Active Users:850 Time:01/02/2026 11:38:05 PM
Re: Again, my point isn't about motivations for Elaida or Gitara ... that is clear DomA Send a noteboard - 15/10/2012 03:15:18 AM
Elaida herself recalled that after her foretelling, which she kept secret, she made sure to attach herself to the girl who seemed most likely to win the Lion Throne.

The evidence is that Elaida "volunteered" herself to Morgase the high seat, and thus got "promoted" as advisor to the Queen of Andor when she won. There was likely no reason for the Hall to refuse to confirm the position, Elaida is capable. Advisors/ambassadors are normally assigned by the Hall (or it's subject to a vote of the Hall anyway, they probably don't initiate all nominations), as far as we know, and it makes sense it's the domain of the "college of Ajahs" as otherwise an Amyrlin would systematically favour people answering to her (it's one of those things Egwene has changed, she's negotiated full power over diplomacy against leaving the Hall final decision over military matters).

It's being demoted as Sitters and being sent as ambassadors to a weak and faraway Court Joline and Teslyn ressented.


It's the Hall and Amyrlin letter her. Can you imagine them letting Hattori or another weak Sister take the role? Important posts are seemingly always given to strong Sisters. The hierarchy demands such things. If Elaida or Gitara had been weak in the Power they would not have been allowed to act as the Advisor to the most powerful monarch in the land.

Gitara not only held that position, but later was appointed Keeper, which is another post we've mostly seen held by very strong sisters. Sheriam, Leane, Silviana. Duhara is the wild card here but that seems obviously a BA situation. Much like Sitters and Ajah Heads, the hierarchy affects these roles to an extreme degree.


As far as we know, multiple other factors are considered before strength in those matters (just like strength is only one factor in the choice of Sitters). Aes Sedai are not completely stupid. They would consider experience and skill, and a personality suitable to that of the leader. It's the same for ambassadors, not chosen exclusively because of strength. Verin was able to influence so much the Salidar embassy because she outranked all of them and not being part of the embassy she wasn't placed under the authority of its leader (who wasn't the strongest of the lot, the Hall simply put her in charge), then Bera and Kiruna arrived and outranked all of them again and took control. So clearly the women the Hall had chosen to be Rand's advisors were not the strongest available...

Now if you're saying that Elaida's strength was probably a factor in the fact someone as young as she was was able to retain the position she had grabbed for herself, you're probably right. It would at least have stiffled protest, if the Hall had any reason to protest, and mind you the fact Morgase accepted her as advisor while High Seat probably counted just as much. She may even have asked Elaida to stay as advisor once she got the crown. Elaida was also the protégée of Galina, so no doubt she had strong support from the three Red Sitters.

When it comes to politics/diplomacy, Aes Sedai don't rely solely or evem mostly on strength. Some of the Sitters are just above average. It's more that strength gives you a big advantage even there, but aside from Joline and Teslyn who were atypical as they were sent as advisors to humiliate them, we just have Elaida/Gitara as evidence a strong woman might be preferred for Andor, and it might have more to do with Gitara's strong personality than anything, and we know Elaida grabbed the position for herself without an appointement.



