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Texts have different interpretations and Readers emphasize different aspects Larry Send a noteboard - 22/04/2010 09:28:05 PM
Once you narrrow the focus to "Human Ecology" and use it as an umbrella for the political/religious/moral themes of the book then it does come down to a disagreement over semantics. I would still disagree with using it as a stated tehme because it reaches for too much and obscures what I consider teh "real themes" of the novel unless the express purpose is to tie all the human elements into a nice package, while seeriously delving into all of its sub-units; more of the heading to a review/critique than a point of the review itself. Though where the Eart Day comment fits into it I still don't understand.


I wasn't really "narrowing it down" as much as clarifying that ecological systems include human ecology. And themes can be overarching or they can be relatively specific. Here, I'm referring to an overarching theme that is related to several of the more specific themes, such as several of the ones that Dom mentions in his reply in this subthread.

Again, the Earth Day comment was mostly to place the novel in a historical context. Basically, before anything resembling the modern environmentalist movement(s) began, there was this interesting SF novel that used ecosystems (encompassing more than just plant/non-human animal life) to complement and to strengthen the narrative being told.

I seem to recall an observation in one of the first three books (one that I've seen echoed in several other places) that it is no surprise that the three dominant monotheistic religions on this planet today developed in steppe or desert-like environments.

The statement may have been made, but it is not accurate. Christianity and Islam spun off of Judidism and that evolved from, or replaced (documentation gets REAL sketchy as to which), a polytheistic religion. The desert/stepes obsercation breaks down becasue all 3 are from the same religious tree. Perhaps that is why there has been such hostility for the last 3,000 years between them; but that is an entirely different conversation that belongs nowhere near this site.


I'm very aware of that. You misinterpreted what I wrote. I know quite well the influences on each of the three Abrahamic faiths and that those major influences on the genesis of those three branches come from the Fertile Crescent, the Nile Valley, and the Arabian Desert. I could talk about pigs for a while, but let's just say there's an environmental reason why pig eating was taboo in much of that region during the development of those faiths (with the exception of Pauline Christianity, which was heavily Hellenized).
Illusions fall like the husk of a fruit, one after another, and the fruit is experience. - Narrator, Sylvie

