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There is a difference between the law of averages and the law of large numbers. heartbreak Send a noteboard - 05/10/2012 04:45:00 AM
"The law of averages is a lay term used to express a belief that outcomes of a random event will "even out" within a small sample."

"In probability theory, the law of large numbers (LLN) is a theorem that describes the result of performing the same experiment a large number of times."

Your analogy of the voltmeter readings to people being polled doesn't fit. With the voltmeter reading, there should be one answer, what the system is supposed to output at the point of measurement. Let's call it twelve volts. You're absolutely right that we will take a million measurements and by averaging them we will have a better idea of what the voltage is at the spot being measured and it will be closer to the expected value the more measurements we take. The problem with comparing this to people being polled is that there is not a right or expected answer. Obama is not the expected value and Romney the error or the other way around.

What the margin of error tells us is that if the same poll were run again with a different subset of the population then the results could vary by plus or minus the margin of error for each candidate. For example, if we run a poll, Candidate A gets 48 and Candidate B gets 52 and our margin of error is 4 it is very possible that if we conducted the poll again with a different subset of the population that our results could end up 50/50.

This is why when the difference between the two is within the margin of error, the result of one doing better than the other is insignificant.

As far as taking the results of multiple polls as indication that one candidate is doing better than the other despite the margin of error showing that the result is insignificant, this is where you and Joel are mistaking the law of averages for the law of large numbers.

In this case, the number of polls considered is a small data set.
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Romney CRUSHES Obama in First Debate - Leads Swing States by 4% - 04/10/2012 05:32:32 AM 1120 Views
So, is that from a "corrected", "non-skewed" poll? - 04/10/2012 05:51:58 AM 631 Views
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Wow, you suck at Googling! - 04/10/2012 01:14:22 PM 829 Views
No, you just apparently suck at math - 04/10/2012 07:17:20 PM 593 Views
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Ooh, would you mind talking more about syndicalism? - 04/10/2012 11:28:40 PM 598 Views
It really should be mandatory for everyone to read factcheck.org after every debate. *NM* - 04/10/2012 09:38:24 AM 369 Views
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Romney addressed that head-on - 04/10/2012 02:13:44 PM 614 Views
Yeah, that "20 million" comment raised my eyebrows. - 04/10/2012 04:15:49 PM 976 Views
Why are you not counting the elderly? - 04/10/2012 07:33:28 PM 866 Views
Obama - Lost and Bewildered without Teleprompter.....funny stuff! - 04/10/2012 01:10:40 PM 646 Views
A2000, your message should read: - 04/10/2012 03:42:18 PM 669 Views
I consider the margin of error implied. - 04/10/2012 05:49:50 PM 573 Views
Unfortunately statistics does not support that. - 04/10/2012 06:11:56 PM 687 Views
Of course they do; the law of averages supports that. - 04/10/2012 06:46:27 PM 718 Views
Poll numbers aren't random so even if the law of averages could be applied to a small data set... - 04/10/2012 07:05:49 PM 597 Views
that is why you can't base things on just one poll - 05/10/2012 01:27:18 AM 772 Views
You are making the same mistake Joel is making. You should read our discussion. *NM* - 05/10/2012 01:50:01 AM 449 Views
there is a difference between statistical errors and model or method errors - 05/10/2012 03:28:38 AM 658 Views
There is a difference between the law of averages and the law of large numbers. - 05/10/2012 04:45:00 AM 854 Views
can wait for Ryan vs Bozo the VP - 04/10/2012 06:07:30 PM 543 Views
+1 - that debate is going to be comical! - 04/10/2012 07:24:26 PM 656 Views
I would end up with alchohol posioning *NM* - 04/10/2012 10:16:51 PM 400 Views
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your take on obama's foreign policy debate performance does not seem like reality - 04/10/2012 08:00:51 PM 630 Views
I never would have thought Romney could lay such a beatdown on Obama as I saw last night. - 04/10/2012 08:55:46 PM 702 Views
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Hilarious. - 04/10/2012 11:20:32 PM 583 Views
Re: Hilarious. - 05/10/2012 12:27:33 AM 592 Views
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who would you consider our number one geopolitical foe? - 04/10/2012 10:12:53 PM 709 Views
China is far more dangerous. *NM* - 05/10/2012 07:23:06 AM 305 Views
Whoa, was not expecting that point of agreement. - 05/10/2012 12:35:35 PM 738 Views
I'm not frightened of them, but they're hardly an ally. *NM* - 05/10/2012 03:55:45 PM 406 Views
I am not frightened, but am concerned. - 06/10/2012 01:27:40 PM 710 Views
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That's fair enough. *NM* - 05/10/2012 03:54:56 PM 352 Views
WOW - Even the liberal CNN Poll confirms Romney's crushing victory. - 04/10/2012 07:27:28 PM 738 Views
I could have crushed either of them in that debate - 04/10/2012 09:26:07 PM 720 Views
I watched it now. A few thoughts (albeit rather late): - 05/10/2012 09:46:02 PM 772 Views
You are correct on all points. - 07/10/2012 03:12:51 AM 880 Views
"There is no Soviet domination of Eastern Europe." - 07/10/2012 02:03:49 PM 1162 Views
you are missing a key point - 07/10/2012 04:34:17 PM 677 Views
Am I missing that point? I thought I said clearly enough that I thought Romney was better. *NM* - 07/10/2012 08:47:42 PM 412 Views
maybe, seemed that way to me - 08/10/2012 03:18:18 PM 656 Views

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