Active Users:372 Time:11/07/2025 09:59:04 PM
Very simple: Joel Send a noteboard - 24/11/2010 07:28:45 PM
Yet somehow it's illegal for a police officer to pat you down on the streets.

Nor does it grant interstate foot travel, interstate train travel, or interstate boat travel. So why are planes different?

As to the difference between planes, trains and automobiles, it's a safe bet almost no one on a dock by Lake Pontchartrain arrived from Libya a few hours ago. YOU may not be traveling to or from an overseas destination, but a lot of the people you were rubbing shoulders with at Logan today were. The first time a train or boat is deliberately detonated en route, killing thousands, you'll likely see similar security levels for those means of travel, too.

The reason the new security measures aren't a civil liberties violation, however, is even more basic: If you tell TSA you won't submit to either a pat down OR backscatter machine, they can't legally force you--you just can't get on the plane. Whether in an airport terminal or on the sidewalk, if a cop tries to pat you down with neither a warrant nor probable cause, and you refuse, he's breaking the law if he does it anyway. Of course, my (personal and other) experience has been that, even on the street, if you assert your Fourth Amendment rights when a search is requested the cop will just provide some specious rationalized probable cause and do it anyway, so I'd say TSA is the least of your worries, citizen. ;)
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So, people travelling in the US tomorrow: are you opting out? - 23/11/2010 10:45:03 PM 850 Views
Meh. - 23/11/2010 11:23:17 PM 826 Views
How did the NYTimes phrase this again... oh yes. - 23/11/2010 11:42:29 PM 842 Views
This article about "Isrealification" is interesting - 24/11/2010 12:54:59 AM 878 Views
We have that saying here, too. - 24/11/2010 01:50:03 AM 803 Views
Re: We have that saying here, too. - 24/11/2010 02:05:09 AM 732 Views
a loaded gun clip was found left on a plane by an off-duty cop just today in fact.... - 24/11/2010 05:06:15 AM 629 Views
Yeah, but he was allowed to take his gun with him - 24/11/2010 05:22:05 AM 701 Views
Security is worse than before 911? - 24/11/2010 02:03:21 PM 674 Views
You're missing the point - 24/11/2010 09:48:42 AM 716 Views
No, I got the point, I'm just not sure it's that cut and dried. - 24/11/2010 01:41:40 PM 779 Views
Wrong spot. *NM* - 24/11/2010 02:00:05 PM 276 Views
The thing about the gun just proves how good the behavioural profiling is. - 25/11/2010 09:49:55 AM 534 Views
Good point. - 25/11/2010 02:08:57 PM 913 Views
If all goes as they say it does, it sounds like a very good system *NM* - 24/11/2010 04:23:42 AM 271 Views
supposedly the israel model "does not scale" - 24/11/2010 05:14:53 AM 812 Views
Which is pretty much what I figured. - 24/11/2010 01:56:24 PM 711 Views
Sounds about right *NM* - 24/11/2010 02:26:43 PM 229 Views
No, US air traffic controllers don't go on strike. - 24/11/2010 01:37:30 AM 753 Views
Re: No, US air traffic controllers don't go on strike. - 24/11/2010 01:48:30 PM 673 Views
The long term effects are unknown? - 24/11/2010 02:23:24 PM 611 Views
They should be prepared enough to do mass pat-downs - 24/11/2010 02:00:07 AM 499 Views
If I was travelling, I would not opt out. - 24/11/2010 12:32:06 AM 636 Views
I would - 24/11/2010 01:56:56 AM 694 Views
I've got no problem with the scanners, but people are welcome to object - 24/11/2010 02:20:25 AM 955 Views
Nice idea, but . . . - 24/11/2010 05:38:11 PM 582 Views
I'm not sure, but its not a big obstacle - 24/11/2010 07:39:22 PM 693 Views
I see some sheep have replied to your post. *NM* - 24/11/2010 03:17:00 AM 248 Views
I assume you are less than fond of the situation, then? *NM* - 24/11/2010 03:25:45 AM 367 Views
You assume correctly. - 24/11/2010 03:44:23 AM 867 Views
Not saying this applies in reality... - 24/11/2010 04:25:25 AM 709 Views
If grandmas aren't getting groped at the airport... - 24/11/2010 04:38:50 AM 720 Views
just out of curiousity, do either you or litdog have any solutions? - 24/11/2010 04:59:07 AM 618 Views
Stop adding useless and invasive procedures. *NM* - 24/11/2010 05:19:23 AM 273 Views
yes that's all well and good. - 24/11/2010 05:37:01 AM 539 Views
It would be the same as it was before this nonsense. EDITED - 24/11/2010 06:18:57 AM 779 Views
if that's what your comfortable with, then. Fair enough *NM* - 24/11/2010 06:22:46 AM 252 Views
Read my edit for what I think is a bit more balanced. *NM* - 24/11/2010 06:29:11 AM 236 Views
read And yah, it sounds like you're a bit like me. - 24/11/2010 06:54:15 AM 654 Views
Re: read And yah, it sounds like you're a bit like me. - 24/11/2010 07:24:59 PM 654 Views
Become the enemy and they win, but is this is really a Civil Rights issue? - 24/11/2010 02:16:43 PM 813 Views
It doesn't grant interstate CAR travel either. - 24/11/2010 04:29:30 PM 541 Views
Very simple: - 24/11/2010 07:28:45 PM 775 Views
I fully support the protest, by the way. - 24/11/2010 03:45:43 AM 596 Views
I doubt it. - 24/11/2010 04:35:03 AM 834 Views
I'm considering doing it. - 24/11/2010 05:17:43 AM 494 Views
At least have the decency to refer to us as 'sheeple' *NM* - 24/11/2010 03:39:47 AM 243 Views
You didn't seem to be among the sheep. *NM* - 24/11/2010 03:45:06 AM 251 Views
Well, yeah. - 24/11/2010 03:51:03 AM 591 Views
Probably true! *NM* - 24/11/2010 03:51:53 AM 210 Views
Whiners - 24/11/2010 11:26:22 AM 677 Views
Well, I opted out. - 24/11/2010 02:00:49 PM 817 Views
in january im going for the pat down *NM* - 24/11/2010 05:17:32 PM 211 Views
Only morons fly in the U.S. on Thanksgiving day. *NM* - 24/11/2010 05:42:04 PM 330 Views
Very few people do. The day before Thanksgiving, however... - 24/11/2010 06:43:32 PM 555 Views
Of course. I mixed my days up. I apologize. - 26/11/2010 06:27:49 PM 666 Views
Re: Is it weird that I just want to be touched? - 24/11/2010 05:59:50 PM 624 Views
Ma'am, in your case, unless you "present as" male. *NM* - 24/11/2010 06:44:51 PM 287 Views
Here's a report on the scanners, that you might just want to get felt up. - 24/11/2010 08:56:09 PM 753 Views

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