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How is that wrong? Jeordam Send a noteboard - 13/12/2012 10:52:24 PM
"Unions cannot collect dues at union shops." Isn't it more that they cannot force someone to pay it (or even be a member of the union)?

How is this wrong? And here's the best part of it...and it kind of proves my point. It is not the union's shop. It is the company's shop. They are the ones who are liable for everything. It is their property, their equipment, and ultimately their business. If an individual wants to be part of the union, to have them be their advocate, then they pay the dues and get the benefits thereof.

If the individual wants to venture on in the workplace without that advocate, then good luck.

How is any of that wrong? There are OSHA laws, discrimination laws, and pay rate laws. There is a vast network of litigation possibilities for unfair workplace treatment. How is a union relevant in this day and age? What do they offer that the above mentioned laws & an individuals merit do not account for?

~Jeordam
ex-Admin at wotmania (all things wot & art galleries)
Saving the Princess, Humanity, or the World-Entire since 1985
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Congrats to Michigan - The Newest Right to Work State! Anonymous2000 - 12/12/2012 04:59:29 AM 1521 Views
It's great that they were able to do it. Tom - 12/12/2012 02:45:39 PM 826 Views
I just think it's so... odd... that people don't realize things constantly evolve. beetnemesis - 12/12/2012 05:18:11 PM 772 Views
Isn't this a symptom of evolution? Jeordam - 12/12/2012 06:12:36 PM 812 Views
we also don't need unions to keep people on the job who are bad at it..... moondog - 12/12/2012 06:20:22 PM 803 Views
Unions are all about protecting underperforming workers and the union leadership. Anonymous2000 - 12/12/2012 06:37:41 PM 750 Views
Dude, that's insane. beetnemesis - 12/12/2012 06:58:42 PM 803 Views
That's a bit naive. And instead of evolution, I should have said "ever-changing" beetnemesis - 12/12/2012 06:55:41 PM 693 Views
No, big companies aren't all of a sudden altruistic... Jeordam - 12/12/2012 07:33:16 PM 752 Views
your three examples are of employers demanding workers do more for less moondog - 12/12/2012 07:41:12 PM 844 Views
The good and the bad of unions: Narg - 12/12/2012 10:33:46 PM 931 Views
Double post. Narg - 12/12/2012 10:33:50 PM 1018 Views
Ok...employeers demanding people to do more for less. Jeordam - 13/12/2012 10:56:32 PM 753 Views
the point was that the union did not strike, the workers were prevented from working by management moondog - 13/12/2012 11:25:07 PM 794 Views
Yes, and if there was not a union... beetnemesis - 13/12/2012 04:56:57 AM 772 Views
What are the downsides of Unions? *NM* Narg - 12/12/2012 10:30:17 PM 458 Views
What are the upsides for anyone BUT unions? Cannoli - 13/12/2012 11:58:23 PM 836 Views
the answer to the political influence is hard campaign contribution limits from individuals only moondog - 14/12/2012 12:27:57 AM 725 Views
Cannoli - 19/12/2012 01:33:13 AM 952 Views
I was hoping to hear what a union supporter recognizes as flaws of unions. Narg - 14/12/2012 08:55:46 PM 858 Views
I'll tell you what my perceptions are.... Jeordam - 14/12/2012 09:30:33 PM 886 Views
one point i need to address here: moondog - 14/12/2012 10:09:24 PM 693 Views
Re: I was hoping to hear what a union supporter recognizes as flaws of unions. moondog - 14/12/2012 10:07:39 PM 659 Views
Sorry, didn't realize this was addressed to me. Sure, ok: beetnemesis - 15/12/2012 05:14:57 AM 917 Views
it's great? moondog - 12/12/2012 05:29:00 PM 775 Views
Pissed off people.... Jeordam - 12/12/2012 06:16:49 PM 704 Views
again, what industry will those people looking for work go to in michigan? moondog - 12/12/2012 06:23:47 PM 821 Views
This used to be the case, but no longer. ranagrande - 12/12/2012 06:34:01 PM 674 Views
but that's my point exactly moondog - 12/12/2012 06:40:20 PM 742 Views
Which industry are you refering to? *NM* Isaac - 12/12/2012 06:23:55 PM 386 Views
