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Just making sure you knew I wasn't mistaking your reply for a constructive one snoopcester Send a noteboard - 18/08/2010 12:08:41 PM
There was some sarcasm in there too. Did you catch that? :P


No.

Oh, they sure would. The media would gleefully cover them putting their foot in their mouth, and happily portray then as the next Hitler for expressing even a fraction of those sentiments. The sympathy would always remain with the Muslims though, and the implication would be that a good person would clearly denounce such people and their supporters.

Other than having to put up with listening to said people's crap so that the rest of us can snicker behind our hands at how outdatedly evil they are and how enlightened and progressive we are, I fail to see how the Muslims would be inconvenienced in any major way. The media giving such people a voice would clearly be on the Muslims' side, and would put strong pressure on the public to take their side as well.


This is all really getting away from the point - the ability of the people building the community centre a couple of blocks away from Ground Zero to get their message out to people likely to be angry about it. I some how doubt people like Palin and Newt Gingrich or people appearing on Fox News took the time to make clear what the other side of the story is and were never going to. So rather than blame it on the people behind building the community centre for not communicating their reasons, the sensible approach is to realise they weren't given the chance to because that is how it works (which one would think people on the right would be aware of, since they're happy to point it out all too often when it is the other way).
*MySmiley*

Robert Graves "There is no money in poetry, but then there is no poetry in money, either."

Henning Mankell "We must defend the open society, because if we start locking our doors, if we let fear decide, the person who committed the act of terror will win"
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Wait, wait WAIT! The location for the so-called "mosque at ground zero" is actually 2 blocks away?! Avendesora - 17/08/2010 03:19:02 PM 2343 Views
it's still too close!! IT'S TOO CLOSE I SAY LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 03:23:12 PM 1336 Views
*NM* ironclad - 18/08/2010 11:40:26 AM 560 Views
Yes, it is. Elaine - 17/08/2010 03:23:33 PM 1327 Views
Another stupid question...is it even actually a mosque? Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 03:28:37 PM 1179 Views
I've heard the same. nossy - 17/08/2010 03:30:36 PM 1111 Views
So Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 03:35:43 PM 1202 Views
blog link nossy - 17/08/2010 03:41:43 PM 1207 Views
that's correct *NM* damookster - 17/08/2010 03:51:38 PM 568 Views
it's both from what I've heard. LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 04:00:54 PM 1116 Views
sort of like most churches, mosques and temples? *NM* random thoughts - 17/08/2010 04:04:12 PM 560 Views
mmm, i think more like... LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 04:08:55 PM 1073 Views
it is a community center with a mosque Aisha - 17/08/2010 04:28:08 PM 966 Views
A memorial! Avendesora - 17/08/2010 04:58:52 PM 1186 Views
it is a community center with a mosque Aisha - 17/08/2010 04:28:09 PM 1150 Views
my wife's church has a play ground and community center random thoughts - 17/08/2010 04:47:52 PM 1094 Views
okay, cool then LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 05:17:04 PM 985 Views
I was just being nit picky random thoughts - 17/08/2010 05:44:36 PM 959 Views
Been hearing a lot on NPR nossy - 17/08/2010 03:32:42 PM 1186 Views
I could see it being insensitive if it were actually where the towers used to be. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 03:43:18 PM 1244 Views
Yeah. nossy - 17/08/2010 03:51:13 PM 1143 Views
precisely. LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 04:02:44 PM 1055 Views
This could be part of the reason that most of the opposition doesn't seem to be coming from locals. Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 03:53:06 PM 1157 Views
