it's not entirely a matter of cost, although that factors into it.
moondog Send a noteboard - 23/12/2012 01:01:50 AM
cost would be the main one. I don't know how many schools there are in the US, but having at least one armed police officer at every one? You're talking billions at the very least.
and we have to pay them something on the order of $40k per year or else it will be hard to find someone to do the job. and probably give them benefits.... etc etc. billions is probably about right.
How much would it cost to implement a national program to screen, train and certify all gun owners? How much would it cost to confiscate all guns? There is nearly a 1:1 ratio of guns to people in America; controlling access to all of them will be expensive HOWEVER we do it. That does not deter gun control supporters from advocating other expensive approaches, so why is it suddenly so objectionable?
I am sorry, but gun control advocates raising cost objections to a reasonable NRA proposal that would significantly increase public safety is no more credible than the NRA raising cost objections to screening, training and certification requirements. Neither them objects to doing it because they do not wish to pay for it: They object to paying for it because they do not wish to do it. Meanwhile, innocent people continue being shot because one side wants to ban all guns, the other wants all guns available on demand, and 90% of the country rightly refuses to support either irrational policy.
there is no case at all of any mass shooting where an armed guard either prevented the shooting or reduced the number of casualties. the cost problem comes in because we are talking about a lot of school districts who would rather hire two more teachers but instead they have to hire armed guards and make sure they get their proper training, and then HOPE that if they are needed that they don't make things worse for everyone. if we're going to spend tax dollars on curbing gun violence, i would rather tax dollars go towards training and registration rather than a non-sensical idea which has not been proven to be effective.
"The RIAA has shown a certain disregard for the creative people of the industry in their eagerness to protect the revenues of the record companies." -- Frank Zappa
"That's the trouble with political jokes in this country... they get elected!" -- Dave Lippman
"That's the trouble with political jokes in this country... they get elected!" -- Dave Lippman
the NRA shows it is an asylum overrun by lunatics
- 22/12/2012 04:40:26 PM
1444 Views
I do not see why calling for armed cops at schools is an unreasonable response.
- 22/12/2012 04:53:06 PM
973 Views
I can think of two reasons off the top of my head
- 22/12/2012 05:38:19 PM
977 Views
If the schools that the children of our elected representatives attend are gaurded, so should mine.
- 26/12/2012 03:00:35 PM
769 Views
If someone is shooting at you having a gun to shoot back seems like a good idea
- 26/12/2012 06:10:07 PM
813 Views
The effectiveness issue aside
- 22/12/2012 06:13:30 PM
858 Views
Re: The effectiveness issue aside
- 22/12/2012 06:59:36 PM
933 Views
If you think it would solve the debate then probably
- 22/12/2012 07:09:42 PM
910 Views
Nothing will ever truly end the debate, but we can greatly reduce or end its justification.
- 22/12/2012 08:03:39 PM
874 Views
If it's shown to work
- 23/12/2012 12:25:38 AM
963 Views
Of the many school shootings in recent years, I am aware of none where armed cops were present.
- 23/12/2012 12:47:32 AM
890 Views
columbine had two armed guards on the day of the shooting. they were both immediately fired upon...
- 23/12/2012 12:49:30 AM
821 Views
I have never seen any mention of them among the injured or dead (or at all.)
- 23/12/2012 01:09:38 AM
971 Views
you should try harder
- 23/12/2012 01:15:34 AM
1008 Views
"a motorcycle patrolman who was near the school writing a speeding ticket" is not stationed there.
- 23/12/2012 01:34:50 AM
939 Views
he still didn't stop the shooting, whether he was there before or after it started
- 23/12/2012 01:49:24 AM
946 Views
No kidding; how could he stop the shooting before it started if he was not there?
- 23/12/2012 02:16:59 AM
802 Views
A fuller account of Gardner
- 23/12/2012 10:27:24 AM
1043 Views
Nice link.
- 23/12/2012 02:27:30 PM
808 Views
Re: Nice link.
- 23/12/2012 03:15:24 PM
824 Views
Inexplicably, Ft. Hood was a gun free zone (guess no one told the shooter.)
- 26/12/2012 06:12:42 PM
826 Views
Re: Nice link.
- 23/12/2012 04:21:27 PM
821 Views
Gardner:If you’re going to put a police officer in a school, make sure his focus stays on the school
- 26/12/2012 06:40:41 PM
879 Views
The children are what matter, not the school. Surely this isn't something you disagree on?
- 29/12/2012 02:15:12 PM
898 Views
As usual Moondog, you are missing a BUNCH of facts on this one (links inside)
- 26/12/2012 07:51:29 PM
942 Views
at last count, over 99,000 schools in the US
- 23/12/2012 12:45:30 AM
904 Views
What is public safety worth to you?
- 23/12/2012 12:54:04 AM
830 Views
it's not entirely a matter of cost, although that factors into it.