As a native Michigander, I can tell you it's great. ranagrande - 12/12/2012 06:26:53 PM 711 Views
+1 - This is going to help bring jobs to MI and benefit the auto industry. Anonymous2000 - 12/12/2012 06:33:43 PM 709 Views
unions still aren't the problem in michigan, it's reliance on a single industry as the main employer moondog - 12/12/2012 06:37:44 PM 687 Views
Michigan is one of the fastest growing areas for the tech industry. Michigan is starting to expand. everynametaken - 19/12/2012 03:28:18 AM 878 Views
So let me get this straight. Dannymac - 13/12/2012 03:54:14 PM 780 Views
Yes, it's a good thing, a very, very good thing! Anonymous2000 - 13/12/2012 05:45:43 PM 732 Views
no "right to work" in MO, MT, CO, NM, KY, WV, OH, MA, NY, DE, MN, WI, PA, OR, WA, HI, AK, MD moondog - 13/12/2012 06:56:17 PM 762 Views
Just to play devil's advocate... Tom - 13/12/2012 09:12:02 PM 731 Views
That would be an interesting study... Jeordam - 13/12/2012 09:51:21 PM 718 Views
Re: Just to play devil's advocate... moondog - 13/12/2012 09:57:07 PM 678 Views
I, for one, stipulate that you are correct. Jeordam - 13/12/2012 10:06:34 PM 763 Views
Re: I, for one, stipulate that you are correct. moondog - 13/12/2012 10:18:27 PM 744 Views
How is that wrong? Jeordam - 13/12/2012 10:52:24 PM 700 Views
it's wrong because it ultimately drives down *all* workers' pay, not just the unions moondog - 13/12/2012 11:26:00 PM 727 Views
Your argument is completely fallacious. Tom - 14/12/2012 04:17:58 AM 717 Views
A brilliant argument... Dannymac - 14/12/2012 07:23:53 AM 801 Views
You are assuming that business owners do not value "on the job" experience Orange - 14/12/2012 09:03:35 AM 857 Views
Your hypothetical doesn't stand up in the real world, however. Tom - 14/12/2012 02:46:23 PM 784 Views
the only reason unions are obsolete is because republicans don't want them supporting dems moondog - 14/12/2012 06:43:56 PM 709 Views
Unions being obsolete has almost nothing to do with internal American politics Tom - 14/12/2012 07:10:38 PM 647 Views
i would disagree, at least with respect to the spate of "right to work" laws being pushed through moondog - 14/12/2012 07:32:26 PM 724 Views
Unions aren't going to help rein in CEO pay or corporate profits. Tom - 14/12/2012 10:48:51 PM 707 Views
i'll take you one further.... moondog - 14/12/2012 11:24:26 PM 669 Views
I have suggested that before Tom - 15/12/2012 02:31:07 PM 696 Views
so you did. sorry about that! moondog - 15/12/2012 03:59:16 PM 678 Views
So to work with your thoughts (regarding the Romans) Jeordam - 14/12/2012 06:07:06 PM 704 Views
funny thing about that..... moondog - 14/12/2012 07:25:50 PM 660 Views
And so what if they are all shit jobs with substandard pay! Dannymac - 14/12/2012 07:08:41 AM 728 Views
What do you want me to say? Jeordam - 14/12/2012 05:58:45 PM 829 Views
And so the destruction of the Middle Class continues. *NM* Dannymac - 13/12/2012 03:43:36 PM 369 Views
The unions already destroyed the middle class..... Anonymous2000 - 13/12/2012 05:46:56 PM 748 Views
Do you really not understand why unions existed in the first place? Dannymac - 14/12/2012 06:55:27 AM 672 Views
Why they first existed is not in issue. It is if they STILL serve a useful or detrimental purpose. HyogaRott - 14/12/2012 03:00:48 PM 734 Views
Yeah, moron! What is wrong with you, that you do not blindly accept his underlying premise? Cannoli - 19/12/2012 01:35:37 AM 1057 Views
Damn, I agree with Anonymous2000. callandor1000 - 14/12/2012 04:29:36 AM 768 Views
This must be a trying time for you. Dannymac - 14/12/2012 07:06:56 AM 725 Views
Callandor sees the light, perhaps it's time for you as well! *NM* Anonymous2000 - 14/12/2012 02:08:47 PM 332 Views
HOW they are doing it..is bullshit Amyrlin - 13/12/2012 06:33:09 PM 878 Views
How? Residents of MI elected a Republican legislature and Governor..... Anonymous2000 - 13/12/2012 09:25:43 PM 691 Views
You have the right to work, not the right to vote in an election as you see fit and keep your job. *NM* heartbreak - 15/12/2012 03:23:13 AM 423 Views
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