rds of soldiers said they would have problems serving with open gays.
------------------------------------------
When this is all said and done (for DADT is going to end, and it is probably going to end in the next 4 years). You are going to see any major differences between the military. You aren't going to see newspapers writing big headlines saying XYZ died, or ABC resigned, or increase anxiety in the military. It will be a nonstory, and thus you won't see any big differences.
If you disagree, than lets bet on the outcome.
2) You are worrying about soldiers dying, but having a gay ban and kicking out 600 to 1200 soldiers each year (13,000 in 16 years) kills soldiers that are not kicked out. Having the right doctor, the right translator, even the right infantryman man for the job saves lives. There is reason why we are so hard on training our soldiers, it isn't just about accomplishing the mission, it is also about saving lives.
3) If you are worried about straights leaving the military due to "klingers" then end the ban for you prevent straights from leaving.
4) Besides losing soldiers to being kicked out due to the Gay Ban. Good gay soldiers, who keep there personal life underwraps, leave due to the stress of being kicked out. These are the good soldiers, they one you believe serve honorably.
5) No country that has made the switch from the gay ban to allowing gays to serve honorably, have seen massive decreases in recruitment. Let me quote from a 152 page study that studied the transition Britian, Canada, Australia, South Africa, and Israel had when each country repealed their ban.
QUOTE
In many of those countries, debate before the policy changes was highly pitched
and many people both inside and outside the military predicted major disruptions.
In Britain and Canada, roughly two thirds of military respondents in polls said
they would refuse to serve with open gays, but when inclusive policies were
implemented, no more than three people in each country actually resigned.
END QUOTE
Study link is here
http://www.palmcenter.org/files/GaysinForeignMilitaries2010.pdf
3 people in Britain resigned due to the repeal of the gay ban, 3 people, even though in opinion polls 2/3rds of soldiers said they would have problems serving with open gays.
------------------------------------------
When this is all said and done (for DADT is going to end, and it is probably going to end in the next 4 years). You are going to see any major differences between the military. You aren't going to see newspapers writing big headlines saying XYZ died, or ABC resigned, or increase anxiety in the military. It will be a nonstory, and thus you won't see any big differences.
If you disagree, than lets bet on the outcome.
Gays in military ruling creates dilemma for brass
- 07/03/2010 12:34:19 AM
841 Views
Can't be that hard to prove.
- 07/03/2010 12:53:13 AM
411 Views
Do you think...
- 07/03/2010 01:01:25 AM
429 Views
Okay try...
- 07/03/2010 01:04:31 AM
366 Views
Except...
- 07/03/2010 01:13:01 AM
372 Views
I have mixed feelings on the policy
- 07/03/2010 01:05:44 AM
483 Views
Most solider's aren't going to come out just because the policy changes
- 07/03/2010 03:10:12 AM
482 Views
Re: Most solider's aren't going to come out just because the policy changes
- 07/03/2010 03:31:53 AM
387 Views
I think you are overly hopeful about what repealing it would do
- 07/03/2010 05:06:23 AM
511 Views
A couple of points
- 08/03/2010 01:15:50 AM
406 Views

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