Seriously? You don't know how Jordan's illness manifested itself?
Werthead Send a noteboard - 25/03/2011 02:19:23 AM
i said that 5 years would be the highest conceivable amount of time that it would take someone to write an epic fantasy novel. not that 5 was acceptable but six wasnt. the paradox of the heap notwithstanding, this is a trivial point as it seems clear that when there are a multitude of authors who put out books at a yearly or biyearly pace. why should grrm be any different?
You still haven't answered the question. Why is 5 years the highest amount acceptable? Why not 9 or 4? What process led you to believe that 5 years is that maximum possible amount given the number of SF and Fantasy novels that have taken longer to come out?
heres a bit of information. people dont suddenly develop heart diseases. you have them for a while before they are diagnosed. they start to cause problems, which is why you go to the doctor, who tells you that somethings wrong. now i dont presume to know the process with which rj and harriet found out he had amyloidosis. but its not at all hard to imagine that he felt many of the symptoms prior to diagnosis. and what do you now, around that time, it took him longer to write KoD. call me crazy.
Well, we could engage in guesswork and supposition. Or we could, you know, actually check out what Robert Jordan himself said about it on his blog at the time:
http://www.dragonmount.com/forums/blog/4/entry-348-an-idle-comment-or-two/
Jordan felt somewhat ill on Memorial Day 2005 (which was after the manuscript of KoD had been submitted), followed by a recurrence whilst attending a showing of SPAMALOT a week later. He had it looked into and the diagnosis came after KoD had come out.
So Jordan's illness did not manifest any symptoms at all before KoD was completed and handed in.
KNIFE OF DREAMS took longer to write because Jordan took a break after CROSSROADS to write the NEW SPRING novel. And yes, he got slagged off for that massively at the time.
despite all the information against martins work ethic and focus, i might still be willing to cut him some slack if not for the fact that i not once heard him say that he was writing at a 2k word per day pace. nor did i hear him mention what kind of pace he wrote at. he is a great writer, no question. but if youve any experience writing, i think you can realize that he is a little on the lazy side.
That's because writing is not a mechanical process. Sit down, bash out 2,000 words a day, rinse and repeat until it's done. The only writer I know who comes close to doing that and is any good is Steven Erikson. Everyone else in that bracket - Salvatore, Feist, Anderson, Goodkind - sucks donkey ass.
You're also cherry-picking what points to respond to and ignoring the ones that torpedo your arguments. So I want to know how your argument stacks up against:
1) The specific, major writing, structural and timeline problems that were encountered during the writing of ADWD, some stored up and repeatedly put-off since Martin started writing the series twenty years ago.
2) The fact that ADWD is almost 450,000 words long in manuscript, half again the length of the previous book in the series, 70,000 words longer than any Wheel of Time or Malazan novel, and longer in word-count than LORD OF THE RINGS in its totality, which took twice as long to write.
3) That 2,000 words a day as an average presupposes that 50% of writers will work slower than that and 50% will work faster. And Martin has the misfortune to fall into the lower half of that bracket, along with many, many others.
A Dance With Dragons
- 22/03/2011 11:43:01 PM
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See, I disagree.
- 23/03/2011 01:05:59 AM
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Also, I think we all know GRRM has more interest than just writing
- 23/03/2011 05:06:34 AM
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...
- 23/03/2011 01:17:57 AM
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Yeah but, come on, 6 years? And 5 years for the book before that? *NM*
- 23/03/2011 05:05:01 AM
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The way I see it ...
- 23/03/2011 03:59:35 AM
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what this guy said. so true. not enough time in the day for all the cool stuff. i can wait
*NM*
- 23/03/2011 04:39:35 AM
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*NM*
- 23/03/2011 04:39:35 AM
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If people are upset with him, don't buy the book.
- 23/03/2011 07:52:02 AM
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Re: If people are upset with him, don't buy the book.
- 23/03/2011 01:22:09 PM
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Do you guys literally have nothing else to read?
- 24/03/2011 06:40:51 AM
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do you realize how little time is spent on whining and bitching?
- 24/03/2011 10:06:16 AM
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Re: Do you guys literally have nothing else to read?
