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That is weak logic in the extreme... Shannow Send a noteboard - 06/02/2011 06:16:46 PM
there is no representative population being reflected in the Tower. If there was we would see the same number of women from each nation, in each generation etc... fact is the Tower is elitist and has an over distribution of wealthy women (Nobles specifically). The vast majority of Tower women either got shipped off because the Power manifested and there was no other choice (Siuan) or had the personal means to afford the trip to TV. What prevented Sharina or any of the more than 1000 women Egwene picked up on the way to TV from making the trip in the first place? They lived too far away and didn't possess the means to get herself there on the off chance that she MIGHT be able to become an AS. Politics aside there are likely thousands of women out there that could never have gotten to TV in the first place.

we don't even see an even distribution in the Tower ... there are far more Sisters below even Verin than above her too. Which should not be the case ... by and large the Tower has attracted women who were financially able and probably had some form of exposure to education. The very fact that there are at least 3 women born from Royal Houses in the ranks of AS proves how skewed AS distribution is from the normal population.


What are you actually proving with the above? Siuan, the previous Amyrlin was a fisherman's daughter. Bera or Kiruna or someone was a farmers daughter. And then you have Moiriane, a noblewoman.

There is no correlation between One Power strength and the relative nobility of your blood. So the background of any given Aes Sedai is irrelevant in any case. Elayne is a noblewoman and she's the strongest Aes Sedai in a thousand years.

Besides, the strength distribution among Aiel corresponds to that of Aes Sedai. Amys is one of the strongest Wise Ones, and she's around Moiraine's strength or slightly weaker.

As for the fact that more women are weaker than Verin than stronger, that is to be expected if the average woman is not much stronger than Dagian.

