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Unions being obsolete has almost nothing to do with internal American politics Tom Send a noteboard - 14/12/2012 07:10:38 PM
I know lots of people who wish they weren't in unions, and lots of people who were happy to be in right to work states, like my mother, who refused to join the teachers' union. Let people make up their own minds, because you know what? If a union is really a benefit, they won't have to force people to join and they won't have to mandatorily remove dues from peoples' paychecks.
Political correctness is the pettiest form of casuistry.

ἡ δὲ κἀκ τριῶν τρυπημάτων ἐργαζομένη ἐνεκάλει τῇ φύσει, δυσφορουμένη, ὅτι δὴ μὴ καὶ τοὺς τιτθοὺς αὐτῇ εὐρύτερον ἢ νῦν εἰσι τρυπώη, ὅπως καὶ ἄλλην ἐνταῦθα μίξιν ἐπιτεχνᾶσθαι δυνατὴ εἴη. – Procopius

Ummaka qinnassa nīk!

*MySmiley*
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Congrats to Michigan - The Newest Right to Work State! Anonymous2000 - 12/12/2012 04:59:29 AM 1624 Views
It's great that they were able to do it. Tom - 12/12/2012 02:45:39 PM 920 Views
I just think it's so... odd... that people don't realize things constantly evolve. beetnemesis - 12/12/2012 05:18:11 PM 868 Views
Isn't this a symptom of evolution? Jeordam - 12/12/2012 06:12:36 PM 914 Views
we also don't need unions to keep people on the job who are bad at it..... moondog - 12/12/2012 06:20:22 PM 892 Views
Unions are all about protecting underperforming workers and the union leadership. Anonymous2000 - 12/12/2012 06:37:41 PM 852 Views
Dude, that's insane. beetnemesis - 12/12/2012 06:58:42 PM 903 Views
That's a bit naive. And instead of evolution, I should have said "ever-changing" beetnemesis - 12/12/2012 06:55:41 PM 792 Views
No, big companies aren't all of a sudden altruistic... Jeordam - 12/12/2012 07:33:16 PM 849 Views
your three examples are of employers demanding workers do more for less moondog - 12/12/2012 07:41:12 PM 938 Views
The good and the bad of unions: Narg - 12/12/2012 10:33:46 PM 1046 Views
Double post. Narg - 12/12/2012 10:33:50 PM 1128 Views
Ok...employeers demanding people to do more for less. Jeordam - 13/12/2012 10:56:32 PM 850 Views
the point was that the union did not strike, the workers were prevented from working by management moondog - 13/12/2012 11:25:07 PM 919 Views
Yes, and if there was not a union... beetnemesis - 13/12/2012 04:56:57 AM 866 Views
What are the downsides of Unions? *NM* Narg - 12/12/2012 10:30:17 PM 499 Views
What are the upsides for anyone BUT unions? Cannoli - 13/12/2012 11:58:23 PM 919 Views
the answer to the political influence is hard campaign contribution limits from individuals only moondog - 14/12/2012 12:27:57 AM 821 Views
Cannoli - 19/12/2012 01:33:13 AM 1047 Views
I was hoping to hear what a union supporter recognizes as flaws of unions. Narg - 14/12/2012 08:55:46 PM 950 Views
I'll tell you what my perceptions are.... Jeordam - 14/12/2012 09:30:33 PM 998 Views
one point i need to address here: moondog - 14/12/2012 10:09:24 PM 795 Views
Re: I was hoping to hear what a union supporter recognizes as flaws of unions. moondog - 14/12/2012 10:07:39 PM 778 Views
Sorry, didn't realize this was addressed to me. Sure, ok: beetnemesis - 15/12/2012 05:14:57 AM 1017 Views
it's great? moondog - 12/12/2012 05:29:00 PM 865 Views
Pissed off people.... Jeordam - 12/12/2012 06:16:49 PM 796 Views
again, what industry will those people looking for work go to in michigan? moondog - 12/12/2012 06:23:47 PM 916 Views
This used to be the case, but no longer. ranagrande - 12/12/2012 06:34:01 PM 772 Views
but that's my point exactly moondog - 12/12/2012 06:40:20 PM 837 Views
Which industry are you refering to? *NM* Isaac - 12/12/2012 06:23:55 PM 425 Views
As a native Michigander, I can tell you it's great. ranagrande - 12/12/2012 06:26:53 PM 802 Views
+1 - This is going to help bring jobs to MI and benefit the auto industry. Anonymous2000 - 12/12/2012 06:33:43 PM 843 Views