seriously, it's not like property is some ample commodity in NYC *NM* LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 04:03:24 PM 578 Views
you should probably keep in mind.... damookster - 17/08/2010 04:02:25 PM 1200 Views
So Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 04:06:18 PM 1256 Views
Ground Zero specifically refers to the north and south towers where the planes struck... damookster - 17/08/2010 04:26:40 PM 1183 Views
don't use that term at all. Say WTC. *NM* Aeryn - 18/08/2010 12:27:32 AM 574 Views
I know. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 04:26:19 PM 1124 Views
it certainly has turned into a political land mine for Obama... damookster - 17/08/2010 03:54:03 PM 1126 Views
True nossy - 17/08/2010 04:02:04 PM 950 Views
unfortunately... damookster - 17/08/2010 04:05:08 PM 1070 Views
That's because they are pussies. nossy - 17/08/2010 04:10:59 PM 1214 Views
This is beginning to sound familiar. Legolas - 17/08/2010 05:18:37 PM 1288 Views
with the senate majority leader weighing it I don't believe it is all how it is mostly on the right random thoughts - 17/08/2010 05:58:10 PM 1186 Views
Seems we disagree on that, then. Legolas - 17/08/2010 06:05:33 PM 1164 Views
hardly the first time random thoughts - 17/08/2010 06:56:33 PM 1140 Views
Well, since day 1 of this whole debate alot of the opposition has come from the right. Variant - 17/08/2010 10:50:49 PM 1129 Views
you assume it is pandering maybe they just agree with the majority random thoughts - 18/08/2010 02:30:53 AM 1118 Views
I'm not saying it's a partisan issue, but it has turned political for all the wrong reasons. Variant - 18/08/2010 04:18:49 AM 1225 Views
is the idea that it is not to close to ground zero the misinformation you are refering to? random thoughts - 18/08/2010 03:09:17 PM 1074 Views
Well, it's not like they're literally on ground zero. Variant - 18/08/2010 08:54:08 PM 1209 Views
ground zero is defined as where the old WTC complex was random thoughts - 19/08/2010 12:23:32 PM 1096 Views
And anything within a 3 block radius apparently? Variant - 20/08/2010 04:44:25 AM 1123 Views
Guess which of them will be out of a job in January? Joel - 18/08/2010 01:22:49 PM 1105 Views
the only reason Obama won't be out of job is he isn't running random thoughts - 18/08/2010 03:10:58 PM 1078 Views
Oh, I dunno if you could translate the current numbers into Obamas defeat. Joel - 18/08/2010 03:52:18 PM 1165 Views
Bush's numbers were much better in 04 then Obama's are now random thoughts - 18/08/2010 04:11:31 PM 1176 Views
Perhaps so then. Joel - 19/08/2010 04:51:36 PM 1092 Views
it was a large event so two half blocks really is pretty damn close random thoughts - 17/08/2010 04:03:17 PM 1207 Views
Here's a map of the site for perspective Isaac - 17/08/2010 04:08:41 PM 1221 Views
so 2 blocks from the superblock then? LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 04:13:03 PM 1228 Views
I guess, superblock is an obscure term to this country lad Isaac - 17/08/2010 04:41:11 PM 1106 Views
It may not necessarily matter to people who are aware of that fact. Legolas - 17/08/2010 05:13:12 PM 1075 Views
mk, well, to my mind (being from phoeni, 1 full city block is about 1 mile. LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 05:15:49 PM 1145 Views
A mile is a serious exaggeration, surely. Legolas - 17/08/2010 05:24:48 PM 1244 Views
Remember, I did say in Phoenix LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 05:27:43 PM 1139 Views
I really need to see Phoenix some day. Legolas - 17/08/2010 05:32:40 PM 1178 Views
i still think houston is more spread out than phoenix moondog - 18/08/2010 08:21:10 AM 1174 Views
unless you go far enough west of course random thoughts - 18/08/2010 03:30:45 PM 1035 Views
most of california is pretty spread out, city-wise. moondog - 19/08/2010 02:16:44 AM 1000 Views
true, I was think along the lines of San Fransico random thoughts - 19/08/2010 03:47:12 AM 1086 Views
Absolutely. Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 05:28:38 PM 1134 Views
Yeah, and it seems to be about 10 autobuses in distance on Google Earth. Legolas - 17/08/2010 05:29:43 PM 1046 Views
