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Actually, I believe the "no pesticides" part predates the "no GMOs" part. Joel Send a noteboard - 13/09/2012 05:26:53 AM
As an aside at the start, you know English well enough to know "organic" may mean "naturally occuring/developing" as well as just "carbon based."

The worst thing is that nobody knows what it means. As Isaac points out, all food is made of organic compounds, as it's all carbon-based. So obviously that's not what's meant. Originally it seemed to mean not genetically modified – this was back when loads of people were banging on about how we shouldn't "play God" with our food. Then it somehow turned into no chemical pesticides. And what if stuff is artificially bulked up by injecting it with water? I assume there must be rules about this kind of thing, but I don't believe there's any public awareness of them. I can't even find a definition on the website of DEFRA, which certifies organic food in the UK.

I honestly think a lot of people who buy organic do so because they think it's more moral in some undefined way, or even just that if it's more expensive it must be better. For all I know there may well be benefits to organic food*, but if so, nobody's told me what they are in a way that makes sense.

*By which I mean food that is labelled as organic in supermarkets, as opposed to any individual's opinion about what constitutes "real" organic food.

I admit I am not 100% sure when GMOs became the norm, but organic food goes back at least as far as the sixties, and seems to have been prompted by Rachel Carson and the side effects of DDT as much as anything else. GMOs just upped the ante because the long term effects are almost impossible to know now, and because they prevent farmers replanting seed, sterilize the next generation of neighboring related plants, crowd out the other plants through natural selection, and kill harmless or even beneficial neighboring organisms through biologically produced pest/herbicides.

Imagine a world where NO foodcrops made seed, because all those that do have been bred, choked or poisoned out of existence. It is already hard enough to get food from anyone but agribusiness multinationals, but if the only seedstock is that they manufacture, virtually every living thing on Earth will be wholly dependent on them. We may need Svalbard, not to rebuild a ruined civilization, but simply ruined agriculture. Organic food did not start with GMOs, but certainly needs to include them wholly apart from local sustainability and economic issues. The rest of the world constantly complains about American farm subsidies keeping food prices so low Third World farmers cannot escape poverty: Where will they be if they must BUY all their seed...?

This is playing God with far more than just our food; playing God with food is but one step on that much longer path.
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I'd be interested in knowing what you guys think about organic food - 11/09/2012 08:01:41 PM 1007 Views
Re: I'd be interested in knowing what you guys think about organic food - 11/09/2012 08:55:17 PM 540 Views
Okay - 11/09/2012 10:05:39 PM 508 Views
Re: Okay - 12/09/2012 01:26:20 AM 447 Views
Re: Okay - 12/09/2012 04:25:19 PM 536 Views
Re: I'd be interested in knowing what you guys think about food - 11/09/2012 08:59:54 PM 722 Views
I am intrigued by your ideas. - 12/09/2012 03:20:13 PM 449 Views
I'm a biology graduate so I'm a bit bias but... - 11/09/2012 09:41:00 PM 635 Views
Thank you for you perspective! *NM* - 11/09/2012 10:14:49 PM 250 Views
I think organic food is a luxury that few will want as food prices increase in the coming decades. - 11/09/2012 10:11:33 PM 528 Views
Re: I think organic food is a luxury that few will want as food prices increase in the coming -- - 11/09/2012 10:35:08 PM 548 Views
Re: I think organic food is a luxury that few will want as food prices increase in the coming -- - 12/09/2012 02:38:24 AM 533 Views
Good points - 12/09/2012 09:28:41 AM 584 Views
Re: Good points - 12/09/2012 02:09:49 PM 506 Views
Yes. - 12/09/2012 10:01:36 AM 485 Views
I like it. - 11/09/2012 11:29:08 PM 586 Views
What I think - 12/09/2012 03:43:29 PM 425 Views
Re: What I think - 12/09/2012 04:26:34 PM 522 Views
Did you just INVITE me to ramble? - 11/09/2012 11:30:01 PM 660 Views
Actually (minor pedants point) - 13/09/2012 08:23:48 PM 555 Views
I hold to the view that most food is organic - 12/09/2012 12:15:27 AM 592 Views
What I think (now in the right spot!) - 12/09/2012 04:02:31 PM 611 Views
I'm so glad you responded. - 12/09/2012 04:14:31 PM 571 Views
Well... - 12/09/2012 08:15:13 PM 612 Views
I think the organic movement is mostly a big scam: an excuse to charge more money for less food. - 12/09/2012 11:40:40 PM 477 Views
Actually, I believe the "no pesticides" part predates the "no GMOs" part. - 13/09/2012 05:26:53 AM 487 Views
You're right... - 13/09/2012 08:43:52 AM 579 Views
Thanks for confirming my general impression as right on the money. - 14/09/2012 03:35:56 PM 571 Views
Re: Thanks for confirming my general impression as right on the money. - 16/09/2012 07:45:25 PM 526 Views
That is a very interesting overview, thanks. - 17/09/2012 11:22:38 PM 522 Views
Re: That is a very interesting overview, thanks. - 20/09/2012 08:44:45 PM 544 Views
Re: That is a very interesting overview, thanks. - 24/09/2012 03:06:35 AM 551 Views
Curious as to where you read these things - 13/09/2012 08:41:43 PM 530 Views
I am aware of no corroborating scientific research, no - 14/09/2012 03:53:42 PM 550 Views
I have some serious problems with that I'm afraid. - 14/09/2012 05:53:39 PM 439 Views
Fair enough; I have some serious fears with GMOs. - 15/09/2012 03:58:13 AM 607 Views
This is a long one... - 15/09/2012 08:28:36 PM 530 Views
Tends to happen around me for SOME reason.... - 17/09/2012 05:31:44 PM 644 Views

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