Active Users:606 Time:15/12/2025 01:08:56 AM
Exactly. Etzel Send a noteboard - 05/11/2009 07:56:00 PM
Reminds me of the theories (which I and others supported) that Semirhage actually must have had a more clever plan than to simply try capturing Rand disguised as Tuon in KoD. The main reason was that we thought that a Top Forsaken like Semirhage wouldn't be that stupid. But we learned in TGS that Semirhage indeed failed greatly. Graendal wasn't even stupid in TGS, but the Semirhage-lesson taught me that no Forsaken is such intelligent as the "Graendal escaped"-followers believe now. She simply couldn't anticipate Rand's action.

Besides that, it makes more sense that Graendal's storyline was ended that way to concentrate on other things in the last two books, similar to Masema's, Semirhage's, Suroth's, Sevanna's, Galina's and maybe Elaida's conclusion.


The build up to Graendal from Lews Therin's point of view is based on the riddle, 'how do you beat someone who is cleverer than you on every level'? No one could answer him, and Lews Therin had no idea how to defeat her - but he had ways to defeat Lanfear, Sammael and other Chosen. To him, she was the supreme puzzle.

Rand derives the answer 'let her think you're playing her game then punch her in the face'. He balefired the entire palace. It was instant, unpredictable and total - she didn't have a chance.

If Graendal survived it will make Rand seem like a fool because even though he derived the answer, he failed. It doesn't make sense. Cadsuane had to work out how to break Semirhage, and Rand had to work out how to defeat a mind manipulator. They both succeeded.

The reversal of the Compulsion was specifically inserted to show that she'd died. It strains credibility to think that she'd perfected that timing, while at the same time she had to avoid the biggest blast of balefire since the War of Power. She also had no way to know that Rand would use balefire, so why would she create the 'unweaving' subterfuge. Rand might have used a giant fireball or swallowed the palace into the earth. If the Compulsion had unravelled then, she would have looked really stupid. Graendal cannot be as omniscient as others are portraying - she merely had the ability to invoke an atrocity because she couldn't be defeated in other ways.
Reply to message
Graendal - maybe the deadliest Forsaken - 05/11/2009 07:00:12 AM 1817 Views
It has definitely been hinted - 05/11/2009 08:37:04 AM 877 Views
Graendal wasn't that deadly... - 05/11/2009 09:37:24 AM 927 Views
I think she was - 05/11/2009 02:42:48 PM 773 Views
RJ still put her in the top category of the Forsaken.. - 05/11/2009 05:24:06 PM 859 Views
I think she's the most deadly and intelligent. The others are idiots, IMHO. - 05/11/2009 06:38:30 PM 789 Views
This whole Graendal is alive-idea - 05/11/2009 07:13:16 PM 813 Views
I'm divided on it.. - 05/11/2009 07:19:07 PM 734 Views
Here's the deal, though. Semirhage actions actually followed part of the theory to a tee. - 05/11/2009 07:21:21 PM 746 Views
Ah, anyway... - 05/11/2009 07:58:05 PM 676 Views
I agree with you - 05/11/2009 07:32:39 PM 760 Views
Exactly. - 05/11/2009 07:56:00 PM 978 Views
I just don't understand the logic here - 05/11/2009 07:25:20 PM 807 Views
It's quite simple logic. - 05/11/2009 08:05:15 PM 847 Views
Then how did she do it? - 05/11/2009 09:41:53 PM 712 Views
Re: Then how did she do it? - 05/11/2009 10:58:01 PM 669 Views
Re: Then how did she do it? - 05/11/2009 11:58:24 PM 804 Views
Re: Then how did she do it? - 06/11/2009 02:22:51 PM 733 Views
It is a possibility. - 06/11/2009 03:43:22 AM 693 Views
Hmm, I have some problems with this - 06/11/2009 04:23:23 AM 820 Views
Some points no one addressed, a.k.a. Graendal lured Rand in... - 06/11/2009 05:16:12 AM 786 Views
Still no answers. I think I'm correct in feeling she is alive. *NM* - 06/11/2009 09:25:47 PM 293 Views
Re: Hmm, I have some problems with this - 06/11/2009 02:34:54 PM 780 Views
But... - 06/11/2009 02:56:32 PM 726 Views
Re: But... - 06/11/2009 03:07:02 PM 746 Views
Re: But... - 06/11/2009 03:53:41 PM 913 Views
Re: But... - 06/11/2009 07:35:12 PM 688 Views
She's definitely the deadiest - 05/11/2009 02:05:23 PM 816 Views
I think she escaped, but it says something that he had to become worse than a Forsaken to do it - 05/11/2009 06:10:08 PM 728 Views
Eventually they will be reborn... - 05/11/2009 06:30:45 PM 638 Views
Thanks for reminding me. Oh well, then I'm stuck with the whole tearing apart the Pattern thing - 05/11/2009 06:44:35 PM 671 Views
Moiraine says. - 05/11/2009 07:02:10 PM 694 Views
In this case, Moiraine's comment doesn't really matter. - 05/11/2009 07:14:44 PM 705 Views
Re: In this case, Moiraine's comment doesn't really matter. - 05/11/2009 07:35:18 PM 800 Views
From what I keep hearing - 05/11/2009 08:58:57 PM 715 Views
I could well believe it - 05/11/2009 11:03:40 PM 644 Views
Re: In this case, Moiraine's comment doesn't really matter. - 06/11/2009 09:00:01 PM 597 Views
I conceed to Rand's point - 05/11/2009 06:31:38 PM 807 Views
I don't think it's acceptable to tear apart the Pattern to save it. - 05/11/2009 06:40:22 PM 633 Views
True... - 05/11/2009 06:57:24 PM 670 Views
Re: True... - 05/11/2009 07:07:07 PM 660 Views
Re: True... - 05/11/2009 07:35:06 PM 713 Views
Re: True... - 05/11/2009 08:07:42 PM 666 Views
I always thought she was the most dangerous of the chicks. - 06/11/2009 04:28:43 AM 781 Views
Difference between being dangerous and hard to kill--but, she is dangerous - 08/11/2009 02:19:34 AM 739 Views
Semirhage did far more destruction than Graendal. - 24/11/2009 06:09:18 PM 765 Views
Graendal also made chaos in Shara, though... - 24/11/2009 06:36:15 PM 590 Views
It's not surprising when you start looking at her parallels - 12/12/2009 01:03:25 AM 583 Views
Not to take away from Graendal, but my vote goes to Semirhage or Aginor - 16/12/2009 07:03:52 PM 611 Views
meh - 19/12/2009 11:56:12 PM 611 Views

Reply to Message