In NYC, generally 1 mile = 20 blocks *NM* BlackAdder - 17/08/2010 05:25:21 PM 619 Views
Okay. I guess i just forget how much larger Phoenix is *NM* LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 05:28:13 PM 501 Views
Google Earth says 500 feet between mosque and GZ *NM* Isaac - 17/08/2010 05:30:59 PM 520 Views
*edit* Just for reference... one mile = 5280 feet, 500ft = approx 1/10 of a mile. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 06:26:19 PM 1094 Views
Judging by Google Earth, the blocks inbetween both contain a single large building. (edit) Legolas - 17/08/2010 07:08:05 PM 1027 Views
Clarify: 500 ft between the mosque and the border of the area on the map? *NM* Avendesora - 17/08/2010 07:03:51 PM 537 Views
Probably, given my corner-to-corner result. *NM* Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 07:26:19 PM 542 Views
Yes, down West Broadway (contains old ground view from site) Isaac - 17/08/2010 07:31:58 PM 1253 Views
Personally, I think this supports Ave's point. Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 04:16:15 PM 1184 Views
yes... damookster - 17/08/2010 04:29:51 PM 1193 Views
Right. Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 04:31:29 PM 1145 Views
Believe me, honey. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 04:32:47 PM 993 Views
Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 04:37:19 PM 1066 Views
You know what else is on Park Place? A strip club. Aeryn - 17/08/2010 11:58:56 PM 1050 Views
Really? I had no idea Isaac - 18/08/2010 12:06:27 AM 1129 Views
Re: Really? I had no idea Aeryn - 18/08/2010 12:24:54 AM 1186 Views
Hmm... Isaac - 18/08/2010 01:23:14 AM 1134 Views
I didn't even know I was responding to you. Aeryn - 18/08/2010 04:08:36 AM 1105 Views
Thanks Isaac - 18/08/2010 04:23:47 AM 1088 Views
It happens...? Joel - 18/08/2010 01:29:44 PM 912 Views
knowing there's a strip club and "walking those streets"; seems like you've "gotten around" moondog - 18/08/2010 02:03:14 AM 1109 Views
*NM* Aeryn - 18/08/2010 04:10:10 AM 535 Views
They're building on the hallowed ground of a Burlington Coat Factory! Vodalus - 17/08/2010 04:13:06 PM 1190 Views
how so? LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 04:14:17 PM 1010 Views
Maybe it's got something to do with Cordoba, Spain? Avendesora - 17/08/2010 04:16:38 PM 1021 Views
From when the Moors conquered Spain Vodalus - 17/08/2010 04:18:18 PM 1236 Views
ah mk. fair enough then. *NM* LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 04:35:39 PM 656 Views
to clarify though snoopcester - 17/08/2010 04:50:19 PM 1037 Views
in that respect, I rather like the name *NM* LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 05:23:18 PM 580 Views
Yes, but you have to remember the mindset of those protesting. Vodalus - 17/08/2010 09:49:26 PM 1136 Views
Oh indeed snoopcester - 18/08/2010 10:20:45 AM 1153 Views
Oh, yeah. I foolishly assumed people would know that part. *NM* Vodalus - 18/08/2010 05:34:39 PM 543 Views
Sorry, but the card says it was "the Moops" so you must be wrong. Tom - 18/08/2010 03:56:11 PM 1106 Views
Aaaaaaaaagh Camilla - 18/08/2010 04:13:17 PM 1062 Views
*NM* Vodalus - 18/08/2010 05:31:20 PM 526 Views
Or a Christian conquest of Islam, surely. Legolas - 17/08/2010 05:07:53 PM 1200 Views
Right on the button. *NM* Tim - 17/08/2010 04:19:39 PM 550 Views
Ezra Klein made a good point in the Washington Post... damookster - 17/08/2010 04:33:31 PM 1003 Views
Re: Ezra Klein made a good point in the Washington Post... Avendesora - 17/08/2010 04:34:47 PM 1057 Views
it was a rhetorical question in his column damookster - 17/08/2010 04:43:25 PM 1160 Views
that is hardly the same thing random thoughts - 17/08/2010 04:56:43 PM 1107 Views
so suppose... damookster - 17/08/2010 06:06:03 PM 1055 Views
I am sure it will I just don't see the relevance random thoughts - 17/08/2010 06:57:41 PM 1162 Views
My question is, why would you want to put a mosque/community center/thing that close? StormCrow - 17/08/2010 04:39:05 PM 1094 Views
angry New Yorkers? damookster - 17/08/2010 04:45:01 PM 1193 Views