You are making no sense whatsoever.
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Proof that Asmodean's effective One Power strength is greater than Moghedien's... Shannow - 03/02/2011 03:22:42 PM 2442 Views
Huh? fionwe1987 - 03/02/2011 04:08:29 PM 1372 Views
Why do you deliberately misquote the text? Shannow - 03/02/2011 04:12:50 PM 1464 Views
You're deliberately being obtuse... as usual... fionwe1987 - 03/02/2011 10:07:09 PM 1339 Views
Right. So Egwene can shield someone of Egwene's own strength, plus Elayne, AND weave a dozen flows.. Shannow - 03/02/2011 10:26:27 PM 1351 Views
fionwe1987 - 03/02/2011 10:46:40 PM 1191 Views
No. Egwene is very close to her full potential at the time... Shannow - 03/02/2011 11:44:20 PM 1437 Views
Bullshit... fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 12:39:42 AM 1177 Views
Unbiased view... Nargs - 04/02/2011 01:46:40 AM 1315 Views
The WoT Board in a nutshell. *NM* Ghavrel - 04/02/2011 02:34:32 AM 678 Views
Yeah, thats unbiased... *NM* fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 05:23:17 PM 605 Views
Don't agree Sidious - 04/02/2011 08:30:02 AM 1272 Views
Fair comment, but my question then is: Shannow - 04/02/2011 11:26:25 AM 1191 Views
I think the WO and Moiraine also Force Egwene as they know what's coming and need her darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 03:55:46 PM 1241 Views
It is specifically stated that Egwene was forced by the rigours of the damane training... Shannow - 04/02/2011 05:15:20 PM 1252 Views
Egwene has been continually forced... fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 06:02:08 PM 1146 Views
The direct quotes contradict you... Shannow - 04/02/2011 06:23:03 PM 1252 Views
actually the quote substantiates that Egwene is only slightly stronger than Moiraine in TSR darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 07:51:10 PM 1267 Views
here ya go they were all Forced darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 07:59:40 PM 1105 Views
Nope... fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 08:23:00 PM 1187 Views
I think you may have misused the term - RJ meant 'effective' to mean something a bit different. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/02/2011 04:40:41 PM 1362 Views
Re: I think you are mistaking what RJ meant effective to mean. Shannow - 03/02/2011 05:30:15 PM 1264 Views
Re: I think you are mistaking what RJ meant effective to mean. Master Ablar - 03/02/2011 05:45:30 PM 1270 Views
Re: I think you are mistaking what RJ meant effective to mean. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/02/2011 06:31:34 PM 1199 Views
Re: I think you are mistaking what RJ meant effective to mean. Kieran - 03/02/2011 07:06:50 PM 1233 Views
Re: I think you are mistaking what RJ meant effective to mean. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/02/2011 07:17:25 PM 1176 Views
We still don't know who is effectively stronger, and not sure if Asmo was equal to Rand by the end. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/02/2011 06:58:14 PM 1046 Views
See my post above, I would say Asmo is Weaker than Moggy... *NM* Kieran - 03/02/2011 07:10:07 PM 649 Views
I'm not certain either way. I think it all depends on the terms being used. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 03/02/2011 07:22:01 PM 1218 Views
Effective strength means who can make the bigger fireball, the stronger shield, the thicker balefire Shannow - 03/02/2011 07:42:17 PM 1094 Views
I still hold to the point that your analogy is false. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 04/02/2011 04:20:05 PM 1138 Views
My impression of your view, in general, is that... Shannow - 03/02/2011 07:33:37 PM 1167 Views
How... fionwe1987 - 03/02/2011 10:15:34 PM 1089 Views
If Nynaeve could do to Egwene and Elayne what Rand did to them, then I rest my case... Shannow - 03/02/2011 10:36:46 PM 1343 Views
Re: If Nynaeve could do to Egwene and Elayne what Rand did to them, then I rest my case... fionwe1987 - 03/02/2011 10:50:57 PM 1232 Views
Got you now... Shannow - 03/02/2011 11:32:49 PM 1163 Views
You're clearly delusional... fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 12:59:26 AM 1167 Views
You sound ridiculous Nargs - 04/02/2011 02:05:18 AM 1219 Views
Re: You sound ridiculous Kieran - 04/02/2011 02:23:50 AM 1261 Views
Ok... Nargs - 04/02/2011 04:13:34 PM 1079 Views
Elayne is not stronger than most AS at this point in the books darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:14:41 PM 1162 Views
Where on earth does it say Nynaeve could do to Egwene and Elayne what Rand did? darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:06:48 PM 1238 Views
Re: How... Sidious - 04/02/2011 08:34:21 AM 1288 Views
They're very close now... fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 05:46:48 PM 1280 Views
That is unfortunately not true... Shannow - 04/02/2011 06:02:34 PM 1230 Views
It is... fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 06:05:05 PM 1083 Views
Re: It is... Sidious - 04/02/2011 06:31:32 PM 1313 Views
Yup... fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 08:20:33 PM 1094 Views
Semirhage hated Lanfear, but dared not act against her strength... Shannow - 04/02/2011 08:29:24 PM 1511 Views
yet Graendal showed a lot of respect for Semirhage ... even assumed she was the most darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:53:05 PM 1204 Views
Graendal on Semirhage and Demandred... Shannow - 04/02/2011 09:23:50 PM 1460 Views
No Sidious - 04/02/2011 11:10:00 PM 1234 Views
CLAPS *NM* darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 05:15:21 AM 675 Views
We will just have to disagree on this one... Shannow - 05/02/2011 06:57:36 AM 1093 Views
Indeed Sidious - 05/02/2011 07:38:10 AM 1105 Views
I agree with you ... especially abou the perpective issue darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 03:00:58 PM 1224 Views
I agree with you here darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:19:35 PM 1136 Views
I don't think that's true.. fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 08:21:38 PM 1072 Views
