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Re: Voting on civil rights constitutes tyranny of the majority, not legitimate democracy. Isaac Send a noteboard - 26/06/2011 03:11:06 AM
Personally I'd rather states put it to a direct vote on the ballot, keeps it clean from any legislative antics and makes it harder for the legislature to repeal it or pass it themselves if it fails since the electorate makes their will known, but so long as it's not the courts doing it and so long as it left churches and such the freedom not perform the ceremonies I've got no issue with it.

And if you're not convinced by the philosophical aspects, you should be by the successful fear- and misinformation-based campaigns run against gay marriage nationwide wherever it's been up for popular vote.


I find it a tad ironic that you're engaging in fear-mongering about fear-mongering, though there's a touch of truth to what you say. Nevertheless, on an issue like this, the ultimate 'goal' has to be to convince people that there's nothing wrong with gay marriage, so a ballot on the matter is, IMO, the only way to really legitimize it. Right now I know a lot of people who were fence-sitters or lukewarms supporters of gay marriage who strongly resent the acts of the judiciary on this matter, and resent being told that they are ignorant or bigoted, the legislature passing something will not offend to that degree, the law would be viewed as legitimate, but a general ballot is the clearest and cleanest way to show the will of the people and gay marriage is neither complex technically, lengthy in concept, or a matter of grave urgency, so it's one of the relatively few matters the public could vote on, in my opinion the course of wisdom is to go that route, by and large citizens accept 51% of other citizens as more valid and swaying then a judge or even 51% of elected reps, if the ultimate goal is to get people to accept gay marriage as valid, 51% of their fellowing citizens saying 'yes it is' is far more convincing then any action of the government.
The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift.
- Albert Einstein

King of Cairhien 20-7-2
Chancellor of the Landsraad, Archduke of Is'Mod
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New York Senate approves same-sex marriage - 25/06/2011 03:47:43 AM 1315 Views
Good. *NM* - 25/06/2011 07:40:52 AM 427 Views
Re: Federalism is so fucking slow. *NM* - 25/06/2011 02:47:11 PM 262 Views
I'm actually not opposed to this. - 25/06/2011 03:48:32 PM 632 Views
Makes sense to me. - 25/06/2011 04:00:07 PM 854 Views
I'm not sure why there was even any need for such explicit protection. - 25/06/2011 04:04:47 PM 628 Views
There are two reasons, depending on ones position on the issue. - 25/06/2011 06:04:27 PM 679 Views
Meh, you never know. - 26/06/2011 12:58:37 AM 769 Views
so in your only Catholics are really married? - 26/06/2011 12:04:07 AM 633 Views
Church Doctrine. - 26/06/2011 12:57:39 AM 760 Views
That is simply not true - 26/06/2011 08:20:59 AM 698 Views
Yes it is. - 26/06/2011 05:14:29 PM 705 Views
That's patently wrong in that Orthodox weddings are explicitly recognized by the Church. - 26/06/2011 02:42:00 PM 650 Views
Yeah okay... - 26/06/2011 05:16:05 PM 689 Views
Are you sure about this? - 30/06/2011 04:47:57 PM 553 Views
Dragonsoul is wrong - 01/07/2011 09:21:43 AM 703 Views
Glad to hear it. *NM* - 25/06/2011 04:05:15 PM 247 Views
Seems fine to me - 25/06/2011 05:44:30 PM 625 Views
Voting on civil rights constitutes tyranny of the majority, not legitimate democracy. - 25/06/2011 09:37:28 PM 758 Views
Direct democracy is the only true democracy. *NM* - 26/06/2011 01:01:26 AM 266 Views
Sometimes it is grand not being a True Scottsman *NM* - 26/06/2011 08:21:49 AM 257 Views
Re: Voting on civil rights constitutes tyranny of the majority, not legitimate democracy. - 26/06/2011 03:11:06 AM 702 Views
Good luck telling that to the deeply religious right. - 26/06/2011 03:20:04 AM 621 Views
I am a deeply religious member of the right, and I tell them that all the time *NM* - 26/06/2011 03:30:14 AM 269 Views
Then you're a rare person. *NM* - 26/06/2011 03:36:11 AM 267 Views
After a number of years of gay marriage - 26/06/2011 06:57:07 AM 595 Views
That's more or less true of virtually everything, not a great example - 26/06/2011 07:09:03 AM 623 Views
People shouldn't turn their own religion and/or opinion into law - 28/06/2011 07:33:48 PM 617 Views
I don't recall mentioning religion beyond confirming that I was religious - 28/06/2011 08:22:51 PM 666 Views
I admit I wasn't replying to you directly - 29/06/2011 07:20:10 AM 622 Views
I think you should give this subject a bit more thought - 29/06/2011 02:16:04 PM 669 Views
I'll address the bulk of this later - 29/06/2011 07:58:48 PM 547 Views
Believing things without strong supporting evidence is not rational. - 30/06/2011 12:11:33 AM 730 Views
Requiring different degrees of proof for things isn't particularly rational - 30/06/2011 01:14:44 PM 809 Views
I require the same standard of evidence to be confident in anything. - 30/06/2011 07:43:51 PM 1198 Views
Re: I require the same standard of evidence to be confident in anything. - 30/06/2011 08:59:00 PM 809 Views
Re: I require the same standard of evidence to be confident in anything. - 30/06/2011 09:47:30 PM 1074 Views
We're gonna have to pick this up another time - 01/07/2011 04:37:25 AM 640 Views
No, I used the word irrational to mean that it's not rational. - 30/06/2011 09:12:19 PM 656 Views
Fair Enough - 01/07/2011 04:32:44 AM 695 Views
Btw, in case you were wondering, I do like you - 01/07/2011 02:17:42 PM 700 Views
Empire State Building was lit up in rainbow colors, looked cool *NM* - 25/06/2011 08:21:03 PM 281 Views
Good. *NM* - 25/06/2011 11:41:30 PM 251 Views
So, fifth time is a charm? - 26/06/2011 06:38:26 AM 741 Views

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