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Re: Siuan screwed up big time. Cannoli Send a noteboard - 12/05/2011 02:13:08 PM

Siuan didn't have to be secretive and manipulative as she was just to conceal her knowledge of what Moiraine was up to with Rand, but she was busy "preparing" (read: Manipulating) world leaders into accepting him while being just as careful to make sure no one in the Tower knew what she was up to despite making it obvious to EVERYONE she was up to something. Even if she didn't reveal anything to anyone she could've remained more involved and engaged with Tower leaders than she had to have been for one dissident White and a long absent Red to engineer a coup requiring most of the Hall. They were ripe for her overthrow because they'd been reduced to isolated spectators (and often not even that) and lackeys in a game whose goals and rules only Siuan knew.
Also, don't forget, Siuan herself was the one to figure out that the Black Ajah KNEW Rand had been born and what they were trying to do about it. If the Black Ajah already knows, than the only people Siuan is keeping in the dark about the Dragon's Rebirth are the good guys! She is not protecting Rand at all, since the Shadow is fully aware of him. She is only keeping him a secret from those who might want to help him! Siuan, as far as she knew, was sharing a secret with the Black Ajah! Why do you do that? Plainly the Shadow is okay with keeping Rand a secret from the world, and as Moiraine says, is there a better reason to oppose something?

As for setting Egwene up as Latrae, that may well be, but how much she did to "save the world" remains to be seen. HER plan was to use create the Choedan Kal to reimprison the DO; there's no evidence that was even possible, and had the Shadow known the access keys were within territory they captured it could've been disastrous. All we really know was that the full implementation of LTTs plan required women and was thus significantly impaired without them (though is his comments in ToM indicate he hadn't anticipated and consequently planned for the DOs response anyway, so in that sense perhaps Latrae did save the world).
But in a manner that does not redound to her credit. She was wrong about the consequences she predicted for LTT's plan, after all. "No one anticipated the Dark One's counter-stroke" is the official word. And even knowing about the taint in advance, a strong case could still be made for going forward with the plan anyway. The Breaking was a preferable fate to the conquest and triumph of the Shadow. Latra Posae screwed up by allowing the Breaking to happen on her watch. Given what we know of her behavior prior to the Strike on Shayol Ghul, I would not be surprised at all to learn that a large part of what allowed the Breaking to happen was the same hesitant, dilatory & overly cautious, George McClellan-esque approach to a crisis. I am sure she dithered over the problem of what to do about the male channelers just long enough for them to escalate into a nigh-insurmountable problem.
Cannoli
"Sometimes unhinged, sometimes unfair, always entertaining"
- The Crownless

“Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” GK Chesteron
Deus Vult!
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Egwene vs. Gawyn (ToM spoilers of course) - 28/04/2011 05:01:46 AM 4229 Views
There's fifty feet of crap between rock bottom and your post... *NM* - 28/04/2011 07:40:04 AM 520 Views
Almost three days since the last post...at least I'm trying. - 28/04/2011 12:17:59 PM 1045 Views
Sorry about that... - 28/04/2011 10:58:50 PM 1107 Views
Ah, its always good to see a good Egwene rant. Bravo! NM *NM* - 28/04/2011 01:58:46 PM 758 Views
Great work, Cannoli - 28/04/2011 02:09:28 PM 1064 Views
Regarding the mother's permission.... - 28/04/2011 07:26:29 PM 1130 Views
while i agree with you on most of this - 28/04/2011 04:53:06 PM 1188 Views
hmpf, i post a good point and nothing - 28/04/2011 11:09:53 PM 968 Views
Everybody agrees with you, that's why there were no replies *NM* - 28/04/2011 11:29:13 PM 504 Views
Here's a scary thought - 28/04/2011 11:54:50 PM 1281 Views
OMGWTFBBQ!? - 28/04/2011 11:58:37 PM 1004 Views
In regards to the letters... - 28/04/2011 05:28:13 PM 1240 Views
But Gawyn was not Egwene's subject - 28/04/2011 06:09:31 PM 1044 Views
Which was why I thought it was appropriate, since he meant to act as Egwene's Warder. - 28/04/2011 06:19:53 PM 1002 Views
The only issue is that Warders are not minions - they are honored junior partners. - 28/04/2011 07:39:18 PM 1164 Views
No, the junior partners are Accepted. Warders are essentially personal bodyguards and/or assistants. - 28/04/2011 08:00:17 PM 961 Views
Marriage - 28/04/2011 08:27:53 PM 976 Views
Accepted are not anything, let alone junior partners. Don't think N&E's experience was typical - 28/04/2011 09:32:22 PM 1212 Views
Here's the thing though... - 28/04/2011 11:20:32 PM 1012 Views
No, but it's cute and quirky when Faile does it. - 29/04/2011 03:06:50 PM 1178 Views
But... - 29/04/2011 10:52:03 PM 973 Views
That's not really clear - 29/04/2011 11:41:20 PM 1107 Views
Actually, it is... - 30/04/2011 06:37:42 PM 1149 Views
Re: Actually, it is... - 30/04/2011 11:17:21 PM 1001 Views
Didn't Siuan, Gareth and Gawyn tell her about the Bloodknife they encountered? - 02/05/2011 02:33:08 PM 1014 Views
It isn't the worst romance in WoT - 28/04/2011 08:10:23 PM 1313 Views
Re: It isn't the worst romance in WoT - 28/04/2011 08:25:31 PM 1234 Views
thumbs up to you both *NM* - 28/04/2011 08:45:51 PM 492 Views
Re: It isn't the worst romance in WoT - 28/04/2011 08:46:37 PM 1133 Views
Galad is a great option for a political marriage - 28/04/2011 09:04:46 PM 1005 Views
Yes, but... - 28/04/2011 09:40:39 PM 1038 Views
but galad knew nothing of berelain's closeness to rand, so that couldn't have affected anything - 28/04/2011 10:12:23 PM 1077 Views
Exactly - 28/04/2011 10:27:04 PM 937 Views
Yes. An often overlooked point is that ELAYNE, not Egwene, gains the most power in ToM - 28/04/2011 09:42:43 PM 1397 Views
Except... - 28/04/2011 11:16:25 PM 1031 Views
Well... - 29/04/2011 12:14:42 AM 998 Views
Re: Well... - 29/04/2011 08:39:37 AM 959 Views
Except they're both really hot. - 28/04/2011 10:01:46 PM 1179 Views
They were naive - 28/04/2011 11:10:34 PM 980 Views
Re: They were naive - 29/04/2011 03:18:42 PM 1294 Views
I can only quibble; Egwene became so insufferable in ToM I'm convinced her fate will be unpleasant. - 04/05/2011 12:41:53 AM 1193 Views
Siuan... - 04/05/2011 05:42:59 AM 1143 Views
Re: Siuan screwed up big time. - 07/05/2011 03:35:46 AM 1066 Views
Re: Siuan screwed up big time. - 12/05/2011 02:13:08 PM 997 Views
"McClellanesque", eh? I'll have to remember that one. - 16/05/2011 12:12:23 AM 1273 Views

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