Active Users:593 Time:05/08/2025 01:15:00 PM
Aviendha's visions from Rhuidean indicate he will kneel... entyti Send a noteboard - 24/05/2012 07:04:02 PM
It's also confirmed there are corruptions in the Seanchan Prophecies. That verse was always very suspicious as its the foundation of a conflict between the Westlands/WT and the Seanchan, and the justification of the Return. It's central to the Seanchan - it's what they mention to point out the corruption of the western KC. Yet, falsely or not, Ishamael claimed once it was his doing that brought back the Seanchan...

The more reliable prophecy we have is that "He will bind the Nine Moons to him". "He" most likely referring to the Dragon, though we can't be sure without the complete prophecy.

For the other one from Seanchan, we've got different interpretations/wordings by various Seanchan. Some have said the Westland prophecies can't be right, because they do not mention the Dragon serving the Crystal Throne. Is this close to the actual wording or not? Does it specifically mention serving or kneeling - or something else that gets interpreted this way?

The imperial authorities of course worded it differently as the Dragon having to kneel to the CT. How reliable is it, when for people like the Empress you can only serve her by kneeling to her authority? There are many ways to serve, just not in the Empress's worldview, just like there's no way to serve the Seanchan people without serving their Empress like every last Seanchan (technically, even the Empress serves the Crystal Throne... she does it by being Empress, but still serves).

Tuon said Rand had to kneel before the LB, or all was lost. So that prophecy has an "or else" clause of some kind, confirming we don't have the full thing, nor perhaps something close to the actual words. how close was this to the actual wording? What's lost? The LB for everyone? The Seanchan attempt to reconquer the Westlands? The Seanchan Empire itself? We don't know.


In Aviendha's vision of the (possible?) future, we see a scene with the Aiel meeting with the queen of Andor. There, the male Aiel mentions that the Seanchan forced Rand to bow to their empress. This was, of course, generations after the event, so his understanding is only so reliable. However, it lends credence to him kneeling to Tuon.

Some other things to consider... corrupted or not, the fact that the Seanchan believe in their prophecy will make things very difficult. It may be that Rand will have to figure out how to fulfill both prophecies: kneeling to the Crystal Throne and binding the Nine Moons to him.