Reply to message
Misc observations from my latest re-read - 14/10/2012 08:26:37 PM 3155 Views
How does LTT know about Far Madding's history? - 14/10/2012 08:29:13 PM 1704 Views
How Stong was Gitara? - 14/10/2012 08:34:43 PM 1638 Views
So so stong. She had incredible stength. - 14/10/2012 09:04:15 PM 1668 Views
Degree of slowing is the same as how long they will live - 14/10/2012 09:22:23 PM 1484 Views
Re: Degree of slowing is the same as how long they will live - 14/10/2012 09:36:19 PM 1286 Views
Not in the mood to deal with you ... Go read the Ages section of 13th Depository - 14/10/2012 09:53:14 PM 1301 Views
Not interested in Linda's private theories. - 15/10/2012 02:29:41 AM 1470 Views
And there's Sorilea... - 15/10/2012 02:53:15 AM 1499 Views
Perhaps, but Bair is in her 80s and can't channel at all - 15/10/2012 03:09:35 AM 1280 Views
Problem is... - 14/10/2012 11:52:00 PM 1394 Views
Again, my point isn't about motivations for Elaida or Gitara ... that is clear - 15/10/2012 12:07:49 AM 1283 Views
Show me where in the books an adviser is selected by Tower authorities! - 15/10/2012 02:58:19 AM 1282 Views
Yet look what happens the minute a Stronger woman showed up - 15/10/2012 03:19:18 AM 1229 Views
Re: Yet look what happens the minute a Stronger woman showed up - 15/10/2012 03:35:10 AM 1355 Views
Yet Morgase herself states she didn't consider Elaida a friend - 15/10/2012 03:45:45 AM 1181 Views
How did Gareth Bryne get to stay Captain General, given his lack of respect to Aes Sedai? - 15/10/2012 04:07:07 AM 1326 Views
He was banging the queen - 15/10/2012 04:19:24 AM 1230 Views
And what Aes Sedai gave him permission to bang the queen? - 15/10/2012 04:30:42 AM 1493 Views
here ya go - 15/10/2012 04:39:29 AM 1351 Views
There's an awful lot for "not many" - 15/10/2012 05:07:30 AM 1281 Views
When did I say I bought into Linda's theories? - 15/10/2012 05:29:27 AM 1213 Views
Re: Again, my point isn't about motivations for Elaida or Gitara ... that is clear - 15/10/2012 03:15:18 AM 1362 Views
The thing is Elaida had no experience in the arena at all - 15/10/2012 03:25:10 AM 1266 Views
IT IS NOT THE TOWER'S DAMNED JOB! She had more than enough credentials for ANDOR - 15/10/2012 03:45:15 AM 1336 Views
Nope. Every other advisor we've seen has been sent from TV - 15/10/2012 03:50:07 AM 1285 Views
Those are not official advisers, those are ambassadors! - 15/10/2012 04:17:51 AM 1346 Views
So now you are saying that Elaida was a personal advisor not an envoy of the Tower? - 15/10/2012 04:22:31 AM 1273 Views
Finally! I was beginning to despair of your literacy! - 15/10/2012 04:34:18 AM 1329 Views
now I am questioning your literacy *NM* - 15/10/2012 04:40:45 AM 844 Views
She didn't "land it". She took the job for herself... - 15/10/2012 04:00:35 AM 1258 Views
Actually every advisor we've seen except Elaida has been appointed - 15/10/2012 04:11:39 AM 1278 Views
You can bully someone into an act, not a twenty year relationship - 15/10/2012 04:22:16 AM 1391 Views
Not arguing that Morgase had a problem with her - 15/10/2012 04:33:10 AM 1227 Views
We know nothing of the sort. - 15/10/2012 05:14:54 AM 1228 Views
Prove that Elaida's post was not Tower sanctioned - 15/10/2012 05:39:23 AM 1339 Views
Re: Prove that Elaida's post was not Tower sanctioned - 17/10/2012 04:15:37 AM 1348 Views
Egwene said otherwise DomA,... - 17/10/2012 05:33:01 AM 1298 Views
Re: Egwene said otherwise DomA,... - 17/10/2012 01:01:47 PM 1378 Views
Just to be clear - 17/10/2012 03:58:58 PM 1232 Views
Re: Egwene said otherwise DomA,... - 18/10/2012 01:23:48 AM 1303 Views
Elayne's thoughts about this - 17/10/2012 04:16:38 PM 1254 Views
And an answer to the rest of your "points" - 15/10/2012 02:48:07 AM 1498 Views
Again. I refer you to Linda's blog. The relevant quotes are there ... Enjoy - 15/10/2012 02:52:03 AM 1289 Views
Oh for the love of...! Here's the relevant quote: - 15/10/2012 04:04:48 AM 1388 Views
Okay, but that's still irrelevant to the Oath Rod & its cutoff period or method, as well as lifespan - 15/10/2012 04:54:26 AM 1221 Views
To quote you RTDB - 15/10/2012 05:16:56 AM 1214 Views
Re: To quote you RTDB - 15/10/2012 05:27:47 AM 1270 Views
Some people look young. - 15/10/2012 05:51:25 AM 1184 Views
I never mentioned the OR... - 16/10/2012 01:38:48 AM 1295 Views
RJ said Sharina would go back to about middle aged - 16/10/2012 02:23:21 AM 1115 Views
And that is probably the ONLY quote that wasn't on Linda's page *NM* - 15/10/2012 04:55:33 AM 747 Views
Told you so. *NM* - 15/10/2012 05:21:58 AM 854 Views
I think so. - 16/11/2012 11:40:17 AM 1441 Views
Aging - 15/10/2012 06:08:47 PM 1364 Views
How old was Lanfear? - 14/10/2012 08:41:35 PM 1322 Views