I was going to guess 4 protests to your earlier post. StormCrow - 17/08/2010 04:50:08 PM 1144 Views
We do not live in fear of what "a few crazy people" might do. *NM* Aeryn - 18/08/2010 12:02:06 AM 508 Views
Re: angry New Yorkers? snoopcester - 17/08/2010 04:53:58 PM 1081 Views
I was wondering about that. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 04:56:28 PM 1174 Views
Re: I was wondering about that. snoopcester - 17/08/2010 05:05:50 PM 1136 Views
interesting map, thanks for posting it. *NM* Avendesora - 17/08/2010 05:55:06 PM 576 Views
That's a good point too and I didn't think about that. StormCrow - 17/08/2010 05:39:53 PM 1269 Views
I think what this position misses Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 05:01:52 PM 1293 Views
Ok, sure. StormCrow - 17/08/2010 06:09:33 PM 1193 Views
Hoboken? The_Muted_Grimaud - 17/08/2010 09:06:07 PM 1003 Views
Indeed. Not a serious suggestion about putting it there. StormCrow - 17/08/2010 09:13:35 PM 1005 Views
angry New Yorkers? Geez, we are more civilized than that, thank you. *NM* Aeryn - 18/08/2010 12:01:12 AM 514 Views
not really *NM* random thoughts - 18/08/2010 02:31:46 AM 438 Views
your opinion is noted. now go eff yourself. *NM* Aeryn - 18/08/2010 04:11:25 AM 478 Views
that's pretty good BlackAdder - 18/08/2010 04:44:14 AM 1072 Views
That's right. Why resort to violence when a good rant will do? *NM* Aeryn - 18/08/2010 06:09:27 AM 499 Views
and a heart fuck off to you but thanks for the ironic reply *NM* random thoughts - 18/08/2010 03:18:25 PM 504 Views
How is it ironic? *NM* Camilla - 18/08/2010 03:43:50 PM 540 Views
How was his uncivilized response ironic? *NM* random thoughts - 18/08/2010 04:18:17 PM 492 Views
Yes. Where is the irony? Camilla - 18/08/2010 04:20:57 PM 1032 Views
Re: How was his uncivilized response ironic? random thoughts - 18/08/2010 04:23:25 PM 1037 Views
Aaah Camilla - 18/08/2010 04:31:02 PM 1085 Views
Re: Aaah random thoughts - 18/08/2010 05:30:07 PM 1044 Views
Re: Aaah Camilla - 18/08/2010 05:38:47 PM 1139 Views
To both of you: her. And she. *NM* Legolas - 18/08/2010 05:44:03 PM 523 Views
I knew that. *NM* Camilla - 18/08/2010 05:45:21 PM 505 Views
I'm not a New Yorker. Not impuning your civility either. StormCrow - 19/08/2010 02:45:55 AM 1268 Views
Because the building is cheap as hell, because they're mostly abandoned in those areas Jragghen - 18/08/2010 01:25:13 AM 1094 Views
Something I'm confused on Isaac - 17/08/2010 04:59:41 PM 1350 Views
another thing to consider. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 05:02:38 PM 1034 Views
You'll have to explain to me what that has to do with what I said Isaac - 17/08/2010 05:10:21 PM 1065 Views
I don't think anyone is saying it's not "near" ground zero. Sareitha Sedai - 17/08/2010 05:12:52 PM 1171 Views
Of course you're confused. It was a tangental thought. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 06:06:29 PM 1108 Views
Fair enough, I can't really criticize others for going off on tangents since I do it so much *NM* Isaac - 17/08/2010 06:36:54 PM 529 Views
On that tangent though, an interesting article Isaac - 17/08/2010 07:50:44 PM 1139 Views
From what I understand, there's another mosque very close to the site Brian - 17/08/2010 05:06:26 PM 1229 Views
I understand there's also a strip club and a xxx movie rental shop within that same 2 blocks radius. Legolas - 17/08/2010 05:09:26 PM 1115 Views
Looks like 2 or 3 blocks, I love Google Earth Isaac - 17/08/2010 05:17:01 PM 1170 Views
True but the buildings were not nocked down by radical strippers *NM* random thoughts - 17/08/2010 05:52:04 PM 528 Views
Joss Whedon purchased the rights to this movie already. *NM* StormCrow - 17/08/2010 06:29:34 PM 579 Views
*NM* Avendesora - 17/08/2010 06:38:27 PM 514 Views
Yep. Is true. *NM* Aeryn - 17/08/2010 11:59:31 PM 534 Views
What do strip clubs and dirty movies and gay bars have to do with 9/11? *NM* ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 12:33:59 AM 546 Views
Nothing, which is precisely the point. *NM* Legolas - 18/08/2010 12:37:52 AM 549 Views
Can you explain your point to me then? Because I'm not following it. ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 01:21:13 AM 1077 Views