the evidence is that Aginor burnt out trying to channel the Eye and Rand didn't darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:23:50 PM 1045 Views
Considering that Asmodean and Rand were using a sa'angreal... ˥ɐ ʎpu∀ɹ - 04/02/2011 04:55:03 AM 1354 Views
I think this is a no brainer Sidious - 04/02/2011 08:22:00 AM 1279 Views
The nice fact which is proven is the magnitude of the gap between Moghedien and Semirhage... Shannow - 04/02/2011 11:32:00 AM 1094 Views
Nynaeve could be at 90% or 80% when she faced Moghedien we have no way of measuring that darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:42:03 PM 1093 Views
Disagree... Shannow - 04/02/2011 08:51:55 PM 1192 Views
spin it all you like... I'm tired of this arument and your creative quoting. darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:56:14 PM 1088 Views
The creative quoter is Fionwe, not me. You quote correctly, but your interpretations are way off... Shannow - 04/02/2011 09:05:43 PM 1026 Views
Nynaeve has grown in strength, but she started nearly as strong as Moiraine! darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 05:35:05 AM 1138 Views
Starting out at Moiraine's strength meant starting out at barely 30% of her full potential... Shannow - 05/02/2011 07:05:46 AM 1147 Views
Nynaeve's strength Sidious - 05/02/2011 07:49:07 AM 1241 Views
Agree, Egwene has never been as strong as Nynaeve at any stage. *NM* darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 03:03:25 PM 717 Views
I disagree that Moiraine is 30% of Nynaeve. Much closer to 50% of Nynaeve. EDIT darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 03:02:06 PM 1277 Views
Minor quibbles aside... fionwe1987 - 05/02/2011 04:05:30 PM 1281 Views
Agreed, the exact numbers are arbitrary, I place Egwene a tad higher than you ... EDIT darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 04:30:00 PM 1099 Views
Re: Agreed, the exact numbers are arbitrary, I place Egwene a tad higher than you ... EDIT fionwe1987 - 05/02/2011 06:09:41 PM 1194 Views
shrugs darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 06:46:02 PM 1149 Views
Re: shrugs fionwe1987 - 05/02/2011 08:03:37 PM 1165 Views
I don't recall the Merise quote you are refering too and they have not been together in the series darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 09:20:56 PM 1068 Views
I'm sorry, I meant the glossary entry... fionwe1987 - 05/02/2011 10:29:46 PM 1071 Views
Thanks for clarifying darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 11:12:19 PM 1019 Views
Re: Thanks for clarifying fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 12:42:51 AM 1084 Views
fair enough ... I can agree to Cadsuane and Bode both being 70 with Egwene and co at 80 *NM* darius_sedai - 06/02/2011 04:29:49 AM 579 Views
Cool! *NM* fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 04:18:52 PM 599 Views
Sorry, but here your entire Bell Curve goes up in smoke... Shannow - 06/02/2011 01:13:15 PM 1061 Views
In fact, Moiraine is even STRONGER than I postulated in the above post... Shannow - 06/02/2011 01:22:11 PM 1438 Views
well... Sidious - 06/02/2011 02:11:02 PM 1173 Views
Only a separate Bell Curve for the Age of Legends - when the average strength was higher - will work Shannow - 06/02/2011 03:29:49 PM 1100 Views
Or, you know, the Aes Sedai aren't a representative sample... *NM* fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 04:19:22 PM 727 Views
I don't think Strength was higher in the AOL I think there were just more channelers darius_sedai - 06/02/2011 04:50:42 PM 1159 Views
Yup. fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 05:30:54 PM 1070 Views
Trivial darius_sedai - 06/02/2011 06:10:55 PM 1086 Views
Uhhh... no... fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 04:18:19 PM 1009 Views
Read these facts slowly, maybe you will grasp the implication then... Shannow - 06/02/2011 04:41:02 PM 1143 Views
you are missing the fact that women like Sharina have no interest in the Tower darius_sedai - 06/02/2011 05:05:10 PM 1169 Views
You equate random exclusions with the deliberate block exclusion of 37.5% weakest women... Shannow - 06/02/2011 05:41:47 PM 1131 Views
wrong darius_sedai - 06/02/2011 06:08:20 PM 1214 Views
That is weak logic in the extreme... Shannow - 06/02/2011 06:16:46 PM 1097 Views
what I'm saying is that a representative sample of the entire population darius_sedai - 06/02/2011 06:40:51 PM 1120 Views
Yes. *NM* fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 06:47:59 PM 670 Views
Yes. *NM* fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 06:48:00 PM 592 Views
But you don't prove that the undiscovered women are stronger. They may well be weaker... Shannow - 06/02/2011 07:26:27 PM 965 Views
Amys is far from the strongest WO! fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 07:37:14 PM 1327 Views
Explain the 1000 women they found in Murandy then... fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 06:26:46 PM 1128 Views
And a 1000 years ago... fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 06:33:29 PM 1100 Views
The only implication I grasped is that you don't grasp math... fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 06:21:12 PM 1241 Views
Circular reasoning... Shannow - 06/02/2011 07:03:53 PM 1152 Views
No, reasoning based on facts and what RJ said, both of which you ignore... fionwe1987 - 06/02/2011 07:34:21 PM 1393 Views
If you're going to ignore direct quotes, then we may as well stop right now... Shannow - 06/02/2011 08:42:40 PM 1240 Views
Agreed. RugbyPlayingAshaman - 04/02/2011 04:32:05 PM 1169 Views
Agree. *NM* fionwe1987 - 04/02/2011 05:49:05 PM 674 Views
agreed *NM* darius_sedai - 04/02/2011 08:27:22 PM 718 Views
off tangent question: Has Nynaeve yet to reach full potential or did she already after being ... Bookwyrm - 04/02/2011 08:39:29 PM 1173 Views
I think the general concensus is that after the CK she was forced to her full potential darius_sedai - 05/02/2011 03:44:29 PM 1124 Views
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