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Did you actually read my post? ßelals Girl Send a noteboard - 06/07/2011 07:36:13 PM
I agree with you and Joel that such laws are wrong and I don't think they should exist. I was merely pointing out to Joel that his decision to not wear a seatbelt can cause harm to more people than just himself. Even if such injuries are uncommon, they still happen and that is something he should take into account when he decides if he's going to wear a seatbelt.

My post was about personal responsibility, not legal responsibility.
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You can't make this stuff up: Helmet law protester dies in crash Dark Knight - 05/07/2011 08:47:14 PM 1046 Views
Kinda undermines his protest *NM* snoopcester - 05/07/2011 09:01:50 PM 307 Views
Just a tad bit *NM* Dark Knight - 05/07/2011 09:06:24 PM 293 Views
How so? He wasn't demanding the right to survive crashes when only a helmet makes that possible. Joel - 05/07/2011 11:06:44 PM 678 Views
New York feels that people should have to wear helmets for their own safety snoopcester - 05/07/2011 11:20:36 PM 646 Views
He felt his own safety was his own concern. Joel - 06/07/2011 12:07:05 AM 579 Views
Who do you think would have ended up paying for his care for the rest of his life if the accident Tashmere - 06/07/2011 01:08:49 AM 737 Views
The same people who pay for everyone else whose actions render them vegetables. Joel - 06/07/2011 01:50:20 AM 855 Views
Maybe a more effective argument you could use against me would be pointing out Tashmere - 06/07/2011 02:33:21 AM 648 Views
Yeah, that is a better example. Joel - 06/07/2011 03:03:01 AM 617 Views
Oops, ignore! *NM* eucatastrophe - 06/07/2011 11:44:10 PM 375 Views
Now, who said irony wasn't funny? *NM* Great Lord of Chaos - 05/07/2011 09:22:58 PM 429 Views
what a fricking idiot Yunalesca - 05/07/2011 10:02:17 PM 813 Views
That's your opinion to which you're entitled. Joel - 05/07/2011 11:19:36 PM 1069 Views
Anarchy, baby! *NM* Dark Knight - 06/07/2011 12:58:23 AM 530 Views
Sorry, as an advocate of civil rights (which especially includes minorities) I oppose anarchy. Joel - 06/07/2011 01:18:19 AM 735 Views
The public's nose is on the line here too. Tashmere - 06/07/2011 01:47:08 AM 795 Views
So my increased ease of hearing/seeing vehicles and other hazards isn't worth $1200. Joel - 06/07/2011 02:25:53 AM 807 Views
I understand the pov, I had a BF who felt that same way. It's still much like childish defiance. Avendesora - 06/07/2011 01:26:15 AM 972 Views
In part it's a matter of principle, but if we really want to analyze it there's some deeper validity Joel - 06/07/2011 02:13:05 AM 764 Views
you keep spreading falsehoods, stop it please moondog - 06/07/2011 02:49:01 AM 921 Views
Sounds like your real argument is with the other bikers; I'm just reiterating their arguments. Joel - 06/07/2011 03:38:39 AM 858 Views
It's not "much like" childish defiance. It IS. *NM* eucatastrophe - 06/07/2011 11:45:05 PM 483 Views
Uh Joel... ßelals Girl - 06/07/2011 03:38:24 AM 682 Views
Agreed, having others in the car does make a difference. Joel - 06/07/2011 03:47:53 AM 758 Views
Hence why your "I wouldn't wear a seatbelt in the back seat" comment didn't make a lot of sense ßelals Girl - 06/07/2011 07:38:50 PM 733 Views
Depends on whether the driver, rather than the law, is the one insisting. Joel - 06/07/2011 08:06:24 PM 592 Views
You'd place your own comfort over other people's safety? ßelals Girl - 06/07/2011 11:37:00 PM 621 Views
It's more a comfort issue than anything else; it's not solely one. Joel - 06/07/2011 11:56:28 PM 1105 Views
Sorry, but that doesn't make sense ironclad - 06/07/2011 07:02:33 PM 877 Views
Yes it does ßelals Girl - 06/07/2011 07:32:54 PM 631 Views
how many people are really seriously injured that way? random thoughts - 06/07/2011 07:15:16 PM 851 Views
Did you actually read my post? ßelals Girl - 06/07/2011 07:36:13 PM 761 Views
my ex had 3 cracked ribs from an accident like that moondog - 07/07/2011 02:46:07 AM 785 Views
Re: That's your opinion to which you're entitled. Yunalesca - 06/07/2011 05:18:12 PM 838 Views
Re: That's your opinion to which you're entitled. Joel - 06/07/2011 06:13:44 PM 910 Views
Hold the phone here... Jeordam - 06/07/2011 07:49:10 PM 1071 Views
+1 *NM* Yunalesca - 06/07/2011 08:42:14 PM 370 Views
You agree with him that the abortion debate is about a mothers convenience versus the babys life? Joel - 06/07/2011 10:48:52 PM 756 Views
im not bringing abortion into this, its a separate issue *NM* Yunalesca - 06/07/2011 10:56:17 PM 364 Views
It's really not. Joel - 07/07/2011 12:20:10 AM 780 Views
i'm really not Yunalesca - 07/07/2011 03:34:23 PM 874 Views
Fine as far as it goes, but public/private only matters to the extent others are affected. Joel - 09/07/2011 11:15:33 AM 828 Views
What else could the debate be about? Jeordam - 06/07/2011 10:58:51 PM 706 Views
"The babys life", not just "life". Joel - 07/07/2011 12:18:02 AM 1037 Views
Holding the phone here might be good, yes.... Joel - 06/07/2011 10:33:46 PM 844 Views
See...that's the difference between you and me Jeordam - 06/07/2011 10:56:53 PM 932 Views
Apparently so; "completely anarchy as long as its regulated to one's body" sounds nonsensical to me. Joel - 06/07/2011 11:44:50 PM 917 Views
I think I could make that up. *NM* TaskmasterJack - 05/07/2011 11:41:00 PM 310 Views
Smartass *NM* Dark Knight - 06/07/2011 12:57:22 AM 315 Views
I'm with Joel. I always buckle up/helmet up, but I think such laws are asinine beetnemesis - 06/07/2011 02:30:04 AM 601 Views
why not just ban motorcycles all together, they are much more dangerous than cars random thoughts - 06/07/2011 05:39:51 PM 623 Views
Helmets help save lives. 'Onest. Two Wongs - 07/07/2011 04:40:42 PM 783 Views
So do not smoking, eating right and regular exercise, but we haven't made them mandatory. Joel - 09/07/2011 11:04:58 AM 781 Views
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