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Sorry, it is not. fionwe1987 Send a noteboard - 19/01/2019 07:21:44 AM

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if you drink water, it's gonna be wet.
Obviously if they aren't flying military, they are flying commercial.

But that they were going via military transport, or when they were, weren't known either. The details weren't out, and as I understand it, that's standard protocol for going to a war zone.

If Trump had just yanked Air Force transport, that would be one thing. But by doing so publicly, and by, allegedly, revealing when she was taking a commercial flight, he went well beyond fighting back for her SOTU disinvite.


The fact that there is any mention of "victory" is the upsetting part. There are no "winners" in this whole thing. There is only losers. Which is all of us.

Oh no. Don't try and play that card now. The only person who made this about "winning" is Trump. He changed his mind in the last minute about the CR precisely because he was being accused in conservative media of losing and caving in. Don't try claim the high ground now.

As for us all being the losers, that happened the moment Trump became the Republican nominee, and has only been compounded by every instance of his insanity being supported blindly by schmucks who want to "own the libs".


They have to stop the grandstanding and start negotiating.

Trump has to, yes. I know of no negotiation ever where the ask from one side keeps piling up, in exchange for exactly nothing. Funding for the mythical "wall" in exchange for protection for the Dreamers has been tried. Trump shot it down. Why, after an election victory that was a resounding rejection of Trump's immigrant fearmongering would they accept giving away more money for that nutty wall in exchange for absolutely nothing? No rational actor would accept such a proposal. Nor would any rational actor in a negotiation propose such a thing.


There is nothing inherently immoral about a wall to keep people who have no right to be here out.

There is, because

1) the Wall requires tons of private land to be seized via Eminent Domain. Since this is all for an ego trip, why the fuck should private citizens pay this cost?

2) There is very clear evidence that most illegal immigrants coming over the border do so via ports of entry. Vast majorities of this wall will do nothing to stop that.

3) The "wall", sorry "steel slats", can be breached. Unless you're going to have constant monitoring over it. The sample steel slats the administration commissioned were easily cut with a frigging hand saw.

4) Apprehension of people attempting to cross the border are in a pretty steep decline, and this is per the CBP, not any liberal think tank.

4) The President repeatedly promised Mexico would pay for the wall.

By its very stupidity, the lies associated with the claim for its need, or what it will do, and for the cost, both in terms of money and the land people will lose, this wall is immoral. It is a stupid boondongle to please the ego of a nutjob.


This isn't a wall to force people to stay in (like a prison or the Iron Curtain). This isn't a wall to keep people away from their property. Those are immoral because they infringe on a person's liberty or property (or in the case of prison, to protect the public & ensure follow-through of sentence). This is not the case here.

It will keep people away from their property, infringing on their rights.


Is it a colossal waste of money? It very well may be, but then the government wastes colossal amounts of money all the time. This is about ego. This is about stubbornness.

Firstly, no. The government doesn't wast this much money to please the ego of one man. If it proposes to, it is morally right to oppose it. Especially when that nincompoop was promising Mexico would pay for it recently.


<Edit: Continuation of a thought on the purposes of a wall>

~Jeordam


Please don't insult the word "thought". You didn't think. You parroted crap.

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The second link doesn't work. *NM* - 17/01/2019 09:23:02 PM 193 Views
Thanks, it should work now. *NM* - 17/01/2019 09:30:18 PM 168 Views
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I'd have to bet on Pelosi there. - 17/01/2019 10:23:38 PM 519 Views
They're both disgusting... - 18/01/2019 02:38:55 AM 339 Views
The game "itself" (politics) is disgusting... - 18/01/2019 02:47:52 AM 339 Views
But Trump can deliver the State of the Union from the Oval Office if he wants to - 18/01/2019 03:58:08 AM 365 Views
Head deep up Trump's ass, I see - 18/01/2019 06:54:50 AM 333 Views
Presidents between Adams (1800) to Wilson (1913) delivered a written copy of the SOTU - 18/01/2019 02:28:55 PM 545 Views
That's interesting. I wasn't aware of that. - 18/01/2019 06:39:46 PM 349 Views
It can't just be delivered to the Senate. - 18/01/2019 08:18:56 PM 345 Views
Just use the Senate..... - 18/01/2019 08:18:07 PM 342 Views
It's could have been decent countermove - 18/01/2019 06:58:14 AM 393 Views
Re: It's could have been decent countermove - 18/01/2019 06:12:53 PM 362 Views
True enough. - 18/01/2019 08:19:43 PM 385 Views
you are probably correct thay it wouldn't have been covered, the media is that biased *NM* - 18/01/2019 08:52:41 PM 183 Views
Biased against what? - 18/01/2019 09:38:22 PM 316 Views
The speaker of the house leaving the country during a government shutdown? - 21/01/2019 07:25:32 PM 316 Views
That has to do with where she was going, I'd think - 21/01/2019 08:10:35 PM 539 Views
Sorry but hiding behind the troops doesn't fly - 22/01/2019 12:59:40 PM 345 Views
I kind of agree. - 21/01/2019 08:35:01 PM 411 Views
One thing to consider .. - 22/01/2019 12:22:25 AM 360 Views
Once the pain hits enough people the blame shield will get thin - 22/01/2019 01:20:42 PM 331 Views
The Dems may be over playing theri hands in the blame game - 22/01/2019 01:18:20 PM 445 Views
So what about the second link disgust you? - 18/01/2019 12:55:34 PM 343 Views
An aspect of this I hadn't thought about - 18/01/2019 09:49:24 PM 343 Views
That's kind of like saying.... - 18/01/2019 11:05:22 PM 318 Views
what I find most problematic about the proposed wall - 19/01/2019 12:24:30 AM 352 Views
That's... weird - 19/01/2019 07:29:32 PM 388 Views
apparently the government prevailed in other states, so there's precedent. - 19/01/2019 07:57:48 PM 323 Views
Fuck 'em - 19/01/2019 11:19:25 PM 358 Views
Fuck the histrionics dumbass - 20/01/2019 03:26:31 AM 348 Views
Wow. - 21/01/2019 05:08:28 PM 341 Views
They'd tie up the amount of money owed, maybe. Not the taking. - 24/01/2019 04:41:39 AM 359 Views
Sorry, it is not. - 19/01/2019 07:21:44 AM 334 Views
Wow. - 21/01/2019 05:14:11 PM 338 Views
That's it. You convinced me. - 21/01/2019 05:51:23 PM 335 Views
Wow. - 24/01/2019 06:14:15 AM 315 Views
Why are you so angry? - 22/01/2019 10:29:51 PM 323 Views
It IS kinda striking - 24/01/2019 06:21:14 AM 294 Views
Takification - like... to make tacky? *NM* - 19/01/2019 07:33:44 PM 169 Views
if anyone would know it should be you - 19/01/2019 08:05:03 PM 405 Views
I don't really work in manufacturing, but yeah - 20/01/2019 04:32:33 PM 429 Views

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