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Huh Sidious Send a noteboard - 09/11/2010 07:56:15 AM
Note how in the early books they mention how careful Perrin is, because of his size and strength. Egwene, being small and female, would never have had to learn lessons like that. When young Perrin gets in a confrontation, he backs down or gets told "pick on someone your own size." When a small person gets in that situation, they have the oppositte experience. Younger children tend to receive much less discipline than their older siblings, because the parents are used to the ideas of their babies growing up and learning to function, and because they are tired of fighting the same battles with each kid. By the time the youngest hits her teens, Mom & Dad are basically going "Fuck it. What's the worst that can happen?" In a village where everyone is into everyone else's business anyway, a kid can't get into too much trouble, and with the family business being inn-keeping, her chores and responsibilities were basically ordinary daily tasks only expanded in scale. Farm kids would have had to learn to take care of the farm, and bust their humps and take responsibility (even Mat is only irresponsible by comparison to the super-conscientious Perrin & Rand). Their wills are curtailed by mother nature, whereas Egwene's example would have been Nynaeve who appeared to make nature bend to her.

There's really no evidence that Egwene grew up as a spoiled brat just because her father is the mayor and owner of the inn. Her life has not been better than any of the other main characters. If anything, Egwene has been begrudged by years of bad treatment as Nynaeve's apprentice that led to a feeling of desperation to prove her worth, considering Nynaeve never saw it. Not a single person in Emonds Field liked Nynaeve, its no surprise her own apprentice felt unloved.

In short, Egwene would have grown up unrestrained or curtailed in her basic behavior patterns (also, more likely to end up a homosexual, BTW), and at the same time, being among the least in many ways, would have come by her craving for power quite naturally.


IMO Egwene should have been a lesbian, or at least uninterested in relationships much like Moiraine/Siuan are. I've never thought that the Amyrlin is a good candidate for a normal life, and her relationship with Gawyn is forced and a little perverse with its radical aspects of control. Even Lan said that it would take a strong man to marry an Aes Sedai, and to marry the Amyrlin, even worse. Egwene shouldn't be involved with anyone - she's got a permanent high-stress political position, and no time for another mindless Trakand.

Not to mention, we see how well she takes criticism, or even people arguing a contrary point of view. The girl who unilateraly decided Rand needed to be taken down a peg for his own good, because he had the audacity to expect his soldiers to obey his orders, who used their aquaintanceship to barge in on him and make a big production out of her refusal to acknowledge his rank or stature,

Egwene and Rand have irritated each other since the beginning of the series. It's plain that the Pattern has set her up to oppose him in everything, and for some underlying reason.

orders beatings for girls who make faces at her

She's the Amyrlin... what would Siuan Sanche do if that happened to her?

on exactly the same terms she used to tell Rand to wash his ears. When she has her flip-flop on the subject of the Three Oaths, she gratuitously threatens punishment for the two people who have done a far better job of living up to them than she did. One day she's challenging Nynaeve for agreeing to do her best to live up to the Oaths, contrarily asserting her intentions to use the Power as weapon when she damn well wants, and ridiculing her for her attempts to avoid lies, and then when Nynaeve merely asks if she's thought about that topic, she's cutting off all conversation with an imperious gesture and threatening punishment for disobediance to a rule they have just found out cuts your life in half.


Nynaeve/Elayne weren't tutored by Siuan. Flawed as she is, Siuan was still an Amyrlin and had knowledge of the secret history of the Tower, as well as a greater understanding of its ethos and customs, which she heavily imprinted on Egwene. Egwene shouldn't even consider Nynaeve's opinion on these issues, base philosophers that they are... Nynaeve probably had an epiphany in her tent that lasted all of ten minutes surrounding the subject, whereas Egwene has been considering all aspects of the Tower for months. People forget that being the uber-channeler queen of the series doesn't make Nynaeve the source of all wisdom. She's got a lions heart but she's never been an intellectual. Egwene's made devious plans that would leave Nynaeve on the floor gasping if she tried to comprehend them.

Egwene could pick much better advisors than Nynaeve/Elayne. Nynaeve has always been impulsive and illogical, and Elayne is almost singular in her thought processes surrounding Andor. Egwene is the only one who consistently thinks about the White Tower, and she has some close advisors and the Hall who are much better equipped than two women who spend all their time fighting the Shadow. Let them play their part, and let Egwene play hers.

Mommy & Daddy's homespun wisdom does not have a chance.

