Active Users:842 Time:18/08/2026 08:14:25 AM
Exactly. Etzel Send a noteboard - 05/11/2009 07:56:00 PM
Reminds me of the theories (which I and others supported) that Semirhage actually must have had a more clever plan than to simply try capturing Rand disguised as Tuon in KoD. The main reason was that we thought that a Top Forsaken like Semirhage wouldn't be that stupid. But we learned in TGS that Semirhage indeed failed greatly. Graendal wasn't even stupid in TGS, but the Semirhage-lesson taught me that no Forsaken is such intelligent as the "Graendal escaped"-followers believe now. She simply couldn't anticipate Rand's action.

Besides that, it makes more sense that Graendal's storyline was ended that way to concentrate on other things in the last two books, similar to Masema's, Semirhage's, Suroth's, Sevanna's, Galina's and maybe Elaida's conclusion.


The build up to Graendal from Lews Therin's point of view is based on the riddle, 'how do you beat someone who is cleverer than you on every level'? No one could answer him, and Lews Therin had no idea how to defeat her - but he had ways to defeat Lanfear, Sammael and other Chosen. To him, she was the supreme puzzle.

Rand derives the answer 'let her think you're playing her game then punch her in the face'. He balefired the entire palace. It was instant, unpredictable and total - she didn't have a chance.

If Graendal survived it will make Rand seem like a fool because even though he derived the answer, he failed. It doesn't make sense. Cadsuane had to work out how to break Semirhage, and Rand had to work out how to defeat a mind manipulator. They both succeeded.

The reversal of the Compulsion was specifically inserted to show that she'd died. It strains credibility to think that she'd perfected that timing, while at the same time she had to avoid the biggest blast of balefire since the War of Power. She also had no way to know that Rand would use balefire, so why would she create the 'unweaving' subterfuge. Rand might have used a giant fireball or swallowed the palace into the earth. If the Compulsion had unravelled then, she would have looked really stupid. Graendal cannot be as omniscient as others are portraying - she merely had the ability to invoke an atrocity because she couldn't be defeated in other ways.
Reply to message
Graendal - maybe the deadliest Forsaken - 05/11/2009 07:00:12 AM 1975 Views
It has definitely been hinted - 05/11/2009 08:37:04 AM 1034 Views
Graendal wasn't that deadly... - 05/11/2009 09:37:24 AM 1069 Views
I think she was - 05/11/2009 02:42:48 PM 918 Views
RJ still put her in the top category of the Forsaken.. - 05/11/2009 05:24:06 PM 1006 Views
I think she's the most deadly and intelligent. The others are idiots, IMHO. - 05/11/2009 06:38:30 PM 930 Views
This whole Graendal is alive-idea - 05/11/2009 07:13:16 PM 963 Views
I'm divided on it.. - 05/11/2009 07:19:07 PM 883 Views
Here's the deal, though. Semirhage actions actually followed part of the theory to a tee. - 05/11/2009 07:21:21 PM 921 Views
Ah, anyway... - 05/11/2009 07:58:05 PM 821 Views
I agree with you - 05/11/2009 07:32:39 PM 921 Views
Exactly. - 05/11/2009 07:56:00 PM 1140 Views
I just don't understand the logic here - 05/11/2009 07:25:20 PM 965 Views
It's quite simple logic. - 05/11/2009 08:05:15 PM 1008 Views
Then how did she do it? - 05/11/2009 09:41:53 PM 875 Views
Re: Then how did she do it? - 05/11/2009 10:58:01 PM 821 Views
Re: Then how did she do it? - 05/11/2009 11:58:24 PM 947 Views
Re: Then how did she do it? - 06/11/2009 02:22:51 PM 886 Views
It is a possibility. - 06/11/2009 03:43:22 AM 844 Views
Hmm, I have some problems with this - 06/11/2009 04:23:23 AM 970 Views
Some points no one addressed, a.k.a. Graendal lured Rand in... - 06/11/2009 05:16:12 AM 940 Views
Still no answers. I think I'm correct in feeling she is alive. *NM* - 06/11/2009 09:25:47 PM 361 Views
Re: Hmm, I have some problems with this - 06/11/2009 02:34:54 PM 926 Views
But... - 06/11/2009 02:56:32 PM 880 Views
Re: But... - 06/11/2009 03:07:02 PM 903 Views
Re: But... - 06/11/2009 03:53:41 PM 1069 Views
Re: But... - 06/11/2009 07:35:12 PM 841 Views
She's definitely the deadiest - 05/11/2009 02:05:23 PM 955 Views
I think she escaped, but it says something that he had to become worse than a Forsaken to do it - 05/11/2009 06:10:08 PM 879 Views
Eventually they will be reborn... - 05/11/2009 06:30:45 PM 792 Views
Thanks for reminding me. Oh well, then I'm stuck with the whole tearing apart the Pattern thing - 05/11/2009 06:44:35 PM 832 Views
Moiraine says. - 05/11/2009 07:02:10 PM 873 Views
In this case, Moiraine's comment doesn't really matter. - 05/11/2009 07:14:44 PM 862 Views
Re: In this case, Moiraine's comment doesn't really matter. - 05/11/2009 07:35:18 PM 958 Views
From what I keep hearing - 05/11/2009 08:58:57 PM 865 Views
I could well believe it - 05/11/2009 11:03:40 PM 827 Views
Re: In this case, Moiraine's comment doesn't really matter. - 06/11/2009 09:00:01 PM 757 Views
I conceed to Rand's point - 05/11/2009 06:31:38 PM 949 Views
I don't think it's acceptable to tear apart the Pattern to save it. - 05/11/2009 06:40:22 PM 773 Views
True... - 05/11/2009 06:57:24 PM 818 Views
Re: True... - 05/11/2009 07:07:07 PM 817 Views
Re: True... - 05/11/2009 07:35:06 PM 853 Views
Re: True... - 05/11/2009 08:07:42 PM 828 Views
I always thought she was the most dangerous of the chicks. - 06/11/2009 04:28:43 AM 966 Views
Difference between being dangerous and hard to kill--but, she is dangerous - 08/11/2009 02:19:34 AM 889 Views
Semirhage did far more destruction than Graendal. - 24/11/2009 06:09:18 PM 939 Views
Graendal also made chaos in Shara, though... - 24/11/2009 06:36:15 PM 734 Views
It's not surprising when you start looking at her parallels - 12/12/2009 01:03:25 AM 737 Views
Not to take away from Graendal, but my vote goes to Semirhage or Aginor - 16/12/2009 07:03:52 PM 738 Views
meh - 19/12/2009 11:56:12 PM 747 Views

Reply to Message