Re: I actually find that conversation quite interesting.
Jeordam Send a noteboard - 29/02/2012 09:07:06 PM
And there are quite a few things for us to disagree on in that too. 
I'm sure, but life would be far less interesting if everyone agreed all the time.
I do agree that God doesn't "send people to hell." I don't really believe in hell as it was described during the dark ages. I don't believe that if a poor little man in India never heard of Christ/God, he is automatically doomed to burn in hell... unless a Mormon thinks of him and gets baptized in his honor, anyway.
I'm gonna set aside the Mormon comment, since I'm not one. Instead, I'll talk about the other part. Looking at the "poor little manin India who never heard of Christ/God"...this is where another fascet of God comes into play. In Christian theology, God is more then just love. He is also just. Since God does know your innermost thoughts/motiviations, He is in a unique place to be a just Judge. If that little old man honestly never heard of Jesus, God is just. He will make the right call.
Either way, it is kind of a neither here nor there argument. When people get caught up on this point of theology, I'm more apt to point out that let that "little old man" and God deal with that situation. I'll be concerned for my situation and where I stand with God.
I think we got a pretty raw deal if one woman once ate one apple and forever after we had to be careful to understand exactly what to believe, or our afterlives would be nothing but anguish. We do not believe in precisely the same God, imo.
It was more then the woman (Eve) who ate the fruit. Let's remember that man (Adam) also sinned. Where as Eve was deceived, Adam did what he did knowingly defying God. (Interesting study by the way) To swing us back around to the initial comment between us, notice the story of Adam & Eve and their situation and free will.
They were living in the Garden of Eden. It was *literally* perfect. They walked in the garden with God. Spoke with Him. Had a personally relationship with Him. And they chose to disobey Him. Notice that God didn't set their free will aside. He could have said "No, that's going to lead to a path of destruction for you and everyone after you. I'm not going to give you the choice. You will love me. I won't give you the option not to." But He didn't do that, did he.
That whole free will thing is a big deal
I suppose I'll find out, if I end up in hell. But I do believe that the choices I make for myself are mine to make, and to mess up (or not) as I will. And if I'm wrong, God and I can talk about that when I get there.
Pretty much.
Thank you?
I'm honestly (and without a snarky whatever) saying good post and thank you. We're having a good discussion. And (as far as I can tell), there aren't wierd/hard/hurtful feelings involved. We're just talking. About our beliefs, viewpoints, and whatever. Not with the point of conversion, but with the point of potential understanding.
As far as things go, that's a good thing.
~J
ex-Admin at wotmania (all things wot & art galleries)
Saving the Princess, Humanity, or the World-Entire since 1985
Saving the Princess, Humanity, or the World-Entire since 1985
Do you know the best way to anger an atheist?
- 28/02/2012 07:10:57 PM
2207 Views
Or, you could baptize one of them, posthumously.
- 28/02/2012 07:32:48 PM
1531 Views
I can't think of any reason for an atheist to be annoyed by that.
- 28/02/2012 11:08:44 PM
1243 Views
Well, for starters, it's really effing rude.
- 28/02/2012 11:31:36 PM
1328 Views
It is an act of love.
- 29/02/2012 12:34:03 AM
1314 Views
Everyone does it for that reason? (edits for clarity)
- 29/02/2012 10:27:02 AM
1205 Views
I have some disturbing news for you...
- 29/02/2012 06:42:41 PM
1247 Views
For anyone reading this: the guy above is wrong, and I am admitting that to you on his behalf, so
- 29/02/2012 07:15:38 PM
1283 Views
Maybe without realizing it, you have articulated....
- 29/02/2012 07:24:13 PM
1093 Views
I actually find that conversation quite interesting.
- 29/02/2012 08:18:35 PM
1222 Views
Re: I actually find that conversation quite interesting.
- 29/02/2012 09:07:06 PM
1281 Views
I cannot possibly agree more with these two paragraphs of yours...
