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Believing things without strong supporting evidence is not rational. Dreaded Anomaly Send a noteboard - 30/06/2011 12:11:33 AM
Euclid's Axioms on Geometry are also 2000+ years old, so are Aesop's Fables, the only reason a book or work's age is relevant is that if something has managed to keep getting cited after centuries, it probably indicates it has some value and merit, and I'd appreciate if you'd not imply I'm irrational, that you can't understand 'how any rational person could believe in such things' strikes me as a problem you should be seeking to address, because a pretty good chunk of the people most would regard as champions of reason believe or believed in such things, and I'm not sure how the breakdown goes amongst scientists but I don't know many in my own field of physics who consider religion at paradox with science and reason, regardless of their own beliefs or lack thereof, and maybe it's field arrogance but while we claim no monopoly on the faculty of reason we're generally considered to have more than our fair share of it. Even when I was an atheist, and later an agnostic, I never considered those who weren't to be prone to being irrational or possessed of impaired reasoning abilities, if you think that's the case, I'd respectfully submit you should re-evaluate either your definition of 'rational' or your definition of 'religion', and barring that at the very least I'd appreciate if you'd have the courteousy not to lob insults at religion when I did not invoke it as part of my comments, but again only mentioned it when someone also threw a slur at it.


Religion and science are not "separate magisteria" or anything of the sort. The failure of many scientists to realize this is generally because of compartmentalization, i.e. the idea that the scientific method and other related principles only apply in certain domains. In fact, they apply to all truth claims. (See http://lesswrong.com/lw/i8/religions_claim_to_be_nondisprovable/ and http://lesswrong.com/lw/gv/outside_the_laboratory/ for more thorough explanations of this, for starters.)

Let's be quantitative about how scientists differ in belief from the general population. We are many, many times more likely to be atheists, non-religious, or express doubts about religion than the general population. In the US, one estimate is that 30% of scientist are atheists, vs. maybe 2% of the general population who are atheists. 50% of scientists are without religious affiliation, vs. 16% of the general population. Only 36% of scientists state an explicit belief in God. See http://www.opposingviews.com/i/growing-number-of-scientists-are-atheists for more statistics (and note that the data was gathered by someone attempting to argue the opposite point, that scientists generally are religious.)

The idea that religion deserves "courtesy" is nonsense. No belief deserves protection from criticism. Also, "irrational" is a word with a specific meaning, not just a general insult.

As a side note, the entire paragraph I quoted contains only 2 periods. That is a serious barrier to readability.
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New York Senate approves same-sex marriage - 25/06/2011 03:47:43 AM 1095 Views
Good. *NM* - 25/06/2011 07:40:52 AM 357 Views
Re: Federalism is so fucking slow. *NM* - 25/06/2011 02:47:11 PM 188 Views
I'm actually not opposed to this. - 25/06/2011 03:48:32 PM 490 Views
Makes sense to me. - 25/06/2011 04:00:07 PM 655 Views
I'm not sure why there was even any need for such explicit protection. - 25/06/2011 04:04:47 PM 462 Views
There are two reasons, depending on ones position on the issue. - 25/06/2011 06:04:27 PM 513 Views
Meh, you never know. - 26/06/2011 12:58:37 AM 606 Views
so in your only Catholics are really married? - 26/06/2011 12:04:07 AM 461 Views
Church Doctrine. - 26/06/2011 12:57:39 AM 591 Views
That is simply not true - 26/06/2011 08:20:59 AM 512 Views
Yes it is. - 26/06/2011 05:14:29 PM 547 Views
That's patently wrong in that Orthodox weddings are explicitly recognized by the Church. - 26/06/2011 02:42:00 PM 479 Views
Yeah okay... - 26/06/2011 05:16:05 PM 518 Views
Are you sure about this? - 30/06/2011 04:47:57 PM 371 Views
Dragonsoul is wrong - 01/07/2011 09:21:43 AM 516 Views
Glad to hear it. *NM* - 25/06/2011 04:05:15 PM 189 Views
Seems fine to me - 25/06/2011 05:44:30 PM 450 Views
Voting on civil rights constitutes tyranny of the majority, not legitimate democracy. - 25/06/2011 09:37:28 PM 586 Views
Direct democracy is the only true democracy. *NM* - 26/06/2011 01:01:26 AM 200 Views
Sometimes it is grand not being a True Scottsman *NM* - 26/06/2011 08:21:49 AM 187 Views
Re: Voting on civil rights constitutes tyranny of the majority, not legitimate democracy. - 26/06/2011 03:11:06 AM 536 Views
Good luck telling that to the deeply religious right. - 26/06/2011 03:20:04 AM 435 Views
I am a deeply religious member of the right, and I tell them that all the time *NM* - 26/06/2011 03:30:14 AM 198 Views
Then you're a rare person. *NM* - 26/06/2011 03:36:11 AM 200 Views
After a number of years of gay marriage - 26/06/2011 06:57:07 AM 433 Views
That's more or less true of virtually everything, not a great example - 26/06/2011 07:09:03 AM 461 Views
People shouldn't turn their own religion and/or opinion into law - 28/06/2011 07:33:48 PM 456 Views
I don't recall mentioning religion beyond confirming that I was religious - 28/06/2011 08:22:51 PM 484 Views
I admit I wasn't replying to you directly - 29/06/2011 07:20:10 AM 447 Views
I think you should give this subject a bit more thought - 29/06/2011 02:16:04 PM 483 Views
I'll address the bulk of this later - 29/06/2011 07:58:48 PM 366 Views
Believing things without strong supporting evidence is not rational. - 30/06/2011 12:11:33 AM 549 Views
Requiring different degrees of proof for things isn't particularly rational - 30/06/2011 01:14:44 PM 620 Views
I require the same standard of evidence to be confident in anything. - 30/06/2011 07:43:51 PM 996 Views
Re: I require the same standard of evidence to be confident in anything. - 30/06/2011 08:59:00 PM 633 Views
Re: I require the same standard of evidence to be confident in anything. - 30/06/2011 09:47:30 PM 895 Views
We're gonna have to pick this up another time - 01/07/2011 04:37:25 AM 463 Views
No, I used the word irrational to mean that it's not rational. - 30/06/2011 09:12:19 PM 471 Views
Fair Enough - 01/07/2011 04:32:44 AM 527 Views
Btw, in case you were wondering, I do like you - 01/07/2011 02:17:42 PM 522 Views
Empire State Building was lit up in rainbow colors, looked cool *NM* - 25/06/2011 08:21:03 PM 210 Views
Good. *NM* - 25/06/2011 11:41:30 PM 179 Views
So, fifth time is a charm? - 26/06/2011 06:38:26 AM 569 Views

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