Je suis méchant.
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Frank Herbert, Dune Chronicles (series reviews within) - 16/04/2010 04:11:40 AM 2068 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 16/04/2010 06:09:49 PM 1168 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 17/04/2010 12:08:06 AM 1371 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 17/04/2010 02:33:38 PM 1294 Views
I was using a fairly precise term when I said "ecological" - 18/04/2010 12:13:14 AM 1291 Views
Re: I was using a fairly precise term when I said "ecological" - 18/04/2010 03:34:33 AM 1347 Views
Please read linked interview...as I call bullshit. Also, why are your walls white? - 18/04/2010 05:18:07 AM 1150 Views
Re: Please read linked interview...as I call bullshit. Also, why are your walls white? - 19/04/2010 06:15:26 PM 1208 Views
That was most of my issue. - 21/04/2010 12:12:56 AM 1069 Views
Re: That was most of my issue. - 21/04/2010 06:33:14 PM 1023 Views
Re: That was most of my issue. - 29/04/2010 11:38:26 PM 1006 Views
Just because something plays a dominate role doesn't make it a theme - 21/04/2010 02:09:42 PM 1156 Views
A theme is merely a dominant strain in a story; there can be more than one theme present - 21/04/2010 11:21:38 PM 1084 Views
Re: A theme is merely a dominant strain in a story; there can be more than one theme present - 22/04/2010 04:58:01 AM 1057 Views
Good points - 22/04/2010 09:19:45 PM 1116 Views
Re: Good points - 22/04/2010 10:55:21 PM 1058 Views
when you call it human ecology I come much closer to agreeing - 22/04/2010 02:16:58 PM 1066 Views
Re: A theme is merely a dominant strain in a story; there can be more than one theme present - 22/04/2010 04:08:28 PM 999 Views
Texts have different interpretations and Readers emphasize different aspects - 22/04/2010 09:28:05 PM 1122 Views
Not really sure how Larry's definition is archaic. - 19/04/2010 07:52:27 PM 1170 Views
Re: Not really sure how Larry's definition is archaic. - 20/04/2010 07:04:40 PM 1043 Views
You're not using "archaic" correctly - 20/04/2010 10:07:31 PM 1030 Views
Your patronizing manner aside, that's not "archaic" at all. - 21/04/2010 01:46:50 AM 943 Views
doesn't that regulate the point down to interesting trivia? - 21/04/2010 02:36:38 PM 1088 Views
Re: Your patronizing manner aside, that's not "archaic" at all. - 21/04/2010 06:23:24 PM 1181 Views
Funny the things people focus on - 21/04/2010 11:24:59 PM 1053 Views
Re: Funny the things people focus on - 23/04/2010 05:28:54 PM 1049 Views
People who see this as an ecological book are missing the point of the book - 16/04/2010 06:28:40 PM 1554 Views
Books can have more than one theme. Great books almost always do. *NM* - 16/04/2010 07:15:11 PM 518 Views
I agree with that I just never really the ecological theme to Dune - 16/04/2010 10:12:26 PM 1238 Views
Ecology goes more than one way - 17/04/2010 12:12:45 AM 1178 Views
There are several points to the book/series - 17/04/2010 12:11:38 AM 1269 Views
Everyone get something different from a book - 19/04/2010 07:01:51 PM 1443 Views
I believe those themes become more pronounced later in the series - 20/04/2010 10:09:36 PM 1195 Views
I remember having hated every single character of this book. Some random thoughts - 17/04/2010 05:08:25 PM 1370 Views
I hope you got to Darwi Odrade - 21/04/2010 03:44:27 PM 1075 Views
Re: Frank Herbert, Dune - 17/04/2010 08:05:16 PM 1652 Views
I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 17/04/2010 10:22:27 PM 1454 Views
Re: I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 18/04/2010 04:38:10 AM 1411 Views
Re: I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 19/04/2010 04:04:43 AM 1316 Views
Re: I guess we'll have a few disagreements here, Dom - 22/04/2010 04:31:26 AM 1077 Views
I thought all of Dune had begun as a serial in a SF magazine. *NM* - 22/04/2010 01:58:22 PM 465 Views
And Dune Messiah as well was serialized at first, in Galaxy *NM* - 22/04/2010 09:31:54 PM 471 Views
Dune Messiah (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 19/04/2010 08:42:18 AM 1428 Views
Re: Dune Messiah (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 21/04/2010 03:33:46 PM 1061 Views
I didn't see that in Alia - 21/04/2010 11:27:22 PM 992 Views
One of my favorite series! - 21/04/2010 03:30:57 PM 988 Views
I didn't "miss it" as much as I chose to deemphasize it - 21/04/2010 11:29:50 PM 908 Views
Re: I didn't "miss it" as much as I chose to deemphasize it - 22/04/2010 04:02:26 PM 1020 Views
His style doesn't appeal to me as much, unfortunately - 22/04/2010 09:17:21 PM 941 Views
You might want to track down his short stories one day... - 23/04/2010 02:06:09 PM 1131 Views
Children of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 22/04/2010 06:47:04 AM 1114 Views
See...I think I made a mistake in my reading of Dune - 22/04/2010 07:26:28 AM 1086 Views
Depends - 22/04/2010 08:01:39 AM 989 Views
Re: Depends - 22/04/2010 11:12:15 PM 1365 Views
read something else - 23/04/2010 07:49:34 PM 979 Views
LA Times article on Dune (4/18/2010) - 23/04/2010 10:59:00 AM 927 Views
God Emperor of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 25/04/2010 02:03:37 AM 1229 Views
Heretics of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 28/04/2010 06:02:54 AM 956 Views
Re: Heretics of Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 29/04/2010 03:26:28 PM 1040 Views
I read the wiki synopses of those two books - 29/04/2010 09:44:07 PM 972 Views
Re: I read the wiki synopses of those two books - 10/05/2010 04:10:49 AM 1343 Views
Chapterhouse: Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 30/04/2010 02:31:10 PM 1145 Views
Re: Chapterhouse: Dune (2001 initial read; 2010 re-read) - 10/05/2010 01:24:33 AM 1187 Views

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