The argument is that it's "hallowed ground" and therefore should be treated with "respect" Jragghen - 18/08/2010 01:26:44 AM 1203 Views
No. That might be one argument, but hardly the only one. ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 01:31:14 AM 1183 Views
Pretty much what Greg said. Legolas - 18/08/2010 09:39:33 AM 1132 Views
then you are missing the point random thoughts - 18/08/2010 04:02:49 PM 1205 Views
In all fairness... Variant - 18/08/2010 09:46:26 PM 1122 Views
these guys are not babes in the woods random thoughts - 19/08/2010 12:28:24 PM 1000 Views
I never said they were. Variant - 20/08/2010 04:56:53 AM 1139 Views
Respond/Double post. *NM* Variant - 20/08/2010 04:57:25 AM 475 Views
This whole debate disgusts me. Napoleon62 - 17/08/2010 05:24:56 PM 1291 Views
I'm not going to ask why. *NM* Avendesora - 17/08/2010 06:21:13 PM 509 Views
Agreed Camilla - 17/08/2010 08:10:34 PM 1238 Views
Yep, I see a lot of ugliness in this discussion ironclad - 18/08/2010 11:42:34 AM 1080 Views
Jon Stewart made good point last night Aisha - 17/08/2010 05:34:19 PM 1173 Views
but it's the CONCEPT!!! practical effect is not the POINT of political debate!! *NM* LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 05:53:30 PM 529 Views
which is why Obama was crazy to get anywhere this issue random thoughts - 17/08/2010 06:01:44 PM 1021 Views
He's damned if he does, and damned if he doesn't Brian - 17/08/2010 06:18:16 PM 1055 Views
that really isn't true random thoughts - 17/08/2010 07:09:29 PM 1137 Views
yah he really should have just stayed mum about it LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 07:37:03 PM 1111 Views
Ye gods, I agree with you AND CELIA! Joel - 18/08/2010 01:36:21 PM 1260 Views
double post random thoughts - 17/08/2010 06:01:44 PM 1086 Views
Hatemongers gotta hate. Beqi - 17/08/2010 07:43:17 PM 1116 Views
More than anything, I see this being a sensitivity issue.... Jeordam - 17/08/2010 07:43:45 PM 1080 Views
Avendesora - 17/08/2010 07:52:07 PM 1102 Views
Right on. Jeordam - 17/08/2010 08:09:44 PM 1042 Views
yah, it sounds like the builders aren't being very thoughtful in their PR. LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 08:12:20 PM 838 Views
yah, it sounds like the builders aren't being very thoughtful in their PR. LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 08:12:21 PM 1116 Views
The crux is they can't HELP stirring "up the grief and pain of the past. " Joel - 18/08/2010 01:49:21 PM 1179 Views
are you serious? Aisha - 17/08/2010 08:01:01 PM 1185 Views
I think you got the point right there. Beqi - 17/08/2010 08:08:21 PM 1085 Views
Yes, I am... Jeordam - 17/08/2010 08:14:27 PM 1086 Views
The point is your analogy does not hold Camilla - 17/08/2010 08:19:29 PM 1077 Views
Plus snoopcester - 17/08/2010 08:26:36 PM 1140 Views
Yes. That. *NM* Camilla - 17/08/2010 08:28:14 PM 1009 Views
we should all learn pool saftey from pigeons and sparrows. LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 08:37:37 PM 1021 Views
Sicko! snoopcester - 17/08/2010 08:48:05 PM 1074 Views
Re: Yes, I am... Aisha - 17/08/2010 08:42:27 PM 1140 Views
Just to be a pain in the... StormCrow - 17/08/2010 09:10:11 PM 1112 Views
Aren't they? Jeordam - 17/08/2010 09:19:58 PM 1167 Views
You may be interested in... Legolas - 17/08/2010 09:23:48 PM 1245 Views
*nods* So I was right.... Jeordam - 17/08/2010 09:26:59 PM 976 Views
actually, it depends on the extent of the burning. LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 11:01:11 PM 1045 Views
That is probably not fair snoopcester - 17/08/2010 11:12:22 PM 1102 Views
I know! ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 03:06:25 AM 1105 Views
it's all relative. nossy - 18/08/2010 03:33:35 AM 1184 Views
Using a touch of hyperbole, perhaps? snoopcester - 18/08/2010 10:18:36 AM 1088 Views
I'm so proud of you for noticing! ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 10:48:14 AM 1161 Views
Just making sure you knew I wasn't mistaking your reply for a constructive one snoopcester - 18/08/2010 12:08:41 PM 1057 Views
