I really don't see how you can read that tone into it, because it just isn't there.
Legolas Send a noteboard - 25/02/2010 10:27:10 AM
I'd originally posted my +1 to Cannoli because I more or less agreed with the core point, that Bayh was taking potshots at the right in what was phrased as 'classy bipartisan resignation'. There's a feeling on the right, dating back to the Wellstone Memorial,that a lot of the left likes to take situations where they are basically safe from criticism to lob subtle, and often not-so subtle, attacks at the right. Normally when someone goes, be it by retirement, resignation, or death, they get a by on criticism, but you're not supposed to use those kind of situations to throw rocks. It's like the 'you lie' thing, uncalled for, but then at SOTU, POTUS lobs a direct attack at SCOTUS, on this very issue of campaign finance reform, which violates the basic courtesy that keeps 'You Lie' as wrong and separates us from the PM's addresses to the parliament. None of us wants things to go down that road, and yes, things are getting more that way than in the past and yes everyone is guilty in this, but the manner and flavor of his article, placed in the format he had it from the title, just seemed to be contradictory to the whole concept he was trying to discuss. It's like someone saying "I'm going to be the bigger man here and take the high road" a comment that always seems to miss the concept behind being the bigger man and taking the high road.
And I think if you claim Cannoli's post had a "core point", you're giving it more credit than it deserved.
There aren't any potshots at the right in this article, Bayh goes out of his way to stress that both parties are guilty. The timing makes it look self-serving, yeah, and maybe it was even meant to be self-serving, but like I said, just because he's hypocritical doesn't mean he isn't right. And Bayh does have a reputation for moderation and bipartisanship, as far as I'm aware, so it's not like this is some partisan Pelosi-like politician trying to gain points by paying lip service to bipartisanship after not having done anything of the sort in office.
Now, I'd bet the right has done it to the left too, but we've seen an awful lot of this sort of thing recently. I do agree with a lot of the points he's covering, but the way he did it, well it sounds so much like someone saying 'Well, we need to calm down and work together here, we need to stop arguing, we're both wrong, you are always so irrational when we argue and I maybe could be a bit more diplomatic in trying to tell you how wrong you are' that just sets things off on the wrong foot. For the sake of argument I'll cede that he didn't mean it that way and that the other side does it too, it's just that since his core premise is how we need to cut out the 'other side does it too' stuff, he is not setting a great example in this. He should have just left it with 'Things have become too partisan, it wasn't that way, or didn't seem so much that way in my time, or my father's time' that would have been classy and appropriate, as is, his article seems to have strong elements of the very thing he seems to be objecting too. I'm not going to beat up on someone for expressing Golden Age Nostalgia, we all do it in some way or another over something, and it's probably excessive to say he was being hypocritical, but the whole article just struck me the wrong way. There's classy and there's rude, and the two rarely mix together well, and it just came off to me that way. I'm happy to debate his individuals points on their merit, but he seemed to be raising them in the wrong venue. Hope that made sense, trying to keep it short and to the point instead of addressing the individual arguments, and my brain is a bit fried right now.
Like I said, I don't see it. The only part of your objection to his tone that made sense to me was the objection to the title, and just in general the fact that he says those things now at the end of his Senate career in which he has been guilty at least to some extent of the things he complains about. But now you're saying that if he had kept this article more limited, you would have agreed... so I don't get you at all, now.
In any case, I think I made clear in my previous reply what the important points on this topic are for me, and that there are Republicans who agree on those, so it's not just Bayh and it's not just this article with the apparently invisibly offensive tone.
"Why I'm Leaving the Senate" - Evan Bayh on the state of the US Senate
- 24/02/2010 10:10:55 AM
600 Views
Most of us like Evan
- 24/02/2010 01:13:34 PM
253 Views
"Why I'm Glad to See You Go" by a citizen and taxpayer
- 24/02/2010 05:10:40 PM
414 Views
+1 *NM*
- 24/02/2010 06:31:46 PM
85 Views
You cannot be serious. Might I ask you to write an actual reply? I'd like to hear your thoughts. *NM*
- 24/02/2010 09:20:49 PM
91 Views
All right, it will have to be a condensed version though
- 24/02/2010 10:57:50 PM
248 Views
Only you could call that condensed.
- 25/02/2010 01:34:50 AM
215 Views
- 25/02/2010 01:34:50 AM
215 Views
Condensed in topic
I'll try for brevity this time
- 25/02/2010 04:45:38 AM
234 Views
I'll try for brevity this time
- 25/02/2010 04:45:38 AM
234 Views
I really don't see how you can read that tone into it, because it just isn't there.
- 25/02/2010 10:27:10 AM
211 Views
I've explained where I'm deriving this from, if you don't see it I'm not sure...
- 25/02/2010 03:06:53 PM
223 Views
You know, you really need to stop that habit of replying to every single paragraph.
- 24/02/2010 10:07:10 PM
271 Views
Re: You know, you really need to stop that habit of replying to every single paragraph.
- 25/02/2010 05:47:02 PM
254 Views
Okay, I get that you're strongly libertarian and want far smaller government.
- 25/02/2010 06:56:34 PM
233 Views
And not 1 mention of term-limits
*NM*
- 24/02/2010 07:33:47 PM
87 Views
We have this thing called "a ballot box." Why shouldn't directly elected legislators be re-eligible? *NM*
- 25/02/2010 05:50:31 PM
94 Views
Well I rather liked it.
- 24/02/2010 11:30:08 PM
211 Views