- 23/12/2012 01:01:50 AM
745 Views
There are many cases where armed cops ended mass shootings.
- 23/12/2012 01:28:25 AM
761 Views
there are none where an armed guard placed there *before* the shooting had any effect
- 23/12/2012 01:36:42 AM
897 Views
Kind of a Catch-22; if they PREVENT shootings, shootings can only occur in their absence.
- 23/12/2012 01:52:03 AM
938 Views
ok, here is my last word on the subject
- 23/12/2012 02:06:49 AM
877 Views
9 people injured vs. 20 people dead.
- 23/12/2012 02:34:00 AM
804 Views
it is still "more guns makes us safer" which has yet to prevent a single massacre in this country
- 23/12/2012 02:41:56 PM
910 Views
Peter Odighizuwa comes to mind, that's also horrible logic
- 23/12/2012 08:27:46 PM
815 Views
Care to prove that negative? The burden to do so is on you as the person who made the assertion.
- 26/12/2012 06:47:07 PM
793 Views
It doesn't have to be a full time gaurd standing looking dangerous.
- 26/12/2012 06:12:14 PM
898 Views
Re: the NRA shows it is an asylum overrun by lunatics
- 22/12/2012 06:36:32 PM
1057 Views
I believe it is fairly common in junior and high schools today, but not elementary schools.
- 22/12/2012 07:12:32 PM
827 Views
This entire post is completely irrelevant.
- 22/12/2012 07:27:45 PM
921 Views
Those who want univeral prohibition/access are equally fringe minorities.
- 22/12/2012 08:18:00 PM
864 Views
there is no Left or Right on this issue, there is only Sane and Insane
- 23/12/2012 12:59:08 AM
915 Views
also: it's insulting to tell parents their kids would be alive if only more guns were around
- 23/12/2012 01:30:53 AM
839 Views
People die from all sort of causes
- 22/12/2012 07:27:53 PM
881 Views
Cars require training, certification and licensing, too; why should guns not?
- 22/12/2012 08:25:43 PM
1004 Views
Do bombs require certification?
- 22/12/2012 09:21:25 PM
1117 Views
No, they are pretty much illegal for the general public under all conditions.
- 22/12/2012 09:35:35 PM
783 Views
i say this with all due respect -- eat a bag of dicks
- 23/12/2012 01:04:08 AM
885 Views
That was pretty damn respectful under the circumstances.
- 23/12/2012 01:10:04 AM
841 Views
The lack of intellect displayed here is to be expected
- 23/12/2012 04:01:32 AM
865 Views
so according to you we should just make life illegal since everyone is going to die from something..
- 23/12/2012 07:25:05 AM
800 Views
Obviously you didn't put pay attention
- 23/12/2012 01:40:17 PM
828 Views
no, you said "fuck it because people die anyway". there is a big difference
- 23/12/2012 02:46:46 PM
767 Views
Dicks and stones
- 23/12/2012 03:54:25 AM
1028 Views
cars and guns kill roughly the same number of people every year -- around 30,000 give or take
- 23/12/2012 01:02:44 AM
847 Views
But over half of gun deaths are suicide.....so cars are much more dangerous to society. *NM*
- 23/12/2012 05:35:45 AM
360 Views
Every year is iffy there, it dropped off the last two, was 40k-50k plus for cars since 1962
- 23/12/2012 11:55:50 AM
809 Views
except that cars are legislated to be safer every year, guns aren't.
- 23/12/2012 03:01:36 PM
860 Views
Guns are for killing, cars are for transport, cars aren't any safer now against use for homicide
- 23/12/2012 08:22:13 PM
804 Views
but if we are trying to minimize the number of deaths, then more MUST be done for gun laws
- 24/12/2012 03:33:31 AM
768 Views
More must be done to minimize, not necessarily with greater regulation
- 24/12/2012 04:27:04 AM
900 Views
Re: More must be done to minimize, not necessarily with greater regulation
- 25/12/2012 04:49:54 PM
839 Views
Re: More must be done to minimize, not necessarily with greater regulation
- 25/12/2012 08:41:53 PM
819 Views
Here is some interesting data.....knives are as dangerous as "non-handguns"
- 23/12/2012 05:45:08 AM
888 Views
I hope you don't mind me taking this opportunity to plug my new book, "How to Cook with Guns" *NM*
- 23/12/2012 03:04:06 PM
461 Views
there was a school mass stabbing in china the same day as sandy hook
- 23/12/2012 03:18:00 PM
838 Views
I am equally happy that the criminal was incompetant, but that does not diminish their lethality
- 27/12/2012 10:45:33 PM
912 Views
I'm not sure it's about guns.
- 23/12/2012 06:08:50 PM
818 Views
IMO it is about the media attention focuised on the perpetrator. Their name becomes history. *NM*
- 27/12/2012 10:47:15 PM
421 Views