I give constuctive replies where they are due ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 12:30:42 PM 1140 Views
snoopcester - 18/08/2010 12:33:57 PM 1089 Views
ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 12:41:27 PM 1150 Views
Hey Snoop... ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 12:47:13 PM 1154 Views
What the hell were these people smoking? Joel - 18/08/2010 02:14:44 PM 1270 Views
COMPLETELY unrelated point that I don't blame you for ignoring... beckstcw - 19/08/2010 04:25:31 AM 1037 Views
And yet that's very close to what MADD and SADD do. Joel - 18/08/2010 01:56:51 PM 1237 Views
you are right of course random thoughts - 17/08/2010 08:22:23 PM 1057 Views
Re: you are right of course Aisha - 17/08/2010 08:34:31 PM 1210 Views
I agree. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 08:46:07 PM 1014 Views
you could be correct but it still shows a lack of sensitivity random thoughts - 17/08/2010 09:34:46 PM 1231 Views
I don't disagree that it's a sensitivity thing LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 08:10:01 PM 1186 Views
Re: I don't disagree that it's a sensitivity thing *NM* Aisha - 17/08/2010 08:29:59 PM 482 Views
This. Avendesora - 17/08/2010 08:31:17 PM 1119 Views
So, you're saying muslims should leave nyc to show their sensitivity, right? BlackAdder - 17/08/2010 10:31:55 PM 1033 Views
so your saying you always speak in over the top rhetoric? random thoughts - 18/08/2010 03:22:20 PM 940 Views
Well explain what the difference is, then BlackAdder - 18/08/2010 07:14:46 PM 1059 Views
not really sure how to start random thoughts - 18/08/2010 08:23:34 PM 1108 Views
THANK YOU ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 01:13:16 AM 1169 Views
Take deep breaths.. Variant - 18/08/2010 05:25:16 AM 1041 Views
Typing a post didn't really require all that much effort ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 06:13:15 AM 1167 Views
There are more important things in the world to worry about Ghavrel - 18/08/2010 08:51:35 AM 1144 Views
I do get angry over other things, you know ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 10:02:02 AM 1132 Views
Pretty much, yeah. Ghavrel - 18/08/2010 09:00:09 PM 1087 Views
I disagree, anger doesn't help in this debate, and it's only going to make things worse. Variant - 18/08/2010 10:56:30 AM 1135 Views
: Joel - 18/08/2010 02:52:51 PM 1218 Views
So what, the Americans supporting this mosque are "arrogant European pricks"? Legolas - 18/08/2010 10:12:51 AM 959 Views
Kind of a stretch for you to make that assumption ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 11:31:16 AM 1124 Views
I hadn't read that other exchange yet, it made more sense after that. Legolas - 18/08/2010 12:35:18 PM 1157 Views
My only real objection is the same old one over whether respect is an entitlement. Joel - 18/08/2010 02:21:19 PM 1002 Views
A mosque was built in the Pentagon months after 9/11 Jragghen - 18/08/2010 01:23:11 AM 1166 Views
Here comes the "xenophobia card." ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 01:27:50 AM 1158 Views
Which is why there was a bombing at another mosque earlier this year Jragghen - 18/08/2010 01:31:51 AM 1089 Views
So? ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 01:39:49 AM 1201 Views
Re: A mosque was built in the Pentagon months after 9/11 BlackAdder - 18/08/2010 01:28:44 AM 1196 Views
Re: A mosque was built in the Pentagon months after 9/11 Jragghen - 18/08/2010 01:34:22 AM 1200 Views
I think a better parallel would be the new neighbors opening a pool store. Joel - 18/08/2010 01:40:42 PM 1153 Views
A guy on CNN made a really good point about this Aisha - 17/08/2010 08:46:54 PM 1200 Views
That analogy really isn't better than Jeo's, and I would think worse. *NM* Legolas - 17/08/2010 09:02:50 PM 529 Views
hmm yes but that black man hadn't killed his dog LadyLorraine - 17/08/2010 09:22:15 PM 1110 Views
Re: hmm yes but that black man hadn't killed his dog Aisha - 17/08/2010 10:32:24 PM 1260 Views
precisely. Camilla - 17/08/2010 11:20:06 PM 1003 Views
Re: precisely. Aisha - 18/08/2010 01:32:09 AM 1096 Views
Re: precisely. Camilla - 18/08/2010 09:10:33 AM 1118 Views