- 29/02/2012 09:28:09 PM
1282 Views
I find the Fall perhaps the most interesting part.
- 02/03/2012 09:05:29 AM
1678 Views
Re: I find the Fall perhaps the most interesting part.
- 02/03/2012 06:26:06 PM
1456 Views
There are 3 critical distinctions: 1) Ability to sin, 2) Awareness of sin and 3) Appreciation of sin
- 05/03/2012 04:08:36 AM
1202 Views
It is not an act of love to defy the beliefs of a loved one.
- 29/02/2012 02:32:45 PM
1358 Views
Rape? That is ridiculous.
- 29/02/2012 05:26:13 PM
1271 Views
It's a bit of hyperbole, but not too far from it, imo
- 29/02/2012 05:45:39 PM
1279 Views
"Spiritual rape" might be going a bit far, but otherwise that sounds about right.
- 02/03/2012 08:06:48 AM
1350 Views
Isn't religion different than faith, though?
- 28/02/2012 07:44:07 PM
1307 Views
Yeah that's pretty much what I said
- 28/02/2012 08:21:56 PM
1111 Views
- 28/02/2012 08:21:56 PM
1111 Views
that won't work on Buddists
- 28/02/2012 09:21:48 PM
1265 Views
For some reason I always imagine Buddhists as the monk class on RPG games... *NM*
- 28/02/2012 10:13:27 PM
623 Views
That's always been my view of the issue. Half-assed non-religious types are just as obnoxious too.
- 28/02/2012 10:34:12 PM
1482 Views
Seems a got both a pat on the back and a scathing rebuke. I call that a good day
- 28/02/2012 11:57:45 PM
1565 Views
Best way to anger an atheist, by declaring all atheists are the same. *NM*
- 28/02/2012 10:38:51 PM
753 Views
Common error number 1: "Atheism isn't a lack of belief, but rather a belief that God doesn't exist."
- 28/02/2012 11:18:23 PM
1439 Views
Curiously, anger at statements of simple obvious facts is a hallmark of religious fundamentalism. 
- 29/02/2012 10:27:29 AM
1355 Views
- 29/02/2012 10:27:29 AM
1355 Views
What you're doing there is defining "atheist" and "agnostic" in a way that suits you, but...
- 29/02/2012 11:50:27 AM
1130 Views
What I am doing is using the terms as they were universally used until about the time I was born.
- 05/03/2012 01:11:21 AM
1286 Views
So what do you call this position?:
- 05/03/2012 08:43:20 AM
1231 Views
I call them both agnostic, but the former leans toward atheism while the latter has no lean.
- 05/03/2012 10:53:02 AM
1327 Views
See, there you go again, defining atheism in such a way as to make it sound ridiculous.
- 05/03/2012 11:21:17 AM
1107 Views
Well, is unswerving belief a good thing, or not?
- 05/03/2012 11:57:05 AM
1330 Views
What's happening
- 05/03/2012 02:24:41 PM
1346 Views
Conversationally, DKs use of "atheism" at the start of this convo is the only practical definition.
- 07/03/2012 03:10:18 AM
1659 Views
Oh really? The guy who was doing it to annoy people?
- 07/03/2012 09:53:38 PM
1250 Views
The guy who was doing it to annoy atheists based on the terms technical and popular meaning, yes.
- 11/03/2012 04:04:36 AM
1129 Views
Whatever.
- 12/03/2012 12:39:24 AM
1622 Views
*NM*
I understand that as "I completely agree."
- 13/03/2012 12:11:18 AM
1412 Views
- 13/03/2012 12:11:18 AM
1412 Views
I have known very few people who "believe" their religion from rearing and actually understand it.
- 29/02/2012 12:08:01 PM
1484 Views
I thought that was "best way to make an atheist roll his/her eyes at you"? *NM*
- 29/02/2012 11:05:21 PM
790 Views