I was surprised by that too. It really was shoddy writing to ignore that. Especially with her acceptance of the Reds, and choosing a Keeper from among them. I mean, the whole thing could be dealt with easily. Someone asks her if the Reds aren't to be punished for their crimes. She says TG is in the offing, and such things cannot be worked out now. Matter solved for the moment at least. But no...
I remember DomA, before the book was released, suggested that Siuan would confess her wrongdoing to help heal the rift between the Aes Sedai, and take all the blame, leaving Egwene clean.
First, I think I've proved that what she did was indeed not the same as using the Oath Rod.
No, you've deomstrated that the oath she forced upon her victims was more lenient than the one the Black Ajah Hunters used.
Second, notice what happens with the BA hunters. She accepts their explanation that they needed the fourth Oath to carry their extraordinary plan forward. It is only when they overstep and ask Meidani to do something she certainly would not of her own free will, something that had nothing to do with their extraordinary situation and everything to do with their convinience, that Egwene gets really pissed.
It was the equivalent of Egwene commiting murder in front of the sisters sworn to her and ordering them to never reveal what they knew. I don't know if she could enforce this, but if she could and did, and then condemned the BA hunters, then you'd have a basis to talk.
It was the equivalent of Egwene commiting murder in front of the sisters sworn to her and ordering them to never reveal what they knew. I don't know if she could enforce this, but if she could and did, and then condemned the BA hunters, then you'd have a basis to talk.
No, she definitely claims that the Oath itself is a betrayal of all that they were. Unexpected Encounters. She later does as you say when they mean to order Meidani to get penance, but that does not change her claims and alleged perspective.
And did Egwene claim to be a paragon of honesty? Read the scene again... Nynaeve is talking about following the rules and speaking the truth, when Egwene challenges her by saying Nynaeve herself was not honest. She was dealing with Nynaeve's hypocrisy, not saying that she was honest and Nynaeve was not.
Of course she claims to be honest. The act of punishment itself carries the implication of superiority, and in this case, definitely moral superiority. That liars must be punished, when she does not get punished herself, indicates her pretense at not being a liar. Which she clearly is.
As for your recollection of the event, it is flat out wrong. Nynaeve was not berating Egwene about anything, she was floundering because Egwene had almost raped her with dream-men, and she went to the erroneous conclusion that she had lost her moral authority because she had lied to Egwene for the first time. Of her own accord, she confessed to Egwene about it. That is the opposite of hypocrisy. Little did she know that the reason why Egwene was acting this way was not Nynaeve's lie, but Egwene's - she was crazy desperate to hide her lies. What Can be Learned in Dreams. I think it is you who should read that scene again.
As an analogy, think of your elder brother accusing you of playing while not doing your homework. Ten minutes ago, he himself was doing the exact same thing, so you call him out on it (in a reprehensible and none too pleasant manner). Are you a hypocrite, or are you calling him out on his hypocrisy?
Depends. If I call him out on also not doing his homework, I'm calling him out on his hypocrisy. If I berate him on not doing his homework then punish him for it, I'm being a hypocrite.
What two? Blackmail and Compulsion? Of course she can!
Between Oathbound Sisters and Compelled Sisters.
The first rule of being a ninja is "do no harm". Unless you intend to do harm, then do lots of harm.
~Master Splinter
Victorious in Bergioyn's legendary 'Reverse Mafia'. *MySmiley*
~Master Splinter
Victorious in Bergioyn's legendary 'Reverse Mafia'. *MySmiley*
Egwene - hypocrite
- 10/12/2009 01:20:24 PM
1560 Views
Not the same at all really
- 10/12/2009 02:12:36 PM
817 Views
I agree.
- 10/12/2009 03:03:49 PM
720 Views
What crime? Accepting her unethical promotions? Being afraid of the Hall's injustice?
- 10/12/2009 03:51:05 PM
726 Views
But...
- 10/12/2009 05:54:39 PM
593 Views
She threatened, or made an implied threat, to reveal what they had done.
- 17/12/2009 12:11:43 PM
603 Views
Re: What crime? Accepting her unethical promotions? Being afraid of the Hall's injustice?
- 10/12/2009 09:08:08 PM
648 Views
It does NOT violate Tower Law, as Myrelle herself said, and Siuan admits.
- 17/12/2009 12:23:25 PM
631 Views
I can't decide if you just don't understand the books at all
- 13/12/2009 05:14:22 AM
553 Views
I have doubts about RJ's brain if he actually believed some of the crap he has characters spew
- 17/12/2009 12:26:52 PM
591 Views
Let he who has no sin cast the first stone
- 10/12/2009 04:34:06 PM
641 Views
Not really
- 10/12/2009 03:06:30 PM
693 Views
But what the Amylin said is law, like how she raised those Accepted.
- 10/12/2009 04:42:51 PM
629 Views
Re: But what the Amylin said is law, like how she raised those Accepted.
- 10/12/2009 11:04:47 PM
656 Views
No she was right, and even her blackmail, as reprehensible as that was, was not an act of tyranny
- 10/12/2009 03:56:41 PM
765 Views
Actually, I agree.
- 10/12/2009 06:47:22 PM
583 Views
I like Egwene
- 10/12/2009 07:08:24 PM
640 Views
That really disappointed me.
- 10/12/2009 07:29:14 PM
676 Views
funny, I'm more of the mind set that both groups were right
- 11/12/2009 12:02:50 AM
602 Views
Not the problem.
- 11/12/2009 12:13:26 AM
543 Views
I do agree with DomA and the others on the point that
- 11/12/2009 07:13:31 AM
605 Views
Re: I do agree with DomA and the others on the point that
- 11/12/2009 08:20:19 AM
667 Views
*shrugs*
- 11/12/2009 02:06:47 PM
620 Views
You have no basis for that assertion.
- 11/12/2009 07:12:03 PM
601 Views
They refuse to reveal the Ajah Heads to Egwene, despite her express orders. Doubt Meidani could...
- 12/12/2009 09:44:23 AM
700 Views
Ah, true that.
- 12/12/2009 07:20:04 PM
600 Views
Who said she wasn't wrong?
- 12/12/2009 09:02:55 PM
574 Views
Re: Who said she wasn't wrong?
- 13/12/2009 04:16:56 AM
610 Views
Re: Who said she wasn't wrong?
- 13/12/2009 08:12:25 AM
650 Views
Re: Who said she wasn't wrong?
- 13/12/2009 07:35:10 PM
558 Views
I agree with most of your point
- 10/12/2009 09:49:18 PM
683 Views
Of course she is a hypocrite
- 11/12/2009 05:22:56 AM
611 Views
The same can be said of Nynaeve and Mat
- 11/12/2009 07:20:47 AM
621 Views
Probably because they're all human
- 12/12/2009 12:43:53 PM
545 Views
- 12/12/2009 04:05:13 PM
637 Views
- 12/12/2009 04:05:13 PM
637 Views