She outgrew them almost as soon as she climbed onto Bela. Its not unlikely she resents them for the simple-minded existence they tried to suppress her with when she knew she had potential. In only a few years she became the youngest and most powerful woman in the world (except maybe for Tuon). Emonds Field never created a greater woman. The thought of her going back is toxic to the mind.
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This message last edited by Sidious on 09/11/2010 at 08:00:07 AM
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"She knew Egwene wanted Cairhien..." - 05/11/2010 03:22:29 AM 2323 Views
Do you have a reference that we can look at? - 05/11/2010 03:24:39 AM 847 Views
Chapter 45 - A Reunion, Page 669 - 05/11/2010 03:59:25 AM 1033 Views
Ok, now I've checked it. - 05/11/2010 04:07:20 AM 896 Views
Re: "She knew Egwene wanted Cairhien..." - 05/11/2010 03:49:16 AM 1001 Views
except... - 05/11/2010 03:49:45 AM 899 Views
Re: except... - 05/11/2010 04:05:00 AM 898 Views
Re: except... - 05/11/2010 05:35:05 AM 818 Views
Re: except... - 05/11/2010 04:06:01 AM 871 Views
We all know Egwene is going to save the day while getting everything she wants and more - 05/11/2010 04:14:55 AM 978 Views
Egwene also needs to talk to her mother and father - 05/11/2010 04:25:43 AM 802 Views
Re: Egwene also needs to talk to her mother and father - 05/11/2010 01:53:17 PM 805 Views
Re: Egwene also needs to talk to her mother and father - 05/11/2010 02:00:37 PM 878 Views
Re: Egwene also needs to talk to her mother and father - 05/11/2010 02:04:47 PM 798 Views
she's the youngest child - 07/11/2010 07:51:20 PM 714 Views
why? - 05/11/2010 03:10:39 PM 905 Views
Re: why? - 05/11/2010 04:23:16 PM 873 Views
That didn't sound like madman's ramblings at all.... - 05/11/2010 05:00:59 PM 935 Views
Re: That didn't sound like madman's ramblings at all.... - 05/11/2010 11:10:46 PM 813 Views
Hail Amrlyin Palpategwene - 06/11/2010 02:05:09 AM 870 Views
They're the ones who raised her this way! That's the last thing she needs. - 06/11/2010 03:38:17 PM 870 Views
Um, can we assume her parents raised her that way? - 08/11/2010 04:57:05 AM 725 Views
She's a short, female, youngest child of influential parents. Arrogance would come naturally to her. - 09/11/2010 02:08:29 AM 818 Views
Huh - 09/11/2010 07:56:15 AM 840 Views
Wow. What the fuck did your parents do to you? *NM* - 09/11/2010 03:35:07 PM 414 Views
- 09/11/2010 06:14:30 PM 592 Views
I try to avoid projecting myself onto fictional characters. Or real people. - 09/11/2010 06:45:14 PM 738 Views
too bad - 09/11/2010 08:20:04 PM 715 Views
Why don't you compare her to a summer's day while you're at it? *NM* - 09/11/2010 07:45:20 PM 350 Views
well... - 09/11/2010 08:18:08 PM 648 Views
I'm teasing you because you lay it on a little thick sometimes *NM* - 10/11/2010 01:10:39 AM 474 Views
You are seriously mis-perceiving a number of things. - 10/11/2010 01:30:47 AM 894 Views
So? - 05/11/2010 09:53:22 AM 771 Views
Re: So? - 05/11/2010 07:59:12 PM 809 Views
Re: So? - 06/11/2010 09:06:49 AM 696 Views
She didn't say that. You changed the wording and read it without context. - 05/11/2010 03:29:27 PM 911 Views
So? - 05/11/2010 04:04:54 PM 745 Views
The engima that is Egwene - 06/11/2010 01:41:43 AM 772 Views
I wonder if... - 06/11/2010 05:17:45 AM 755 Views
You might have paid more attention than me when reading - 06/11/2010 06:50:46 AM 748 Views
The reason rand didn't tell Egwene about why he needs to break the seals is simple - 22/06/2011 10:49:25 PM 799 Views
That's the problem with Elayne that has emerged. - 06/11/2010 03:31:41 PM 932 Views
Or, you know, she's being cleverer than you give her credit for... - 06/11/2010 04:45:10 PM 814 Views
This is the problem with rulers - what is smart for them equals increasing their power. Which is bad - 06/11/2010 08:40:19 PM 761 Views
So fragmentation is the reply? - 06/11/2010 09:59:47 PM 748 Views
Checks and balances IS diluting power. - 09/11/2010 02:16:18 AM 766 Views
The Andoran houses should ask one question of Elayne - and remove her if she answers wrongly - 08/11/2010 02:03:08 AM 816 Views
Hear, hear. - 09/11/2010 02:18:49 AM 792 Views
Maybe it's typo - 08/11/2010 06:38:26 PM 949 Views
Yes, I'm pretty certain it is. - 09/11/2010 09:00:32 AM 706 Views
Agreed - 09/11/2010 07:05:09 PM 652 Views
i thought it was a typo too *NM* - 10/11/2010 09:11:10 AM 443 Views

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