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I just think it's so... odd... that people don't realize things constantly evolve. beetnemesis Send a noteboard - 12/12/2012 05:18:11 PM
There were no unions, and people were treated horribly, and exploited. Unions are why we don't have child laborers, they're why we have safer working conditions, a 40 hour work week, and much more.

Then, fast forward, there were and are definitely some abuse and corruption in unions. So they get broken up, there is reform, etc.

Anyone who says "unions are all corrupt and must go" is as myopic as someone who claims that there are never any downsides of unions.
I amuse myself.
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Congrats to Michigan - The Newest Right to Work State! Anonymous2000 - 12/12/2012 04:59:29 AM 1478 Views
It's great that they were able to do it. Tom - 12/12/2012 02:45:39 PM 803 Views
I just think it's so... odd... that people don't realize things constantly evolve. beetnemesis - 12/12/2012 05:18:11 PM 753 Views
Isn't this a symptom of evolution? Jeordam - 12/12/2012 06:12:36 PM 792 Views
we also don't need unions to keep people on the job who are bad at it..... moondog - 12/12/2012 06:20:22 PM 785 Views
Unions are all about protecting underperforming workers and the union leadership. Anonymous2000 - 12/12/2012 06:37:41 PM 730 Views
Dude, that's insane. beetnemesis - 12/12/2012 06:58:42 PM 782 Views
That's a bit naive. And instead of evolution, I should have said "ever-changing" beetnemesis - 12/12/2012 06:55:41 PM 673 Views
No, big companies aren't all of a sudden altruistic... Jeordam - 12/12/2012 07:33:16 PM 733 Views
your three examples are of employers demanding workers do more for less moondog - 12/12/2012 07:41:12 PM 820 Views
The good and the bad of unions: Narg - 12/12/2012 10:33:46 PM 912 Views
Double post. Narg - 12/12/2012 10:33:50 PM 991 Views
Ok...employeers demanding people to do more for less. Jeordam - 13/12/2012 10:56:32 PM 733 Views
the point was that the union did not strike, the workers were prevented from working by management moondog - 13/12/2012 11:25:07 PM 761 Views
Yes, and if there was not a union... beetnemesis - 13/12/2012 04:56:57 AM 747 Views
What are the downsides of Unions? *NM* Narg - 12/12/2012 10:30:17 PM 449 Views
What are the upsides for anyone BUT unions? Cannoli - 13/12/2012 11:58:23 PM 817 Views
the answer to the political influence is hard campaign contribution limits from individuals only moondog - 14/12/2012 12:27:57 AM 704 Views
Cannoli - 19/12/2012 01:33:13 AM 932 Views
I was hoping to hear what a union supporter recognizes as flaws of unions. Narg - 14/12/2012 08:55:46 PM 836 Views
I'll tell you what my perceptions are.... Jeordam - 14/12/2012 09:30:33 PM 859 Views
one point i need to address here: moondog - 14/12/2012 10:09:24 PM 675 Views
Re: I was hoping to hear what a union supporter recognizes as flaws of unions. moondog - 14/12/2012 10:07:39 PM 626 Views
Sorry, didn't realize this was addressed to me. Sure, ok: beetnemesis - 15/12/2012 05:14:57 AM 898 Views
it's great? moondog - 12/12/2012 05:29:00 PM 756 Views
Pissed off people.... Jeordam - 12/12/2012 06:16:49 PM 680 Views
again, what industry will those people looking for work go to in michigan? moondog - 12/12/2012 06:23:47 PM 800 Views
This used to be the case, but no longer. ranagrande - 12/12/2012 06:34:01 PM 654 Views
but that's my point exactly moondog - 12/12/2012 06:40:20 PM 720 Views
Which industry are you refering to? *NM* Isaac - 12/12/2012 06:23:55 PM 375 Views
As a native Michigander, I can tell you it's great. ranagrande - 12/12/2012 06:26:53 PM 692 Views
+1 - This is going to help bring jobs to MI and benefit the auto industry. Anonymous2000 - 12/12/2012 06:33:43 PM 691 Views
