he still didn't stop the shooting, whether he was there before or after it started
moondog Send a noteboard - 23/12/2012 01:49:24 AM
he says he fired four shots, what difference does it make whether he was there or not before it started? he had a chance to stop it and did not. the other officer who responded to the request for backup also was unable to stop the shooting. and these are officers trained in the use of guns and deadly force. now that we have a suggestion for more armed officers, where are they going to come from? how long before they are trained well enough to know how to use their guns? and how effective will a lone person be if they find themselves away from the main campus when the shooting starts?
ok, we can start assigning current on-duty police to schools, but it will still take a long time to get enough police trained to guard every single school in the US assuming we do this through the local and state police force. making it a brand new law enforcement position will take even more time and money. the timeline to get this implemented at every single school in the US is laughable if this is supposed to be a serious method of preventing the next massacre. and the cost, whether it comes from state, local or federal, does not matter when we already have examples of gun control legislation which *does* prevent massacres from happening before they start.
ok, we can start assigning current on-duty police to schools, but it will still take a long time to get enough police trained to guard every single school in the US assuming we do this through the local and state police force. making it a brand new law enforcement position will take even more time and money. the timeline to get this implemented at every single school in the US is laughable if this is supposed to be a serious method of preventing the next massacre. and the cost, whether it comes from state, local or federal, does not matter when we already have examples of gun control legislation which *does* prevent massacres from happening before they start.
"The RIAA has shown a certain disregard for the creative people of the industry in their eagerness to protect the revenues of the record companies." -- Frank Zappa
"That's the trouble with political jokes in this country... they get elected!" -- Dave Lippman
"That's the trouble with political jokes in this country... they get elected!" -- Dave Lippman
the NRA shows it is an asylum overrun by lunatics
- 22/12/2012 04:40:26 PM
1300 Views
I do not see why calling for armed cops at schools is an unreasonable response.
- 22/12/2012 04:53:06 PM
825 Views
I can think of two reasons off the top of my head
- 22/12/2012 05:38:19 PM
845 Views
If the schools that the children of our elected representatives attend are gaurded, so should mine.
- 26/12/2012 03:00:35 PM
641 Views
If someone is shooting at you having a gun to shoot back seems like a good idea
- 26/12/2012 06:10:07 PM
663 Views
The effectiveness issue aside
- 22/12/2012 06:13:30 PM
718 Views
Re: The effectiveness issue aside
- 22/12/2012 06:59:36 PM
807 Views
If you think it would solve the debate then probably
- 22/12/2012 07:09:42 PM
762 Views
Nothing will ever truly end the debate, but we can greatly reduce or end its justification.
- 22/12/2012 08:03:39 PM
730 Views
If it's shown to work
- 23/12/2012 12:25:38 AM
811 Views
Of the many school shootings in recent years, I am aware of none where armed cops were present.
- 23/12/2012 12:47:32 AM
732 Views
columbine had two armed guards on the day of the shooting. they were both immediately fired upon...
- 23/12/2012 12:49:30 AM
698 Views
I have never seen any mention of them among the injured or dead (or at all.)
- 23/12/2012 01:09:38 AM
853 Views
you should try harder
- 23/12/2012 01:15:34 AM
873 Views
"a motorcycle patrolman who was near the school writing a speeding ticket" is not stationed there.
- 23/12/2012 01:34:50 AM
807 Views
he still didn't stop the shooting, whether he was there before or after it started
- 23/12/2012 01:49:24 AM
822 Views
No kidding; how could he stop the shooting before it started if he was not there?
- 23/12/2012 02:16:59 AM
656 Views
A fuller account of Gardner
- 23/12/2012 10:27:24 AM
916 Views
Nice link.
- 23/12/2012 02:27:30 PM
695 Views
Re: Nice link.
- 23/12/2012 03:15:24 PM
676 Views
Inexplicably, Ft. Hood was a gun free zone (guess no one told the shooter.)
- 26/12/2012 06:12:42 PM
692 Views
Re: Nice link.
- 23/12/2012 04:21:27 PM
678 Views
Gardner:If you’re going to put a police officer in a school, make sure his focus stays on the school
- 26/12/2012 06:40:41 PM
716 Views
The children are what matter, not the school. Surely this isn't something you disagree on?
- 29/12/2012 02:15:12 PM
746 Views
As usual Moondog, you are missing a BUNCH of facts on this one (links inside)
- 26/12/2012 07:51:29 PM
817 Views
at last count, over 99,000 schools in the US
- 23/12/2012 12:45:30 AM
772 Views
What is public safety worth to you?
- 23/12/2012 12:54:04 AM
679 Views
it's not entirely a matter of cost, although that factors into it.
- 23/12/2012 01:01:50 AM
611 Views
There are many cases where armed cops ended mass shootings.