Re: How old was Lanfear? - 14/10/2012 11:27:12 PM 1366 Views
I couldn't find it - 15/10/2012 12:22:43 AM 1262 Views
Are the Seanchan prophesies false? - 14/10/2012 08:43:55 PM 1443 Views
I've only been saying no for years. - 14/10/2012 09:21:43 PM 1520 Views
Not the same thing - 14/10/2012 09:44:43 PM 1252 Views
Show me some damn PROOF already!! - 15/10/2012 03:19:18 AM 1433 Views
Re: I've only been saying no for years. - 14/10/2012 10:15:29 PM 1548 Views
Your argument is based on a faulty premise. - 15/10/2012 08:11:19 PM 1132 Views
Of course there is truth... - 14/10/2012 09:42:24 PM 1362 Views
Didn't know Bsand had confirmed the corruption. Thanks for sharing - 14/10/2012 10:02:40 PM 1306 Views
Re: Didn't know Bsand had confirmed the corruption. Thanks for sharing - 14/10/2012 10:23:17 PM 1357 Views
Hmmm ...I like it! It is actually very similar to what Nynaeve does - 14/10/2012 10:31:48 PM 1396 Views
How do the Black Ajah not figure out who the others are? - 14/10/2012 08:48:14 PM 1327 Views
Who says they can't? - 14/10/2012 09:23:11 PM 1323 Views
True to a point - 14/10/2012 10:00:01 PM 1243 Views
Was Sheriam ranking? Would many of them have met her? Not everyone even gets to meet the SC. - 15/10/2012 03:23:16 AM 1291 Views
Perhaps not. But a woman like Sheriam would stick out - 15/10/2012 03:37:12 AM 1209 Views
Re: Was Sheriam ranking? Would many of them have met her? Not everyone even gets to meet the SC. - 15/10/2012 03:52:39 AM 1323 Views
But isn't it interesting that Sheriam and Galina, both young and strong are on the SC? - 15/10/2012 04:06:38 AM 1186 Views
Galina isn't young. *NM* - 17/10/2012 03:24:30 AM 823 Views
Yes she is - 17/10/2012 03:46:39 PM 1330 Views
85 years being BA, 90 years as a sister does not qualify her as a "young AS" - 18/10/2012 05:35:33 PM 1304 Views
She is not dissimilar to Sheriam when she made her rise IMO - 18/10/2012 06:53:54 PM 1252 Views
Re: She is not dissimilar to Sheriam when she made her rise IMO - 18/10/2012 08:10:58 PM 1271 Views
I think Linda is correct in this particular instance - 19/10/2012 02:14:23 AM 1369 Views
You mean the SC? - 14/10/2012 10:47:31 PM 1327 Views
No others meet as well - 14/10/2012 11:01:21 PM 1320 Views
Re: No others meet as well - 14/10/2012 11:36:50 PM 1291 Views
Yet rank and file BA have methods of communicating - 15/10/2012 12:14:36 AM 1171 Views
Re: Yet rank and file BA have methods of communicating - 15/10/2012 03:26:59 AM 1287 Views
I concede that the rank and file likely don't meet in large groups - 15/10/2012 04:54:04 AM 1229 Views
Re: I concede that the rank and file likely don't meet in large groups - 15/10/2012 02:28:45 PM 1360 Views
I agree that RJ probably had some thing up his sleeve - 15/10/2012 03:01:20 PM 1148 Views
Re: I agree that RJ probably had some thing up his sleeve - 15/10/2012 05:57:04 PM 1456 Views
I have a different opinion of Delana - 16/10/2012 01:20:32 AM 1590 Views
Re: I have a different opinion of Delana - 16/10/2012 11:51:34 PM 1233 Views
Egwene only notes Alviarin as the Head. Verin may not have even mentioned or know who was SC - 18/10/2012 02:55:19 AM 1287 Views
Re: Egwene only notes Alviarin as the Head. Verin may not have even mentioned or know who was SC - 18/10/2012 03:40:54 PM 1174 Views
Give the sign to a woman and see how she reacts - 18/10/2012 06:57:38 PM 1310 Views
Re: Give the sign to a woman and see how she reacts - 18/10/2012 07:26:56 PM 1228 Views
Not a good plan, I'll give you that - 18/10/2012 07:37:45 PM 1355 Views
*sigh* - 18/10/2012 08:25:23 PM 1297 Views
*double sigh* - 19/10/2012 04:03:00 AM 1244 Views
Re: *double sigh* - 19/10/2012 05:48:25 PM 1259 Views
Agreed *NM* - 20/10/2012 04:57:18 PM 731 Views
Re: Egwene only notes Alviarin as the Head. Verin may not have even mentioned or know who was SC - 18/10/2012 04:59:25 PM 1333 Views
Not conclusive ... in fact the whole bit is vague ... I wonder if RJ would have given us more detail - 18/10/2012 07:23:30 PM 1340 Views
Not conclusive? - 18/10/2012 08:49:49 PM 1180 Views
Don't put words in my mouth that I never said - 19/10/2012 04:08:22 AM 1154 Views
double post *NM* - 19/10/2012 04:08:22 AM 740 Views
Is there a Dark Friend WO? - 14/10/2012 08:51:16 PM 1404 Views
Re: Is there a Dark Friend WO? - 17/10/2012 08:33:27 PM 1446 Views
I'd like to see more discussion on this; I'm curious as well - 18/10/2012 12:44:35 AM 1196 Views
Just a note about Bair - 18/10/2012 07:53:45 AM 1309 Views
I don't see how it could be possible - 23/10/2012 09:31:51 PM 1196 Views
Galad and Gaywn ... Channlers? - 14/10/2012 10:47:55 PM 1483 Views
Re: Galad and Gaywn ... Channlers? - 14/10/2012 11:36:25 PM 1436 Views

Reply to Message