unions still aren't the problem in michigan, it's reliance on a single industry as the main employer moondog - 12/12/2012 06:37:44 PM 669 Views
Michigan is one of the fastest growing areas for the tech industry. Michigan is starting to expand. everynametaken - 19/12/2012 03:28:18 AM 858 Views
So let me get this straight. Dannymac - 13/12/2012 03:54:14 PM 759 Views
Yes, it's a good thing, a very, very good thing! Anonymous2000 - 13/12/2012 05:45:43 PM 711 Views
no "right to work" in MO, MT, CO, NM, KY, WV, OH, MA, NY, DE, MN, WI, PA, OR, WA, HI, AK, MD moondog - 13/12/2012 06:56:17 PM 742 Views
Just to play devil's advocate... Tom - 13/12/2012 09:12:02 PM 714 Views
That would be an interesting study... Jeordam - 13/12/2012 09:51:21 PM 700 Views
Re: Just to play devil's advocate... moondog - 13/12/2012 09:57:07 PM 649 Views
I, for one, stipulate that you are correct. Jeordam - 13/12/2012 10:06:34 PM 741 Views
Re: I, for one, stipulate that you are correct. moondog - 13/12/2012 10:18:27 PM 714 Views
How is that wrong? Jeordam - 13/12/2012 10:52:24 PM 675 Views
it's wrong because it ultimately drives down *all* workers' pay, not just the unions moondog - 13/12/2012 11:26:00 PM 707 Views
Your argument is completely fallacious. Tom - 14/12/2012 04:17:58 AM 690 Views
A brilliant argument... Dannymac - 14/12/2012 07:23:53 AM 779 Views
You are assuming that business owners do not value "on the job" experience Orange - 14/12/2012 09:03:35 AM 823 Views
Your hypothetical doesn't stand up in the real world, however. Tom - 14/12/2012 02:46:23 PM 752 Views
the only reason unions are obsolete is because republicans don't want them supporting dems moondog - 14/12/2012 06:43:56 PM 686 Views
Unions being obsolete has almost nothing to do with internal American politics Tom - 14/12/2012 07:10:38 PM 627 Views
i would disagree, at least with respect to the spate of "right to work" laws being pushed through moondog - 14/12/2012 07:32:26 PM 703 Views
Unions aren't going to help rein in CEO pay or corporate profits. Tom - 14/12/2012 10:48:51 PM 685 Views
i'll take you one further.... moondog - 14/12/2012 11:24:26 PM 633 Views
I have suggested that before Tom - 15/12/2012 02:31:07 PM 679 Views
so you did. sorry about that! moondog - 15/12/2012 03:59:16 PM 655 Views
So to work with your thoughts (regarding the Romans) Jeordam - 14/12/2012 06:07:06 PM 681 Views
funny thing about that..... moondog - 14/12/2012 07:25:50 PM 620 Views
And so what if they are all shit jobs with substandard pay! Dannymac - 14/12/2012 07:08:41 AM 711 Views
What do you want me to say? Jeordam - 14/12/2012 05:58:45 PM 808 Views
And so the destruction of the Middle Class continues. *NM* Dannymac - 13/12/2012 03:43:36 PM 360 Views
The unions already destroyed the middle class..... Anonymous2000 - 13/12/2012 05:46:56 PM 727 Views
Do you really not understand why unions existed in the first place? Dannymac - 14/12/2012 06:55:27 AM 651 Views
Why they first existed is not in issue. It is if they STILL serve a useful or detrimental purpose. HyogaRott - 14/12/2012 03:00:48 PM 714 Views
Yeah, moron! What is wrong with you, that you do not blindly accept his underlying premise? Cannoli - 19/12/2012 01:35:37 AM 1039 Views
Damn, I agree with Anonymous2000. callandor1000 - 14/12/2012 04:29:36 AM 748 Views
This must be a trying time for you. Dannymac - 14/12/2012 07:06:56 AM 700 Views
Callandor sees the light, perhaps it's time for you as well! *NM* Anonymous2000 - 14/12/2012 02:08:47 PM 324 Views
HOW they are doing it..is bullshit Amyrlin - 13/12/2012 06:33:09 PM 858 Views
How? Residents of MI elected a Republican legislature and Governor..... Anonymous2000 - 13/12/2012 09:25:43 PM 673 Views
You have the right to work, not the right to vote in an election as you see fit and keep your job. *NM* heartbreak - 15/12/2012 03:23:13 AM 414 Views
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