not surprising that a guy on CNN made that point random thoughts - 17/08/2010 09:38:16 PM 1205 Views
Yeah this whole debate is pretty pointless to be completely honest BlackAdder - 17/08/2010 10:28:13 PM 1146 Views
An interesting point Vodalus - 18/08/2010 03:44:52 AM 1139 Views
In fairness, it's extremely hard to draw that line sometimes. Legolas - 18/08/2010 10:27:24 AM 1095 Views
well we have been shot at from enough mosque to make it hard to tell at times random thoughts - 18/08/2010 08:25:58 PM 1122 Views
I think this whole debate has made American look bad. Variant - 17/08/2010 10:58:23 PM 1075 Views
So what? ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 12:28:40 AM 1124 Views
Okay, so we're no longer the land of religous tolerance. Variant - 18/08/2010 04:09:24 AM 1279 Views
Were we ever? ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 04:18:16 AM 1272 Views
I guess not. Variant - 18/08/2010 04:25:03 AM 1223 Views
Re: I guess not. ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 05:56:49 AM 1116 Views
Re: I guess not. Variant - 18/08/2010 10:43:05 AM 1101 Views
Re: I guess not. ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 12:13:37 PM 963 Views
Re: I guess not. Variant - 18/08/2010 09:30:21 PM 1028 Views
Yes, we were. Joel - 18/08/2010 02:34:39 PM 1089 Views
How does this work, do you only look bad to a bunch of ass wipes, or does anyone who thinks you look Helene - 18/08/2010 09:38:28 AM 1034 Views
Olberman's Special Comment on this one hits the nail on the head Jragghen - 18/08/2010 01:29:45 AM 1137 Views
love that the Olberman video, but Jon Stewart did an awesome job too. *NM* Aisha - 18/08/2010 01:32:59 AM 469 Views
Olbermann and Stewart are possibly the two best people alive *NM* Napoleon62 - 18/08/2010 02:39:48 AM 570 Views
they make the top of my list for people I wnat to catch an STD *NM* random thoughts - 18/08/2010 08:27:27 PM 506 Views
Let me just say... Legolas - 18/08/2010 09:20:38 PM 1109 Views
Re: Let me just say... Camilla - 18/08/2010 09:22:12 PM 1104 Views
I didn't watch that particular video, so maybe, yeah. *NM* Legolas - 18/08/2010 10:11:22 PM 539 Views
Re: I didn't watch that particular video, so maybe, yeah. Camilla - 18/08/2010 10:45:54 PM 1126 Views
O'Reilly isn't as bad as he's made out to be. (edit) Legolas - 18/08/2010 11:10:33 PM 1135 Views
I'm pretty sure I agree with you. nossy - 18/08/2010 10:48:09 PM 1035 Views
Why is it weird? Legolas - 18/08/2010 11:00:20 PM 1114 Views
dayum! thats like the ultimate insult *NM* Aisha - 19/08/2010 03:37:53 AM 487 Views
Stewart is great, but Olberman? You can't be serious. *NM* damookster - 18/08/2010 11:23:17 PM 576 Views
I love that poem Camilla - 18/08/2010 12:26:58 PM 1245 Views
I used to be so Idealistic to think this was AMERICA. StarrBecca - 18/08/2010 01:44:38 AM 1187 Views
It is America ßelals Girl - 18/08/2010 01:49:35 AM 1188 Views
the key phrase is "congress shall make no law...." moondog - 18/08/2010 02:23:53 AM 1211 Views
14th ammendment changed that *NM* Roland00 - 18/08/2010 04:51:08 AM 506 Views
14th ammendment established a state religion? moondog - 18/08/2010 08:14:11 AM 1035 Views
No, but the Equal Protection Clause extended much of the BoR to the states. Joel - 18/08/2010 02:50:31 PM 1128 Views
did you go the the Huffington Post school of law? random thoughts - 18/08/2010 03:29:14 PM 1059 Views
No, but I've spent more time around lawyers than I care to admit. Joel - 18/08/2010 03:45:36 PM 1160 Views
the defendent doesn't always get a complete picture *NM* random thoughts - 18/08/2010 04:25:36 PM 511 Views
The only time I was ever in a courtroom was as a spectator. Joel - 19/08/2010 04:33:56 PM 1136 Views
It was meant to be a short comment Roland00 - 19/08/2010 01:13:39 AM 1147 Views
we also have freedom of speech random thoughts - 18/08/2010 03:25:52 PM 1027 Views
The connection is inevitable and, I think, deliberate. Joel - 18/08/2010 01:15:41 PM 1185 Views
Hmm snoopcester - 18/08/2010 02:26:17 PM 1043 Views
Bottom line is it may be in everyones interest to DISassociate Islam from 911. Joel - 18/08/2010 02:58:17 PM 1099 Views
