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For the sake of argument ... Nate Send a noteboard - 13/12/2011 04:09:51 PM
... I would offer Neal Stephenson as an example of a fantasy/sci-fi writer who broadens your horizons. However, he's not writing worlds with, as you put it, dragons and elves and fairies. His fantastic elements tend to be a fair bit lighter than that, which I think might be something you talked about earlier. I haven't been reading every post. For the record I think that you are right that people could (and perhaps should) be broadening their horizons more, but I also think that many (not all) of the books you and Larry promote as mind-broadening are actually dull as dirt. That's probably just a matter of personal taste.

But back to Neal Stephenson. You'll typically find his books in the fantasy and sci-fi sections because of the light fantastic elements within them, but as he tells stories he teaches about topics such as history, economics, cryptography, mathematics, and dozens of smaller topics that catch his interest. His books are full of well-written asides packed with factual information. You can learn quite a bit from them if you want to.

For the sake of continuing argument, there are several fantasy authors/books that can teach you a little and give you a greater interest in particular topics. Neil Gaiman's books are full of real-world mythology, for example, and his Sandman books are also sprinkled with factual history lessons.

Fantasy and sci-fi writers can also be effective social commentators, which is another way they can broaden the mind. I suspect that science fiction has more of this, but I don't read a lot of it so I can't say for certain how good it is. Matthew Stover's Acts of Caine books are a blend of fantasy and science fiction that have at their core a social commentary on class systems and the culture of entertainment. China Mieville's fantasy novels also contain quite a bit of relevant social commentary.

However (again, didn't read all the other posts) I suspect you're talking more about standard, run-of-the-mill fantasy, where of course you're correct that there is not a lot of practical relevance to the real world. That doesn't mean that there can't be emotional relevance, because every fantasy world, no matter how run-of-the-mill, also contains things such as personal interaction, relationships, basic social structures, etc., that do indeed happen in our world as well, and can be of use to people. It's not mind-broadening in the typical sense, but it's not worthless either. Well, it's not worthless in most books. Some of them are just so bad that even this stuff is worthless.

But I would also argue that the split in the speculative fiction genre between worthwhile/intellectually stimulating books and fluff books also exists in most other genres. The books written decades or centuries ago that became classics did so because they were of the first category, but there were thousands of books written, published, purchased, and enjoyed by people that were fluff. It's not a problem that's endemic to fantasy. There's fluff everywhere. There's fluff down every aisle of every bookstore.

If there's a case to be made against fantasy/sci-fi, I think it's safer to say that it has a higher fluff to non-fluff ratio partially because it appeals to young peoplea as an entry into literature and partially because it's a younger genre in general. The longer it percolates in society, slowly more people with intellectual ideas will write stories in it, and the more non-fluff we will get. But there will always be fluff, just as there will always be a Dean Koontz and a Danielle Steele in the "real world" novels.
Warder to starry_nite