Also, Tuon's musings about Rand needing to kneel to her may have been something akin to the borderland prophecy, meaning that Rand failing to go through his epiphany would mean he would not kneel to her, meaning all was lost.
Omnipresent Lurker of WoTMB
Proud and Open Rolan Sympathiser
Fan of Everything Tool
Eternal Shiva Enthusiast
Reply to message
aMoL UK cover and Blurb (SPOILERS!!!!!!!!!) - 21/05/2012 06:44:26 PM 2860 Views
Thoughts... - 21/05/2012 06:46:41 PM 1352 Views
Re: Thoughts... - 21/05/2012 08:04:29 PM 1273 Views
Re: Thoughts... - 21/05/2012 08:45:41 PM 1216 Views
Re: Thoughts... - 21/05/2012 09:04:09 PM 1367 Views
*nods in agreement* *NM* - 21/05/2012 10:46:48 PM 451 Views
Re: Thoughts... - 21/05/2012 11:08:50 PM 1210 Views
Re: Thoughts... - 22/05/2012 01:02:16 AM 1254 Views
Re: Thoughts... - 21/05/2012 09:35:29 PM 1274 Views
Mat and the madness... - 21/05/2012 10:30:09 PM 1222 Views
Nynaeve's revelation may make the AS even more worried of Rand being mad - 21/05/2012 10:58:37 PM 1233 Views
Not Egwene though... - 21/05/2012 11:02:41 PM 1048 Views
Maybe, maybe not ... Nynaeve just gave everyone proof of the extent of his possible madness - 21/05/2012 11:26:41 PM 1026 Views
Fair enough. - 21/05/2012 11:31:10 PM 1062 Views
Agreed that it's an odd blurb - 21/05/2012 11:45:03 PM 1097 Views
Re: Maybe, maybe not ... Nynaeve just gave everyone proof of the extent of his possible madness - 22/05/2012 01:14:05 AM 1113 Views
I was thinking about that... - 22/05/2012 02:35:25 AM 1010 Views
Re: I was thinking about that... - 22/05/2012 03:41:48 AM 1086 Views
Re: Mat and the madness... - 22/05/2012 02:29:31 AM 1170 Views
Rand's dreams... - 22/05/2012 02:42:36 AM 1095 Views
She assumes he's mad just like most people assume a 19 year old boy is horney - 22/05/2012 03:47:49 AM 1235 Views
I'd like some evidence for this. - 22/05/2012 04:14:27 AM 1042 Views
It's still ingrained in the society - 22/05/2012 01:28:05 PM 1135 Views
Moridin and the link - 28/05/2012 01:45:43 AM 962 Views
Re: Thoughts... - 23/05/2012 01:06:10 PM 1050 Views
What caught my eye there was "Trollocs seize Caemlyn." - 22/05/2012 02:12:25 PM 1108 Views
As much as I would love Moiraine to go with him to Ebou Dar - 22/05/2012 07:20:40 PM 1274 Views
At this stage, all roads lead to Rand. - 22/05/2012 09:08:42 PM 1034 Views
Re: At this stage, all roads lead to Rand. - 23/05/2012 08:07:56 PM 1133 Views
Well, like I say, there is no reason they could not ALL meet up with Tuon. - 23/05/2012 08:53:53 PM 1035 Views
Re: Well, like I say, there is no reason they could not ALL meet up with Tuon. - 24/05/2012 02:41:55 PM 1181 Views
Aviendha's visions from Rhuidean indicate he will kneel... - 24/05/2012 07:04:02 PM 1457 Views
Re: Aviendha's visions from Rhuidean indicate he will kneel... - 26/05/2012 09:42:20 PM 1621 Views
Agreed... - 26/05/2012 09:57:06 PM 1141 Views
I think you are extrapolating some of his actions into more than he intends - 26/05/2012 10:37:44 PM 1013 Views
Re: Agreed... - 27/05/2012 04:26:15 AM 1081 Views
I think you're both wrong... - 27/05/2012 08:41:50 AM 1094 Views
Re: I think you're both wrong... - 27/05/2012 07:10:08 PM 1074 Views
I can't believe Galad will be accepted as a ruler since he is the Lord Captain Commander - 28/05/2012 02:48:26 AM 1105 Views
Re: I can't believe Galad will be accepted as a ruler since he is the Lord Captain Commander - 28/05/2012 04:54:46 PM 1043 Views
That makes no sense - 28/05/2012 05:50:16 PM 1080 Views
Taringail was Laman's heir... - 28/05/2012 07:20:07 PM 1091 Views
You are answering the wrong question - 29/05/2012 02:19:48 PM 998 Views
No. I've answered the exact question. You seem to have missed it. - 29/05/2012 04:40:17 PM 1053 Views
Yet not one of these things actually happened - 29/05/2012 10:13:35 PM 1056 Views
You're being absurd... - 30/05/2012 01:04:36 AM 995 Views
Explain why Taringail didn't become King after Laman's death then - 30/05/2012 05:48:48 AM 997 Views
- 30/05/2012 06:11:02 AM 966 Views
Why then would Taringail, an ambitious man, renounce a Throne? - 30/05/2012 06:22:08 AM 1134 Views
We don't fully know... - 30/05/2012 06:43:30 AM 870 Views
You just flipped your last statement - 30/05/2012 06:55:36 AM 1129 Views
You seem extremely confused... - 30/05/2012 09:56:30 AM 1046 Views
Not confused, simply not satisfied with the information we have - 30/05/2012 12:15:59 PM 1017 Views
Re: Not confused, simply not satisfied with the information we have - 30/05/2012 03:34:06 PM 1175 Views
I am not contesting the information we have - 30/05/2012 04:48:08 PM 1145 Views
You're impossible... - 30/05/2012 10:02:59 PM 1027 Views
Wow ... Not sure what is bringing out the aggression - 30/05/2012 10:19:18 PM 984 Views
*sigh* - 30/05/2012 11:45:28 PM 1051 Views
DomA swore *NM* - 31/05/2012 03:39:24 PM 1122 Views
Re: That makes no sense - 29/05/2012 04:39:45 PM 1176 Views
Only one other thing... - 29/05/2012 04:53:29 PM 893 Views
Re: Only one other thing... - 30/05/2012 12:32:58 PM 951 Views
Bryne was Captain General not First Prince and Taringail was Prince Consort not FP - 30/05/2012 06:07:48 AM 1025 Views
Bryne was First Prince Regent. - 30/05/2012 06:19:33 AM 978 Views
Fair enough ... Thanks for providing a quote - 30/05/2012 06:22:52 AM 1171 Views
Re: Fair enough ... Thanks for providing a quote - 30/05/2012 04:38:29 PM 1001 Views
No he wasn't - 30/05/2012 04:16:02 PM 976 Views
No Forsaken will go near that Ter'angreal - 26/05/2012 10:33:20 PM 916 Views
Re: No Forsaken will go near that Ter'angreal - 27/05/2012 03:23:12 AM 997 Views
Aviendha reprogrammed the ter'angreal - 27/05/2012 01:50:19 PM 968 Views
Re: Aviendha reprogrammed the ter'angreal - 27/05/2012 06:44:41 PM 1132 Views
I'd have to re-read to be 100% certain, but the way I read the passage - 28/05/2012 02:10:14 AM 1090 Views
He might not literally kneel before the ter'angreal, but almost certainly must meet with Tuon soon. - 25/05/2012 03:40:54 AM 1327 Views
Soon might be relative... - 27/05/2012 02:08:53 AM 1517 Views
Sul'dam - 27/05/2012 09:03:57 AM 1359 Views
Re: Sul'dam - 27/05/2012 05:54:57 PM 1102 Views
Right, then; here we go.... - 03/06/2012 08:45:20 AM 979 Views
Re: As much as I would love Moiraine to go with him to Ebou Dar - 23/05/2012 05:28:17 PM 1035 Views
I think I read a fan fiction like that once *NM* - 23/05/2012 08:04:42 PM 594 Views

Reply to Message