- 24/03/2011 03:58:11 PM
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*complain*
- 23/03/2011 10:19:33 PM
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*sigh*
- 24/03/2011 10:11:29 AM
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Re: *sigh*
- 24/03/2011 01:56:51 PM
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Well
- 24/03/2011 02:44:00 PM
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Re: Well
- 25/03/2011 12:17:08 AM
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apparently you cant read...
- 25/03/2011 12:37:51 AM
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Seriously? You don't know how Jordan's illness manifested itself?
- 25/03/2011 02:19:23 AM
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I'm glad you mentioned LotR
- 25/03/2011 03:21:46 AM
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Can we please stop making baseless comparisons to Lord of the Rings? Thanks.
- 25/03/2011 06:22:50 AM
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And can we try to strive for accuracy in what we are saying? Thanks.
- 25/03/2011 08:24:51 AM
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Yeah, and im sure WWII, which his son was fighting in, wasn't a distraction at all
- 25/03/2011 01:09:22 PM
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He still went to work, bucko.
- 25/03/2011 06:57:26 PM
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Are you seriously that naive?
- 25/03/2011 01:07:39 PM
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I think you're relying on math way too much to interpret the situation.
- 25/03/2011 08:48:32 PM
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I don't care at all after so long a wait, but I do love watching the fanboys scramble to defend him. *NM*
- 24/03/2011 01:20:15 AM
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Your complaints would find more resonance if he hadn't announced a publication date yet.
- 24/03/2011 01:55:01 PM
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Re: A Dance With Dragons
- 24/03/2011 02:06:48 PM
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Re: A Dance With Dragons
- 24/03/2011 03:08:27 PM
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But Sanderson's book was a mess.
*NM*
- 24/03/2011 09:35:56 PM
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*NM*
- 24/03/2011 09:35:56 PM
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Was it really? Which one was this? *NM*
- 25/03/2011 03:40:58 AM
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ToM. Still was better than what Jordan was writing, though.
- 25/03/2011 06:21:49 AM
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Interesting.
- 27/03/2011 11:32:39 PM
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I thought it was pretty damn good, personally. *NM*
- 25/03/2011 05:13:25 AM
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I enjoyed it a lot more than I enjoyed any of Jordan's recent books.
- 25/03/2011 06:20:47 AM
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This thread is becoming vaguely ridiculous.
- 25/03/2011 01:31:40 PM
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I think about half of the responses are just from Malkierknight. *NM*
- 25/03/2011 05:11:18 PM
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These threads are always ridiculous. I'm both astounded & not at all surprised that there's another
- 25/03/2011 06:39:34 PM
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Are you familiar with Minecraft?
- 25/03/2011 07:05:56 PM
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It always astounds me that the developers at Valve aren't hanging from street lamps outside their HQ
- 25/03/2011 09:07:56 PM
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Whoops.
- 26/03/2011 09:25:28 PM
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I'd delete it for you to tidy up, but I think two posts by CNRedDragon is a good thing.
*NM*
- 27/03/2011 07:49:55 AM
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*NM*
- 27/03/2011 07:49:55 AM
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Jaysus, it's not like he's maliciously holding back the book on you
- 25/03/2011 03:46:00 PM
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Re: Jaysus, it's not like he's maliciously holding back the book on you
- 25/03/2011 04:31:31 PM
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Re: Your math up above
- 25/03/2011 04:45:23 PM
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Re: Your math up above
- 26/03/2011 02:43:03 PM
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That was gentle ribbing, not ad hom. Calm down.
- 26/03/2011 04:22:24 PM
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Re: That was gentle ribbing, not ad hom. Calm down.
- 26/03/2011 05:09:19 PM
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When you see people like Nate, Tash, or Rebekah, you don't have to worry.
- 26/03/2011 06:59:01 PM
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- 26/03/2011 06:59:01 PM
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I see that I need to work on my reputation.
- 28/03/2011 05:49:30 PM
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Perhaps it is the same as one does not speak ill of fairies or elves.
- 28/03/2011 11:22:17 PM
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A very wise man once informed people that George R. R. Martin is not their bitch.
- 26/03/2011 09:26:15 PM
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He hasn't only been working on A Dance With Dreams. So Chill Already! *NM*
- 27/03/2011 04:26:17 PM
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*NM*