- 23/12/2012 01:28:25 AM
614 Views
there are none where an armed guard placed there *before* the shooting had any effect
- 23/12/2012 01:36:42 AM
752 Views
Kind of a Catch-22; if they PREVENT shootings, shootings can only occur in their absence.
- 23/12/2012 01:52:03 AM
809 Views
ok, here is my last word on the subject
- 23/12/2012 02:06:49 AM
746 Views
9 people injured vs. 20 people dead.
- 23/12/2012 02:34:00 AM
658 Views
it is still "more guns makes us safer" which has yet to prevent a single massacre in this country
- 23/12/2012 02:41:56 PM
777 Views
Peter Odighizuwa comes to mind, that's also horrible logic
- 23/12/2012 08:27:46 PM
668 Views
Care to prove that negative? The burden to do so is on you as the person who made the assertion.
- 26/12/2012 06:47:07 PM
653 Views
It doesn't have to be a full time gaurd standing looking dangerous.
- 26/12/2012 06:12:14 PM
767 Views
Re: the NRA shows it is an asylum overrun by lunatics
- 22/12/2012 06:36:32 PM
918 Views
I believe it is fairly common in junior and high schools today, but not elementary schools.
- 22/12/2012 07:12:32 PM
683 Views
This entire post is completely irrelevant.
- 22/12/2012 07:27:45 PM
802 Views
Those who want univeral prohibition/access are equally fringe minorities.
- 22/12/2012 08:18:00 PM
748 Views
there is no Left or Right on this issue, there is only Sane and Insane
- 23/12/2012 12:59:08 AM
765 Views
also: it's insulting to tell parents their kids would be alive if only more guns were around
- 23/12/2012 01:30:53 AM
706 Views
People die from all sort of causes
- 22/12/2012 07:27:53 PM
743 Views
Cars require training, certification and licensing, too; why should guns not?
- 22/12/2012 08:25:43 PM
875 Views
Do bombs require certification?
- 22/12/2012 09:21:25 PM
966 Views
No, they are pretty much illegal for the general public under all conditions.
- 22/12/2012 09:35:35 PM
638 Views
i say this with all due respect -- eat a bag of dicks
- 23/12/2012 01:04:08 AM
756 Views
That was pretty damn respectful under the circumstances.
- 23/12/2012 01:10:04 AM
714 Views
The lack of intellect displayed here is to be expected
- 23/12/2012 04:01:32 AM
737 Views
so according to you we should just make life illegal since everyone is going to die from something..
- 23/12/2012 07:25:05 AM
646 Views
Obviously you didn't put pay attention
- 23/12/2012 01:40:17 PM
688 Views
no, you said "fuck it because people die anyway". there is a big difference
- 23/12/2012 02:46:46 PM
655 Views
Dicks and stones
- 23/12/2012 03:54:25 AM
866 Views
cars and guns kill roughly the same number of people every year -- around 30,000 give or take
- 23/12/2012 01:02:44 AM
706 Views
But over half of gun deaths are suicide.....so cars are much more dangerous to society. *NM*
- 23/12/2012 05:35:45 AM
308 Views
Every year is iffy there, it dropped off the last two, was 40k-50k plus for cars since 1962
- 23/12/2012 11:55:50 AM
660 Views
except that cars are legislated to be safer every year, guns aren't.
- 23/12/2012 03:01:36 PM
706 Views
Guns are for killing, cars are for transport, cars aren't any safer now against use for homicide
- 23/12/2012 08:22:13 PM
651 Views
but if we are trying to minimize the number of deaths, then more MUST be done for gun laws
- 24/12/2012 03:33:31 AM
630 Views
More must be done to minimize, not necessarily with greater regulation
- 24/12/2012 04:27:04 AM
737 Views
Re: More must be done to minimize, not necessarily with greater regulation
- 25/12/2012 04:49:54 PM
700 Views
Re: More must be done to minimize, not necessarily with greater regulation
- 25/12/2012 08:41:53 PM
683 Views
Here is some interesting data.....knives are as dangerous as "non-handguns"
- 23/12/2012 05:45:08 AM
764 Views
I hope you don't mind me taking this opportunity to plug my new book, "How to Cook with Guns" *NM*
- 23/12/2012 03:04:06 PM
396 Views
there was a school mass stabbing in china the same day as sandy hook
- 23/12/2012 03:18:00 PM
700 Views
I am equally happy that the criminal was incompetant, but that does not diminish their lethality
- 27/12/2012 10:45:33 PM
754 Views
I'm not sure it's about guns.
- 23/12/2012 06:08:50 PM
688 Views
IMO it is about the media attention focuised on the perpetrator. Their name becomes history. *NM*
- 27/12/2012 10:47:15 PM
357 Views