No, bottom line is people need to be able to keep to thoughts in their brains at any given time *NM* Camilla - 18/08/2010 03:31:03 PM 501 Views
You mean retain both "I want to promote Islam" AND "Dude, Ground Zero is right THERE! *points*" Joel - 18/08/2010 03:36:34 PM 1053 Views
No Camilla - 18/08/2010 03:43:08 PM 1119 Views
They clearly are tied to it. Joel - 18/08/2010 03:59:45 PM 1141 Views
How long ago were the Crusades? Jeordam - 18/08/2010 03:48:53 PM 1043 Views
Re: How long ago were the Crusades? Camilla - 18/08/2010 03:52:23 PM 1076 Views
So wait... Jeordam - 18/08/2010 04:09:10 PM 1012 Views
Yes, Jerodam. Christians are good. All the rest are bad. I see it now. Camilla - 18/08/2010 04:10:47 PM 1095 Views
Stop freaking out Camilla. You are such a drama queen some times. Jeordam - 18/08/2010 04:15:06 PM 1049 Views
That is not drama. That is fed up. *NM* Camilla - 18/08/2010 04:16:32 PM 570 Views
You're not the only one who is fed up.... Jeordam - 18/08/2010 04:24:27 PM 936 Views
*giggle* Camilla - 18/08/2010 04:29:03 PM 1101 Views
We don't know that.... Jeordam - 18/08/2010 05:40:25 PM 1094 Views
We do nossy - 18/08/2010 05:49:33 PM 1205 Views
Re: You're not the only one who is fed up.... Helene - 18/08/2010 04:38:04 PM 1106 Views
This may be nitpicking, but I'll do it anyway because it's a widespread misconception... Legolas - 18/08/2010 04:30:20 PM 1066 Views
THANK YOU! Aisha - 18/08/2010 06:11:52 PM 1005 Views
Re: So wait... snoopcester - 18/08/2010 04:45:53 PM 998 Views
I agreed with you at first - thought your first post was pretty insightful. nossy - 18/08/2010 05:46:02 PM 1078 Views
maybe it is actions that led to the crusades that never ended random thoughts - 19/08/2010 12:25:20 PM 942 Views
I have to agree with Jeo that that's unfair. Joel - 19/08/2010 02:47:23 PM 1269 Views
The Crusades were by Christendom as a whole*, 9-11 isn't similar for Islam by some way snoopcester - 18/08/2010 04:04:54 PM 1074 Views
Re: The Crusades were by Christendom as a whole*, 9-11 isn't similar for Islam by some way Camilla - 18/08/2010 04:11:34 PM 1063 Views
Depends whom you ask, when and where. Joel - 19/08/2010 03:06:18 PM 1025 Views
Right snoopcester - 20/08/2010 10:31:21 AM 1110 Views
Some people will always wonder about such things; we're still accused of "Crusading" today. Joel - 18/08/2010 04:07:02 PM 1069 Views
I don't disagree about the outreach, as such, but a remark... Legolas - 18/08/2010 04:37:52 PM 959 Views
It's as much a local issue as the theme park Disney wanted to build at Gettysburg. Joel - 19/08/2010 03:15:03 PM 1009 Views
Have you ever BEEN to Gettysburg? SilverWarder - 19/08/2010 05:21:18 PM 946 Views
A bit more background information Vodalus - 18/08/2010 05:30:04 PM 1227 Views
That's informative, thanks, but I'm not sure it really changes anything. Joel - 19/08/2010 03:27:05 PM 1010 Views
Step One: Manufacture controversey by means of misinformation (i.e. Mosque at Ground Zero) Vodalus - 19/08/2010 06:40:49 PM 1205 Views
To be fair snoopcester - 20/08/2010 10:38:01 AM 1153 Views
The location of this mosque is a horrid idea. Joel - 21/08/2010 05:34:58 PM 996 Views
"Think of it as a center for muslim hippies." Jragghen - 18/08/2010 09:30:55 PM 1098 Views
Can I just say... LadyLorraine - 19/08/2010 01:45:38 AM 1013 Views
i have a side bar *NM* Aisha - 19/08/2010 03:36:10 AM 429 Views
you must have a teeny screen or a bad resolution LadyLorraine - 19/08/2010 05:03:57 AM 1061 Views
I know. Avendesora - 19/08/2010 12:20:11 PM 1094 Views
Roughly 2 football fields, yes. And around a corner SilverWarder - 19/08/2010 03:17:24 PM 1081 Views
Two hundred yards is nothing. Joel - 19/08/2010 04:44:34 PM 1051 Views
Sure it is - it's two large city blocks SilverWarder - 19/08/2010 05:15:46 PM 1099 Views
It's two fairly average city blocks, and not even that some places. Joel - 21/08/2010 06:07:33 PM 1044 Views
Well you can not like it if you choose SilverWarder - 25/08/2010 03:39:49 PM 1476 Views
You keep stating that this isn't about Islam. Libby - 20/08/2010 11:06:10 AM 1128 Views
That's because it's not. Joel - 21/08/2010 06:17:29 PM 1173 Views
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