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Did you actually read my post? ßelals Girl Send a noteboard - 06/07/2011 07:36:13 PM
I agree with you and Joel that such laws are wrong and I don't think they should exist. I was merely pointing out to Joel that his decision to not wear a seatbelt can cause harm to more people than just himself. Even if such injuries are uncommon, they still happen and that is something he should take into account when he decides if he's going to wear a seatbelt.

My post was about personal responsibility, not legal responsibility.
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You can't make this stuff up: Helmet law protester dies in crash Dark Knight - 05/07/2011 08:47:14 PM 972 Views
Kinda undermines his protest *NM* snoopcester - 05/07/2011 09:01:50 PM 286 Views
Just a tad bit *NM* Dark Knight - 05/07/2011 09:06:24 PM 269 Views
How so? He wasn't demanding the right to survive crashes when only a helmet makes that possible. Joel - 05/07/2011 11:06:44 PM 628 Views
New York feels that people should have to wear helmets for their own safety snoopcester - 05/07/2011 11:20:36 PM 598 Views
He felt his own safety was his own concern. Joel - 06/07/2011 12:07:05 AM 528 Views
Who do you think would have ended up paying for his care for the rest of his life if the accident Tashmere - 06/07/2011 01:08:49 AM 684 Views
The same people who pay for everyone else whose actions render them vegetables. Joel - 06/07/2011 01:50:20 AM 802 Views
Maybe a more effective argument you could use against me would be pointing out Tashmere - 06/07/2011 02:33:21 AM 594 Views
Yeah, that is a better example. Joel - 06/07/2011 03:03:01 AM 563 Views
Oops, ignore! *NM* eucatastrophe - 06/07/2011 11:44:10 PM 348 Views
Now, who said irony wasn't funny? *NM* Great Lord of Chaos - 05/07/2011 09:22:58 PM 407 Views
what a fricking idiot Yunalesca - 05/07/2011 10:02:17 PM 761 Views
That's your opinion to which you're entitled. Joel - 05/07/2011 11:19:36 PM 1016 Views
Anarchy, baby! *NM* Dark Knight - 06/07/2011 12:58:23 AM 505 Views
Sorry, as an advocate of civil rights (which especially includes minorities) I oppose anarchy. Joel - 06/07/2011 01:18:19 AM 680 Views
The public's nose is on the line here too. Tashmere - 06/07/2011 01:47:08 AM 721 Views
So my increased ease of hearing/seeing vehicles and other hazards isn't worth $1200. Joel - 06/07/2011 02:25:53 AM 738 Views
I understand the pov, I had a BF who felt that same way. It's still much like childish defiance. Avendesora - 06/07/2011 01:26:15 AM 905 Views
In part it's a matter of principle, but if we really want to analyze it there's some deeper validity Joel - 06/07/2011 02:13:05 AM 697 Views
you keep spreading falsehoods, stop it please moondog - 06/07/2011 02:49:01 AM 869 Views
Sounds like your real argument is with the other bikers; I'm just reiterating their arguments. Joel - 06/07/2011 03:38:39 AM 790 Views
It's not "much like" childish defiance. It IS. *NM* eucatastrophe - 06/07/2011 11:45:05 PM 457 Views
Uh Joel... ßelals Girl - 06/07/2011 03:38:24 AM 623 Views
Agreed, having others in the car does make a difference. Joel - 06/07/2011 03:47:53 AM 700 Views
Hence why your "I wouldn't wear a seatbelt in the back seat" comment didn't make a lot of sense ßelals Girl - 06/07/2011 07:38:50 PM 665 Views
Depends on whether the driver, rather than the law, is the one insisting. Joel - 06/07/2011 08:06:24 PM 536 Views
You'd place your own comfort over other people's safety? ßelals Girl - 06/07/2011 11:37:00 PM 574 Views
It's more a comfort issue than anything else; it's not solely one. Joel - 06/07/2011 11:56:28 PM 1048 Views
Sorry, but that doesn't make sense ironclad - 06/07/2011 07:02:33 PM 824 Views
Yes it does ßelals Girl - 06/07/2011 07:32:54 PM 572 Views
how many people are really seriously injured that way? random thoughts - 06/07/2011 07:15:16 PM 790 Views
Did you actually read my post? ßelals Girl - 06/07/2011 07:36:13 PM 695 Views
my ex had 3 cracked ribs from an accident like that moondog - 07/07/2011 02:46:07 AM 731 Views
Re: That's your opinion to which you're entitled. Yunalesca - 06/07/2011 05:18:12 PM 782 Views
Re: That's your opinion to which you're entitled. Joel - 06/07/2011 06:13:44 PM 855 Views
Hold the phone here... Jeordam - 06/07/2011 07:49:10 PM 973 Views
+1 *NM* Yunalesca - 06/07/2011 08:42:14 PM 349 Views
You agree with him that the abortion debate is about a mothers convenience versus the babys life? Joel - 06/07/2011 10:48:52 PM 700 Views
im not bringing abortion into this, its a separate issue *NM* Yunalesca - 06/07/2011 10:56:17 PM 341 Views
It's really not. Joel - 07/07/2011 12:20:10 AM 723 Views
i'm really not Yunalesca - 07/07/2011 03:34:23 PM 803 Views
Fine as far as it goes, but public/private only matters to the extent others are affected. Joel - 09/07/2011 11:15:33 AM 766 Views
What else could the debate be about? Jeordam - 06/07/2011 10:58:51 PM 656 Views
"The babys life", not just "life". Joel - 07/07/2011 12:18:02 AM 985 Views
Holding the phone here might be good, yes.... Joel - 06/07/2011 10:33:46 PM 793 Views
See...that's the difference between you and me Jeordam - 06/07/2011 10:56:53 PM 879 Views
Apparently so; "completely anarchy as long as its regulated to one's body" sounds nonsensical to me. Joel - 06/07/2011 11:44:50 PM 860 Views
I think I could make that up. *NM* TaskmasterJack - 05/07/2011 11:41:00 PM 278 Views
Smartass *NM* Dark Knight - 06/07/2011 12:57:22 AM 293 Views
I'm with Joel. I always buckle up/helmet up, but I think such laws are asinine beetnemesis - 06/07/2011 02:30:04 AM 547 Views
why not just ban motorcycles all together, they are much more dangerous than cars random thoughts - 06/07/2011 05:39:51 PM 556 Views
Helmets help save lives. 'Onest. Two Wongs - 07/07/2011 04:40:42 PM 725 Views
So do not smoking, eating right and regular exercise, but we haven't made them mandatory. Joel - 09/07/2011 11:04:58 AM 724 Views
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