unions still aren't the problem in michigan, it's reliance on a single industry as the main employer moondog - 12/12/2012 06:37:44 PM 782 Views
Michigan is one of the fastest growing areas for the tech industry. Michigan is starting to expand. everynametaken - 19/12/2012 03:28:18 AM 980 Views
So let me get this straight. Dannymac - 13/12/2012 03:54:14 PM 876 Views
Yes, it's a good thing, a very, very good thing! Anonymous2000 - 13/12/2012 05:45:43 PM 835 Views
no "right to work" in MO, MT, CO, NM, KY, WV, OH, MA, NY, DE, MN, WI, PA, OR, WA, HI, AK, MD moondog - 13/12/2012 06:56:17 PM 863 Views
Just to play devil's advocate... Tom - 13/12/2012 09:12:02 PM 831 Views
That would be an interesting study... Jeordam - 13/12/2012 09:51:21 PM 819 Views
Re: Just to play devil's advocate... moondog - 13/12/2012 09:57:07 PM 779 Views
I, for one, stipulate that you are correct. Jeordam - 13/12/2012 10:06:34 PM 862 Views
Re: I, for one, stipulate that you are correct. moondog - 13/12/2012 10:18:27 PM 858 Views
How is that wrong? Jeordam - 13/12/2012 10:52:24 PM 798 Views
it's wrong because it ultimately drives down *all* workers' pay, not just the unions moondog - 13/12/2012 11:26:00 PM 827 Views
Your argument is completely fallacious. Tom - 14/12/2012 04:17:58 AM 821 Views
A brilliant argument... Dannymac - 14/12/2012 07:23:53 AM 887 Views
You are assuming that business owners do not value "on the job" experience Orange - 14/12/2012 09:03:35 AM 969 Views
Your hypothetical doesn't stand up in the real world, however. Tom - 14/12/2012 02:46:23 PM 874 Views
the only reason unions are obsolete is because republicans don't want them supporting dems moondog - 14/12/2012 06:43:56 PM 802 Views
Unions being obsolete has almost nothing to do with internal American politics Tom - 14/12/2012 07:10:38 PM 737 Views
i would disagree, at least with respect to the spate of "right to work" laws being pushed through moondog - 14/12/2012 07:32:26 PM 817 Views
Unions aren't going to help rein in CEO pay or corporate profits. Tom - 14/12/2012 10:48:51 PM 794 Views
i'll take you one further.... moondog - 14/12/2012 11:24:26 PM 769 Views
I have suggested that before Tom - 15/12/2012 02:31:07 PM 799 Views
so you did. sorry about that! moondog - 15/12/2012 03:59:16 PM 773 Views
So to work with your thoughts (regarding the Romans) Jeordam - 14/12/2012 06:07:06 PM 799 Views
funny thing about that..... moondog - 14/12/2012 07:25:50 PM 751 Views
And so what if they are all shit jobs with substandard pay! Dannymac - 14/12/2012 07:08:41 AM 833 Views
What do you want me to say? Jeordam - 14/12/2012 05:58:45 PM 917 Views
And so the destruction of the Middle Class continues. *NM* Dannymac - 13/12/2012 03:43:36 PM 409 Views
The unions already destroyed the middle class..... Anonymous2000 - 13/12/2012 05:46:56 PM 834 Views
Do you really not understand why unions existed in the first place? Dannymac - 14/12/2012 06:55:27 AM 765 Views
Why they first existed is not in issue. It is if they STILL serve a useful or detrimental purpose. HyogaRott - 14/12/2012 03:00:48 PM 831 Views
Yeah, moron! What is wrong with you, that you do not blindly accept his underlying premise? Cannoli - 19/12/2012 01:35:37 AM 1159 Views
Damn, I agree with Anonymous2000. callandor1000 - 14/12/2012 04:29:36 AM 860 Views
This must be a trying time for you. Dannymac - 14/12/2012 07:06:56 AM 814 Views
Callandor sees the light, perhaps it's time for you as well! *NM* Anonymous2000 - 14/12/2012 02:08:47 PM 375 Views
HOW they are doing it..is bullshit Amyrlin - 13/12/2012 06:33:09 PM 982 Views
How? Residents of MI elected a Republican legislature and Governor..... Anonymous2000 - 13/12/2012 09:25:43 PM 819 Views
You have the right to work, not the right to vote in an election as you see fit and keep your job. *NM* heartbreak - 15/12/2012 03:23:13 AM 462 Views
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