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I'm not sure your view of me on this is that accurate. Legolas Send a noteboard - 20/12/2023 08:06:23 PM

View original postAnd I mean for both sides - long-term, something more than a cessation of hostilities. Do you think it’s even possible to be anything other than an intractable problem? You’ve mentioned Israeli concessions before. Care to list a few you have in mind? What about the Palestinians? I view previous peace negotiations as shams, with neither the Israelis nor the Palestinians truly interested in burying the hatchet. You’re a lot less pessimistic/negative on the issue than I am, and much more knowledgeable and well-informed to boot. And so I’d like to know your thoughts on the matter.

It's not necessarily that I see that many reasons to be optimistic, as that I don't want to just give it up as a hopeless cause... and I don't have any brilliant ideas as to the solution, I generally just approach it from a 'whatever remains after we've discarded the absolutely unacceptable or impossible solutions has to be the least unworkable solution' perspective.

So, no solutions in which either side gets the entire territory and the other one is just exterminated or expelled. No permanent apartheid/segregation 'solution'. No utopian fairy tale in which both sides just magically forget about all their grievances and share the land peacefully from here on out.

Which leaves us with some form of a trade off in which Israel gets hard security guarantees and improved relations with its neighbours, in exchange for major concessions to enable the Palestinians to live their lives in peace and freedom. I wouldn't be against some kind of bi-national confederacy / federal state, but it seems even less likely than a two state solution, so more likely the latter. And those Israeli concessions can and probably should include money, but it's inevitable that they would also include territory - certainly large parts of its illegally (in the eyes of nearly all of the world) occupied territories, possibly also parts of its internationally recognized territory, in exchange for being allowed to keep some of its occupied areas which would be extremely impractical to give up.

View original postMy totally unrealistic solution is to go from buying off to buying out. By which I mean Israel buys the Gaza Strip, and at a price that hurts. Send the Palestinians, or at least the Gazans, to Egypt or KSA not as refugees but as homeowners in a planned city. Build Neom, build THE LINE — a feasible version, that is — and populate a portion of it with Palestinians. And the Muslim world should chip in as well. If they really care, let them put their money where their mouth is. MBS will be happy for the interest and the investment. Too pie in the sky? Sure, but I’ve heard worse.

I think money would be an important part of any solution, but still it couldn't be the decisive part. And I can't see several million Palestinians just agreeing to become Saudis or Egyptians - nor would those host countries just take them.

Mind you, there are also millions of Palestinians still in the neighbouring countries, like Lebanon and Jordan, who've never been fully integrated or given full rights there, in part because their host countries didn't want that but also in part because they themselves didn't want to give up on their dream of returning. For those, I really don't see how any large-scale return would ever be possible, so those still would need to be settled permanently and with full citizenship in the other Arab countries.

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I have not - 11/12/2023 02:49:55 PM 81 Views
Yeah that is why I asked - 11/12/2023 04:24:40 PM 71 Views
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Yep, I know. - 12/12/2023 06:18:49 PM 81 Views
Re: Yep, I know. - 12/12/2023 08:04:57 PM 73 Views
Re: Yep, I know. - 14/12/2023 01:33:53 PM 57 Views
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whatever - 14/12/2023 02:50:53 PM 73 Views
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Chora I believe both are capable of lying - 14/12/2023 04:16:14 PM 75 Views
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Re: What stats are you contesting, exactly? - 17/12/2023 02:34:34 PM 65 Views
Yeah, I'm still confused what you're trying to claim about the numbers - 17/12/2023 10:51:00 PM 67 Views
Out of curiosity, what do you think the best way forward is? - 18/12/2023 03:52:34 AM 79 Views
I'm not sure your view of me on this is that accurate. - 20/12/2023 08:06:23 PM 62 Views
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Re: From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free - 14/12/2023 03:32:17 PM 67 Views
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Exactly - 14/12/2023 04:28:01 PM 72 Views
Those 3 Presidents are Bureaucratic Scum. - 14/12/2023 01:21:56 PM 72 Views
So Claudine Gay, Harvard Pres resigns - 02/01/2024 05:55:09 PM 54 Views
Re: So Claudine Gay, Harvard Pres resigns - 03/01/2024 04:38:14 PM 49 Views
Hey that’s not fair! - 03/01/2024 10:51:43 PM 56 Views

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