Chapterfish — Nate's Writing Blog
http://chapterfish.wordpress.com
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Aren't the Tolkien comparisons getting a little...old? - 09/12/2011 09:51:39 PM 3036 Views
The comparison bothers me, but not because Tolkien isn't relevant. - 09/12/2011 10:05:22 PM 1888 Views
I agree with this. - 09/12/2011 10:21:34 PM 1929 Views
Re: I agree with this. - 10/12/2011 07:09:33 PM 1859 Views
Exactly *NM* - 12/12/2011 12:09:19 PM 998 Views
Only when shit works are being compared to him - 09/12/2011 10:22:26 PM 1782 Views
Larry, - 10/12/2011 01:13:18 AM 1802 Views
Snide dismissal that will be passed off as for his own entertainment. - 10/12/2011 04:55:43 AM 1723 Views
We get a lot of that around here. *NM* - 10/12/2011 05:18:01 AM 762 Views
makes me wonder... - 10/12/2011 04:37:33 PM 1708 Views
Re: makes me wonder... - 11/12/2011 03:03:15 AM 1660 Views
Well-deserved condescension. - 11/12/2011 03:54:27 AM 1872 Views
You're sure about that? - 11/12/2011 04:20:26 AM 2064 Views
Re: You're sure about that? - 11/12/2011 05:25:08 AM 1785 Views
Re: You're sure about that? - 11/12/2011 06:03:02 AM 1660 Views
i think you shouldn't judge a whole world's school programs on your school - 11/12/2011 06:42:30 AM 1695 Views
Yeah, I'm limited in my knowledge, lol - 11/12/2011 08:03:26 AM 1719 Views
My school was...not great. - 11/12/2011 04:02:36 PM 1748 Views
I'm 24. - 11/12/2011 03:49:06 PM 1659 Views
If you're arguing that children should be able to read genre fiction, fine. - 11/12/2011 08:52:27 PM 1588 Views
Well, I suppose it depends on the type of genre being read - 11/12/2011 09:36:16 PM 1822 Views
How often do you hear the challenging writers mentioned at this site? - 12/12/2011 02:03:05 PM 1553 Views
Only when you, me, and a couple others write reviews - 12/12/2011 04:21:14 PM 1973 Views
Oh, it was the same as it always is - 12/12/2011 05:23:56 PM 1640 Views
True - 12/12/2011 06:29:10 PM 1760 Views
One note - 13/12/2011 12:17:48 AM 1767 Views
Perhaps - 13/12/2011 12:49:34 AM 1691 Views
*Sighs* Such is the plight of those shining few intelects... - 23/12/2011 01:15:47 AM 1734 Views
Much of the actual "Classics", that is, Greek and Latin originals, kids would eat up. - 12/12/2011 03:13:03 AM 1569 Views
Try teaching Apuleius in schools... *NM* - 12/12/2011 04:12:49 AM 878 Views
Plato is exciting, brutal and scandalous? - 12/12/2011 09:59:13 PM 1638 Views
You're upfront and honest about it; he isn't. The difference matters to me. *NM* - 11/12/2011 05:18:42 AM 926 Views
Uhh...uh... - 11/12/2011 05:34:23 AM 1672 Views
this is a bit off topic, but out of curiousity... - 11/12/2011 06:28:35 AM 1778 Views
There are no special snowflakes, are there? - 11/12/2011 09:39:21 PM 1587 Views
There are many way of widening one's horizons and broadening one's mind. - 11/12/2011 10:08:24 PM 1339 Views
I said as much in my comment - 11/12/2011 10:20:03 PM 1607 Views
What I don't like- - 12/12/2011 04:28:55 AM 1700 Views
Why don't you name something, then? - 12/12/2011 04:40:29 AM 1649 Views
Sure. - 13/12/2011 07:30:56 AM 1484 Views
Mentioning Ender's Game pretty much shot your argument in the foot. - 13/12/2011 02:02:59 PM 1588 Views
You dismiss the entire video game medium because many games lack value. - 13/12/2011 03:59:11 PM 1734 Views
You're like the McDonald's paid advocate trying to say Big Macs are actually healthy. - 13/12/2011 05:46:37 PM 1547 Views
McDonalds food is inherently unhealthy. - 13/12/2011 06:02:18 PM 1698 Views
For the sake of argument ... - 13/12/2011 04:09:51 PM 1598 Views
Stephenson is not literature, that's for damn sure. - 13/12/2011 05:49:24 PM 1540 Views
Thank you, The Voice of Lews Therin. *NM* - 16/12/2011 05:14:42 AM 942 Views
I'll leave it up to others to define as they wish against their self-conceptions of me - 10/12/2011 10:52:54 AM 1701 Views
that's alright. I really have no desire to stroke your twit-ego. *NM* - 10/12/2011 04:36:56 PM 728 Views
Considering the firestorm I appear to have touched off, that may be best. - 12/12/2011 12:57:49 PM 1678 Views
I know, John - 12/12/2011 04:27:04 PM 1578 Views
Re: I know, John - 12/12/2011 05:06:26 PM 1651 Views
As I've said in the past, I'd be scared if anyone agreed with me anywhere approaching 100% - 12/12/2011 06:33:52 PM 1562 Views
Re: As I've said in the past, I'd be scared if anyone agreed with me anywhere approaching 100% - 12/12/2011 07:13:37 PM 1639 Views
Same guy - 12/12/2011 07:26:13 PM 1706 Views
Ha! Excellent point. *NM* - 11/12/2011 03:44:52 AM 870 Views
I have to agree. - 09/12/2011 10:54:06 PM 1692 Views
They're there for marketing - 10/12/2011 12:20:17 AM 1685 Views
Most of those comparisons are like that anyway - 10/12/2011 05:32:45 PM 1817 Views
Maybe if so much of the genre weren't crap derivative works it wouldn't be so common. *NM* - 11/12/2011 03:44:24 AM 858 Views
To be fair, a lot of it isn't. - 11/12/2011 04:06:07 AM 1617 Views
I suspect that if it really isn't derivative it's not being compared to Tolkien in the first place. - 11/12/2011 04:18:57 AM 1567 Views
That's true. - 11/12/2011 11:08:01 AM 1548 Views
Maybe they mean something else by using his name. - 11/12/2011 03:50:15 AM 1650 Views
When they don't work, yes. - 11/12/2011 03:18:44 PM 1643 Views
The Tolkien fanaticism gets old. And yes, for me it is unreadable. - 11/12/2011 11:37:53 PM 1624 Views
Yes *NM* - 22/12/2011 07:08:38 PM 992 Views

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