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No, I accept the definition of the word, but reject cynical abuse of it. Joel Send a noteboard - 21/09/2011 01:37:01 AM
Sorry buddy, you don't just get to make up definitions of terms to fit your mood. I'm using it correctly, so are the authors and signers of the pledge in question, and you are now making stuff up, by your definition something can only be a pledge if the action or lack there of is something you don't want to do, and I say again, any pledge stands or falls on its own merits.

1. a solemn promise or agreement to do or refrain from doing something: a pledge of aid; a pledge not to wage war.
2. something delivered as security for the payment of a debt or fulfillment of a promise, and subject to forfeiture on failure to pay or fulfill the promise.
3. the state of being given or held as security: to put a thing in pledge.
4. Law . a. the act of delivering goods, property, etc., to another for security.
b. the resulting legal relationship.
a. the act of delivering goods, property, etc., to another for security.
b. the resulting legal relationship.
5. something given or regarded as a security.

verb (used with object)
9. to bind by or as if by a pledge: to pledge hearers to secrecy.
10. to promise solemnly: to pledge one's support.
11. to give or deposit as a pledge; pawn.
12. to stake, as one's honor.
13. to secure by a pledge; give a pledge for.

I never disputed that their pledge IS a pledge; I've consistently referred to their pledge as just that (I did put it in quotes all of ONCE, but still called it a pledge.) What I dispute is that it's a meaningful or productive pledge rather than rhetorically marketing a narrow interest as the popular will. It's a bona fide, but worthless, pledge. A pledge not to kill puppies in the well of the Senate would be just as legitimate and "principled", but far less of a barrier to deficit elimination.

Frankly, it's hard to understand Obamas delay in bowing to objections that hiking taxes on people making $250,000/yr ignores the fact that's not "rich" in the Northeast, CA and similar places, or his belated embrace of a rhetorically easy to market literal "millionaire tax hike." Except, of course, as political theater: Now the poor and middle class will see the Man of the People heroically try to end plutocracy and corporate welfare sucking the nation dry, only to be tragically defeated by pawns of the greedy; then they'll rush to the 2012 polls and re-elect him with the Congressional votes to pass his visionary policies. :rolleyes: Never mind that Romney and Perry aren't among the Congressional Republicans whose approval ratings are in the low teens, or the Senate Democratic caucus getting pounded like a Homecoming Queen at a frat kegger; even with election and healthy Democratic Congressional majorities Obama wouldn't walk his talk any more than he did last time. This isn't a policy initiative, it's more of BOTH parties preventing riots in the streets while protecting their corporate owners sacred cash cow. That's the ultimate entitlement, and the real reason the federal government owes $14 trillion dollars, mostly to people who refuse the tax money that must pay that debt.
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Ok so increasing taxes on people making 1million+ is also NOT ok with Republicans - 18/09/2011 04:43:29 PM 1185 Views
You act surprised, this has been said since the beginning, openly and repeatedly - 18/09/2011 05:48:57 PM 564 Views
is this pledge legally binding? - 18/09/2011 06:52:44 PM 500 Views
Re: is this pledge legally binding? - 18/09/2011 08:14:49 PM 684 Views
read my lips still haunts them *NM* - 18/09/2011 08:23:29 PM 427 Views
And with good reason - 18/09/2011 08:38:10 PM 659 Views
That's rather easy though, isn't it? - 18/09/2011 09:02:49 PM 696 Views
Not really - 18/09/2011 10:02:12 PM 659 Views
Many will find any pledge unreasonable. - 19/09/2011 07:01:20 AM 603 Views
Too bad for them, any pledge stands or falls on its own merits just like in real life - 19/09/2011 08:35:13 PM 614 Views
If elected I pledge not to post on the RPMB. - 20/09/2011 01:54:00 PM 742 Views
That didn't really make sense - 20/09/2011 07:26:40 PM 676 Views
Sure it does: Pledging to do what one wanted to do anyway is rhetoric, not principle. - 20/09/2011 08:04:25 PM 711 Views
Now you're debating with the definition of the word - 20/09/2011 08:22:53 PM 686 Views
No, I accept the definition of the word, but reject cynical abuse of it. - 21/09/2011 01:37:01 AM 734 Views
and if a republican becomes president, i'm sure all taxes will go up in 2013 - 20/09/2011 04:39:21 PM 744 Views
????? - 20/09/2011 07:16:00 PM 582 Views
Well, I'm glad they've at least raised the income range they were discussing. *NM* - 18/09/2011 06:10:57 PM 318 Views
not that it really matters - 18/09/2011 06:57:21 PM 722 Views
Don't confuse posturing with actual positions. - 18/09/2011 08:59:42 PM 596 Views
NO TAX INCREASES ON ANYONE, NOT ONE PENNY..... - 18/09/2011 11:15:11 PM 723 Views
George Carlin has a great routine on shit and stuff - 19/09/2011 01:32:22 AM 620 Views
So you're solution is... do nothing? *NM* - 21/09/2011 03:39:06 AM 417 Views
Simple change the law so capital gains are considered income, that will increase taxes on the rich *NM* - 19/09/2011 01:21:41 AM 286 Views
They are already. - 19/09/2011 02:42:08 AM 492 Views
Maybe I should be clearer - 19/09/2011 02:59:34 AM 657 Views
I've long felt the capital gains rate has ruined public companies - 19/09/2011 05:13:40 AM 556 Views
I agree with all that *NM* - 19/09/2011 01:00:35 PM 409 Views
There should be a set tax percentage that every US citizen pays. *NM* - 19/09/2011 01:25:13 PM 325 Views
+1 - a flat tax, with no or limited deductions is the way to go *NM* - 19/09/2011 03:16:53 PM 269 Views
Agreed - 19/09/2011 03:46:47 PM 656 Views
"Deserve's got nothin' to do with it." - 20/09/2011 02:48:19 PM 641 Views
I fully advocate massive cuts to both entitlement programs and military spending *NM* - 20/09/2011 11:53:10 PM 303 Views
I suspected that, but wasn't sure. - 25/09/2011 03:03:47 PM 730 Views
I was just going to say the same thing - 19/09/2011 08:23:39 PM 826 Views
Why not a fixed wage for all US workers; then the problem solves itself. - 20/09/2011 01:56:35 PM 531 Views
Wages are set by economic factors, not the government - 20/09/2011 07:46:18 PM 488 Views
well they wouldn't be in a worker's paradise *NM* - 20/09/2011 08:25:56 PM 282 Views
Sorry, didn't see this until now. - 27/09/2011 11:31:39 PM 731 Views
That works if you get rid of regressive taxes like the sales tax. - 21/09/2011 04:34:07 PM 539 Views
a lot of people don't seem to understand that sales tax is a regressive tax - 21/09/2011 04:44:16 PM 597 Views
It doesn't have to be - 21/09/2011 07:45:31 PM 702 Views

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